Hello everyone and sorry in advance if this gets a bit long. (Please note I don't want to adjust difficulty as I've beat impossible once already and feel comfortable enough playing it. I just want some hints on how to improve me game play.)



I'm having a little bit of a hard time once mid game roles around playing as the Vaulters. This is usually the point where I start really falling behind.



I've been playing impossible difficulty, 6 player map, and everything default. I also played my first multiplayer game and pretty much the same thing happened there. Early game I do well, usually top score or in the top 3. I almost always start with Mill Foundry, then seed storage. Normally aiming to expand right around turn 20 unless I see a very juicy expansion spot in which case I rush the settler.



After turn 20 I'm looking at either getting the first tier weapons upgrade to conquer my 3rd settlement 10-15 turns later or skip it and expand with the settler a little later. I almost always skip the parley research though, because I figure if its not the first or second research item might as well not use it (I suspect this might be a problem).



Up to this point is where I feel safe and haven't fallen behind too much on the scoreboard. But at this point is where it starts to fall apart. This is the problem as I see it. If I start expanding aggressively I make too many enemies and I can't secure my provinces. If I don't expand I start falling behind at an even faster pace. With both options my main issue is strategic resources. I seem to never have enough to equip my army and boast. If I've planned ahead well enough with my expansion and saved up enough, and built accordingly, then I usually don't have the dust necessary to upgrade my units.



The conclusion that I came up with is that you need to expand with the Vaulters (please correct me if I'm wrong). But his is a bit counter to how I feel comfortable playing in that I prefer going tall rather then wide. I just assumed if I kept my research up, and had an elite army, I could take advantage of teleport and get that army where I need it. But what's been happening is I fall so far behind that my elite army (even when upgraded with best gear available to me) is simply inferior.



So any hints? Can anyone suggest what I'm doing wrong? I have 75 hours in on the game, and feel pretty confident I understand most of the game mechanics and almost always do very well in battle (unless I'm hopelessly outclassed).



My main two questions are;



1: Should I get the parley tech? If yes when should I get it? And if I don't want to get it as my first 3 techs, is it still worth getting?



2: Are the Vaulters a viable choice for a small (tall), defensive (turtling) faction? If not what are some other options? (no Cultists)



Thank

Broken lords make a good faction for tall empires but you really can use anything.



I personally research mill parley seed.



One thing you can do is to equip half your mariness with glasteel and the others with titanium. Then alternate boost. Making minor faction units will save resources as well.



Vaulters are best played wide but I think it is best to expand when you can afford too. A new city requires more resources to activate the boost so it is not do good as it seems

Forgot to say I skip tier weapons. Tier 2 weapons will be one of the first research for tier 2. By then I will have saved resources

blackForest wrote:
Broken lords make a good faction for tall empires but you really can use anything.



I personally research mill parley seed.



One thing you can do is to equip half your mariness with glasteel and the others with titanium. Then alternate boost. Making minor faction units will save resources as well.



Vaulters are best played wide but I think it is best to expand when you can afford too. A new city requires more resources to activate the boost so it is not do good as it seems

You know I was actually thinking of that the other day. Making two armies, and using the army that has the boost on. Great suggestion!

I'm not sure a small defensive strategy is viable on higher difficulties as any faction; the game mechanics seem to be set up so that bigger is pretty much always better. Even Cultists want to expand, they just do it by converting more villages rather than building more cities.



I've won with the Vaulters on "endless" difficulty, but I expanded to 4 cities by turn 30, then ran out of space to build cities and started in on military conquest somewhere around turn 50 because I didn't see any way I was going to win with only 4 cities if I played defensively.



The main way to be able to spend more strategic resources on your armies seems to be to have more cities collecting them, but I also generally avoid spending strategic resources on armor (only weapons and accessories) because the additional stats you get from spending strategics on armor seem much smaller (and also cost more industry). My army in the aforementioned game was basically marines with t2 titanium bows and damage trinkets and iron/dust armor based on my era (eventually switched the bows to hyperium late in the game).

I am still busy with my faction guide, having only an Ardent Mages and Wild Walkers playthrough left on the release version.



Anyway, having played Vaulters by far the most, I will add my two cents to what I've picked up so far.



Early game



Settle on a spot with as much science tiles as possible. One of your traits gives +1 to each tile with science, and this bonus is really the most effective in the early game (your first three settlements).



Your initial research order is probably the best as :



1. Mill Foundry

2. Seed Storage

3. Empire mint/Sewer System



However, as probably only the Vaulters and Ardent Mages, depending on your initial location, you can actually go for a non-building tech as your first tech. If you can research your first tech in three rounds after settling, and your Founders Memorial will finish a bit later (~6 or more turns) you can grab Langauge Square first, or otherwise after Mill Foundry. Language square is a must - the quest rewards can help early game (either through a weapon/armor tech, or usable luxuries), and it makes for much faster early expansion (more on that a bit later).



Vaulters do not make the best governors (although you might want at least one for defense), but they make great early game army leaders, so I use my given hero as a leader. Split your army in two, with one marine on his own and the other paired with your hero. Scout around and get some quests from minor factions. However, once you have to start fighting for a quest, pair your marines again and use this army as the basis for your first stack. (You can build another scout later to continue exploration). Note: Some quests are better of to fail, such as the "Too many chiefs" quest. Just destroy the village in these instances.



Depending on how close you are to a neighbour, and who it is, you might want to direct your scouting and settling in a specific direction. Avoiding contact will delay war for as long as possible, but you can also use your starting army to abuse the enemy with some early harrassing, such as killing of their starting army (if it is an infantry-based army, such as the Broken Lords) or killing any settlers who try to gun for your regions. If you try to attack a settler, split your army into two in order to get two action points - that way you can insta-kill a settler, as they will retreat both times.



I tend to build a settler right after the mill foundry (and before seed storage, otherwise seed storage is a bit of a waste for a few turns), unless there are no winning regions nearby. In general, you want to look at the following for a second region:



1. Lots of science!

2. Some great anomalies (if you see a golden tree, settle it immediately!

3. Two or three minor villiages

4. Lots of strategic resources



The minor villages are quite important, and this is why getting Parley early is NB. If you can pacify a region with three minor villages early (before or directly after you settle), you will gain a whopping three extra pop, which will sky rocket the new city's development! Otherwise, you have to rebuild the villages, and then the benefit is slightly less good.



Also try to build strategic resources as soon as possible, so that you can start harvesting these to build a stockpile. Try to activate a strategic booster before the first winter starts, or otherwise before the second winter, as you will increase your production of that resource a lot! It doesn't matter too much which one it is (titanium or glassteel), only whichever one you can activate first. Later on, you can pick and choose what you want to activate.



Finally, in terms of empire plan, I sometimes skip the first round, because the benefit is not that great, and rather save my influence for the next round. However, if you have some influence, and you have a big science start, go for Science and Industry tier 1.



By the end of the early game, you should have 3-4 cities and a decent starting army. Try to save your dust in order to buy governors as soon as possible, rather than buying anything out. Also, try to gun for good territories if they are adjacent to the enemy; otherwise, expand in a direction away from your enemies, or try to 'secure' regions which you can colonize later. If necessary, close borders with any nearby enemy to prevent them from reaching these lands.



Middle game



Your biggest advantage, as the Vaulters, are three things:



1. Science!

2. Strategic resources

3. Defence



Each of these can be used to give you a big advantage in the mid game.



1. Science.

You will have a ton of science (or should have), but little production to back it up with. Use the science to your advantage, and get some techs which won't necessarily lead to something which is buildable. For example, grab i) Weapon/armor techs, ii) Dissaproval reduction techs, iii) Fortification techs, iv) Marketplace techs. However, you will probably be one of the first factions to hit Era 2, so if you have a large deficiency in one FIDSI area (such as production or food), grab one or two techs early in Era 2 to help offset the balance. You can jump ahead in industry, for example, by grabbing an industry tech as your first era 2 tech and building it immediately. In this way, you are taking your science advantage and using it to decrease some of your weak points.



In addition, you can gun for an early military advantage by having advanced troops with advanced weapons before anyone else. If you see that you will have to fight initial battles, grab better weapons early and use it immediately: retrofit your units and go on the attack!



2. Resources



Initially, you might feel as if you have little strategic resources, but as the Vaulters gain so many nice boosts to resource production, it will soon turn around and you will have tons of the stuff. However, because you have to spend holy resource, try to balance your spending: rather than trying to optimize each unit and resource bonus, try to use whatever strategic you have the most of as your initial boosters, and the ones you have fewer of as unit upgrades. Even though you might feel that glassteel gives you better weapons, titanium will do almost as nicely if you have less of it. Mix and match your units if necessary - either way, they will be powerful because they will likely have these weapons earlier than other units.



Secondly, improvements which costs Holy resources are very expensive early on. Therefore, only build them where they are necessary - try to focus on one or two cities rather than trying to build these in all your cities! Winter shelters, for example, is great, but it costs so much that it is not worth it initially to get these in every city (but one in a productive city does wonders!) Later on, you can start upgrading your cities with Holy Resource buildings when you have a ton of resources.



Finally, as the Vaulters, strategics are more important than luxuries. Don't be afraid to buy a few strategics if it will help you activate your booster at the right time (before you settle a new city, or before winter strikes).



3. Defense



Vaulters are amazing at defending. Not only do you have a few techs and hero skills to increase fortification, but you need only one standing army to protect all your cities, because of teleport! Use this to your advantage. Build a relatively ok army (or use your main army if they are nearby), and teleport between cities to defend all your borders. Building the fortification techs helps immensely, as you can afford a few rounds of siege before porting your army. (Don't be afraid of losing some FIDS from the siege - this is why you have foritification, to buy time to get a decent army to defeat the intruders properly and not lose the city alltogether!) Also, try to get at least one Vaulters governor who take some of the +Fort skills (in addition to the skill which allows him to enter/leave cities under siege) - assign this hero to any city under siege (or which is threatened) to gain a big boost.





In the mean time, do not worry too much about food, influence, production or dust - rather try to maximize your science, so that you can gun for later era techs earlier than other factions to boost a specific deficient part of your economy. It is very important to use your main advantage (science) as a way to augment your economy and military, rather than to try and compete with the other factions head-to-head.



Second-to-last, in the mid-game, whether you play wide or tall is entirely up to you. If you are unlucky with later tier resource spawns (such as adamantium), then build your empire wider. If you have what you need, then build a tall empire, and get any improvement which improves FIDS per district (there is a lot of science techs which does this, including a unique Vaulters tech, Endless recycling). IF you build wide, then get trade routes up and going, since you can get an amazing science boost in the late game with a wide, trade-rich empire. Hire some Ardent Mages governors or Cultists, as they can boost your science much more than your own heroes.



Finally, try to rush your faction quests, as the Vaulters gain the most unique techs from quests than any other faction. Almost all of these is worthwile to build in one or two cities immediately. Do remember to get at least one Vaulters governor, and grab one point in Mechanical Exhibitionist and Alchemical genius. One of your quests will ask you to raise one of these traits to Lvl 3, but you won't know which until you roll the quest.



Hope it helps! I will try and complete my guide as soon as possible, in which I also show all the techs, items and quest rewards which are not stated explicitly in the faction selection screen.

Hi, You are doing things correct but you are losing the game in the battlefield. The AI is very weak in combat, so if you pick your enemy right, you can devastate armies without taking loses.



With vaulters you have several options, your hero is your main source of dps, so if you get minotaurs or centaurs, you can make them tanks and rotate them on chokepoints while your ranged units clean the battlefield. Or you can go for healing heros and have your dps be your marines.



If you pick a fight against empires like other vaulters, broken lords, roving clans, and pretty much anything except wild walkers. if they are not using ranged units, you will win if the terrain where you fight allows you to have a good initial setup. Even if you have bad initiative once you win one battle, the added levels with boost you enough to keep pushing. As long as your dps keeps earning levels, the AI will keep throwing the same tactic at you. Just be careful that they dont outlevel you by more than 1.



Once you reach your quest line step number 7, it will give you exotic alloys, this will put you on the level of tier 2 palladium weapons(almost) thus making your units destroy face and you can throw your massive amount of titanium or glassteel that you should have by this point on all of your army's weapons. On impossible once you are able to conquer the cities of a neighbor, as long as you don't engage in war on multiple fronts you will be fine. Make sure you give your heroes ASAP the skills to give exp to the army, they will extend your lead further.



The last time for late game is to check the score of your enemies and keep them in check, if you see someone skyrocketing you instantly go and put and end to that. If they manage to go science victory the AI seems to research first the combat science making their units devastating.



Honestly defensive setup sucks, the siege mechanic is just ugly, you get a lot of penalties and if they siege for a long time you fall behind while they get 0 drawbacks. In impossible if you are defensive you will allow another AI to grow out of control and win by science victory.

Dakta wrote:


Once you reach your quest line step number 7, it will give you exotic alloys, this will put you on the level of tier 2 palladium weapons(almost) thus making your units destroy face and you can throw your massive amount of titanium or glassteel that you should have by this point on all of your army's weapons. On impossible once you are able to conquer the cities of a neighbor, as long as you don't engage in war on multiple fronts you will be fine. Make sure you give your heroes ASAP the skills to give exp to the army, they will extend your lead further.

I do believe that is a randomized reward. I had a quick look through the XMLs, and couldn't find gauranteed weapon techs as rewards.

Thanks for the input! Lots of great points, and EzekielMoerdyk great guide.



I'll be giving it another go later on today and will implement some of the suggestions. I guess my main take away is playing tall isn't as viable of an option as playing wide. But could the same be said for say the Wild Walkers since their main bonus is production? Would a heavily production based gameplay make going tall a better option?



One other question. In most other games rushing science gives one an immediate and big advantage. In EL, while there are some obvious benefits I feel like sometimes they are just not worth what you sacrifice. For instance, if I were to say rush to Era II for the tier 2 weapons, I would probably have to be sacrificing some variation of production, dust, and/or food. Now from my experience, even if you get there earlier then anyone else, you still have to have the production/resources to build these units, or the dust to retrofit. But having skipped on some of the buildings it becomes hard to do it quickly. So you end up having to wait, which defeats the purpose of the tech rush altogether.



Another example, is say you decide to tech rush for some nice production based buildings. Now you get to the next era and find out that the production cost to build these is so high, its going to take you forever to build them, since you neglected the buildings that would give you higher production or the food building that would give more workers.



To me it seems like if you don't have your infrastructure set, rushing science doesn't really pay for itself in the long run. Am I not understanding something? Only way I see it working is if you focus on science and one other thing. For instance you focus science with production? Or science and food or science n dust?

EzekielMoerdyk wrote:
I do believe that is a randomized reward. I had a quick look through the XMLs, and couldn't find gauranteed weapon techs as rewards.

Bummer I had my strategy built around that, pretty lucky that in two games I got it at the same quest level.

BlackW3 wrote:
Thanks for the input! Lots of great points, and EzekielMoerdyk great guide.



I'll be giving it another go later on today and will implement some of the suggestions. I guess my main take away is playing tall isn't as viable of an option as playing wide. But could the same be said for say the Wild Walkers since their main bonus is production? Would a heavily production based gameplay make going tall a better option?



One other question. In most other games rushing science gives one an immediate and big advantage. In EL, while there are some obvious benefits I feel like sometimes they are just not worth what you sacrifice. For instance, if I were to say rush to Era II for the tier 2 weapons, I would probably have to be sacrificing some variation of production, dust, and/or food. Now from my experience, even if you get there earlier then anyone else, you still have to have the production/resources to build these units, or the dust to retrofit. But having skipped on some of the buildings it becomes hard to do it quickly. So you end up having to wait, which defeats the purpose of the tech rush altogether.



Another example, is say you decide to tech rush for some nice production based buildings. Now you get to the next era and find out that the production cost to build these is so high, its going to take you forever to build them, since you neglected the buildings that would give you higher production or the food building that would give more workers.



To me it seems like if you don't have your infrastructure set, rushing science doesn't really pay for itself in the long run. Am I not understanding something? Only way I see it working is if you focus on science and one other thing. For instance you focus science with production? Or science and food or science n dust?

Science is pretty clear in this game, if you want to make a build order, you cut the fat. Going back delays the gameplan by X amount of turns, there are some technologies that are skippable because their counterpart yields higher bonuses, but there are others that are unique and unskippable.



For example: Open pit is a very useful tech, but not all of the luxuries are great for your situation, if you are in a region with a "bad" luxury and your expansions look to be the same, I would skip it. Moreover techs like genome lab are skippable and going back for them might hurt you more. +2 science on science hex or aquavulpistics or the one that gives you +2 dust on rivers, those are techs that depending on your game plan are probably worth more skipping.



Era changes unlock more than tech, they put all of your new units on a higher level, levels are huge in this game, your units gain a lot of stats, multipliers therefore become better on your equipment. They also unlock the benefits on the empire plan, so again going back for a 9th tech is a choice you only make if its really necessary.



If you are desperate, you can try to extract science from a weaker AI. Declare war on them, take a city and then offer a truce. DURING this negotiation new trading options will open up, you can get science from them and you can pay for it with dust, resources or even giving them back the city you just captured. Seems that poor AIs value dust very high so if you are rich you can effectively change that into science. However some AI's are stubborn and will not declare truce even when you are standing on top of their last city.

Researching extra techs from an earlier era means that you will unlock the next era sooner, because the earlier techs cost less but still count towards unlocking the next era.



Of course, you still need to ask yourself whether they're more useful than current-era techs you could be getting instead.

Antistone wrote:
Researching extra techs from an earlier era means that you will unlock the next era sooner, because the earlier techs cost less but still count towards unlocking the next era.



Of course, you still need to ask yourself whether they're more useful than current-era techs you could be getting instead.

Are you sure? I been living a lie then, I was under the impression your unlocks are specifically from the previous era of the one you are unlocking so previous researches dont count.

Dakta wrote:
Are you sure? I been living a lie then, I was under the impression your unlocks are specifically from the previous era of the one you are unlocking so previous researches dont count.

Yup. It is quite clear with the Broken Lords, when you have to research 12 techs from Era 1 for a quest... it doesn't set you really back that much.

Hi everyone, reading but not posting yet, it seems i have a little different strategy/opening which works well for me in endless difficulty/normal speed/standard settings.



My goal is to have just before the turn 40 a stack of 6 units fully upgraded and then become purely warmonger. I usually don't bother with long term considerations with my own cities because ai's cities will be much better. It implies in 40 turns :

* 9 techs of era I and at least 4 techs of era II (glory of empire, meritocratic promotion, armors/accessories and weapons) ;

* at least 32 titanium (6 dommage boost rings + army dommage boost for hero) and ideally 36 titanium (dommage ring for hero) ;

* at least 32 glassteel (6 glassteel weapons level 2 and army initiative boost) and ideally 36 glassteel (weapon for hero) ;

* enough dust or industry to produce/retrofit the 6 units, generally ~500 dust and ~1.000 industry.

* 160 influence, for declaring war (40 influence) and choosing the empire plan with + 25 approbation (120 influence for 2 cities), essential if you want to maintain a good approbation with new cities.



Having always and only these goals in mind, my opening is generally the following with Vaulters :



I focus on three things : colonise a new region as soon as possible, research and exploration.



First city

I try to have a max of industry and food with some science (4 at least). Industry > food > science > dust.

I put my worker in pop until the growth then i switch to industry.

I launch a founder's mémorial first and switch immediately to settler when available. Eventually, if the memorial is not finish, i buyout it.

Generally, i manage to produce the settler at turn 10 +/- 2.



Exploration

I separate my stack in 3 units, 2*1 marines and hero.

First goal : pacify the village in my starting region (bribe or quest)

Second goal : find a lovely second region with 2/3 neutral villages, titanium and/or glassteel mine, a good quest (colonize, no enemy during 5 turns, economic plan, defender of the weak) and a good spot (industry > anomaly > science > food > dust)

Third goal : pacify the villages in the second region

Fourth goal : obtain a max of money/resources with quests and ruins

Five goal : come back home or near your target before turn 40



Two regions are enough and a third is generally not worth it, mainly because of the 180 influence for empire plan +25 approbation at turn 40 and a the fact that a second settler cost too much



Construction

The word is adaptation : if i think/calculate i'll not have enough science to research all my techs before turn 40, i lauch geomic lab right now / if i have always plenty glassteel/titanium with quests, i can wait a little bit / ...

It should be :

1. Library : i need science because i have few in my first town

2. Mill foundry

3. Sewer system : to stay happy or become fervent and for the +1 influence

4. Titanium/glassteel mines

5. Geomic lab

6. Empire mint

(7. Luxury mine : only if i can have the boost before turn 40)

8. Glory of empire

9. Marines / others units

I always skip seed storage because the cost return is after turn 40.



Research

Adaptation again with my priorities :

1. Language square : i need it to pacify the neutral villages in my 2 regions as soon as possible and launch quests

2. Mill foundry

3. Sewer system

4. Alchemist furnace

5. Geomic lab

6. Empire mint

7. Mercenary market or dawn officer

(Here, if i have enough science and more than 300 dust, i go first with imperial coinage and the boosts of luxury resources)

8. Glory of empire

9. Alchemical alloys

10. Alchemical armors

11. Meritocratic promotion



I generally open Era II at turn 22 +/- 3 and manage to have all techs before turn 40. If i'm late, i wait meritocratic promotion before beginning the war.



Turn 40 -> 60

Full military, the goal is to kill a first (strong) AI or two (weaks) AI with no losses and max experience for your army.

I gain generally between 3 to 6 new cities in 5 to 15 turns.

Then, I work on my approval and focus on building a new army of 6 units fully upgraded.



Turn 60 -> 80

The goal is again to kill one or two AI with your two armies, stabilize and make a third army.



Turn 80 -> 100

Idem.



Turn 100 -> ?

Now, it should stay only one or two AI. The goal is to aim a domination victory (fastest) or a diplomatic/science victory (longer).