Serisouly, war is not cheap per se in el? Civ5 diplomacy is meaningless? Do you play Endless/Deity?



I don´t know how long I´ve played Total War since I don´t play it on my steam, but it must be somewhere around 700 hours for TW Rome 2, mostly on Legendary difficulty - and diplomacy there is just a matter of avoiding immediate neighbors from attacking you. I have way over 1k hours on both civ5 and EL, mosty on the hardest difficulties too, and in tems of diplomacy, it goes civ5>TW>el.



Yes, commercial and research agreements will provide you bonuses according to your output. So if you´re playing normal difficulties, the fact that you´ll probably be stronger than the AI makes the Agreements be comparatively more expensive for them (since they need to balance the power), and if you´re playing higher difficulties, the marginal benefit of estabilishing trade routes with you tends to be too little for the AI, while being significant for you, again making it more expensive for them.





You can say here that you don´t mind the AI getting pearls in front of you all you want to feel like you won the discussion, but the fact is the crushing majority of people would not be ok with that and it´s completely reasonable to apply this characteristics to the AI.



What else would say are the "anal expectations" from the AI?



ps - I´ve also studied International Relations, so I´m 'that guy' when it comes to theory in games, and I see Civ5 as the absolute only game ever that depicts Hobbesians realist politics in a very complete manner, so you might understand why I´m outraged by your statement that diplomacy is irrelevant there.

Still waiting for you guys to bump up that release date to the 4th or 5th. Come on...you know you want to!!!

Not nice.

Would it be possible to rework this into "open borders for X turns", where the price varies according to X ?

icarus86 wrote:
Not nice.

Would it be possible to rework this into "open borders for X turns", where the price varies according to X ?

sounds like the most reasonable solutions as this is a very annoying bug and quite clearly is not intended.

eXistenZ wrote:
turn x: pay AI for open borders

turn x+1: AI closes borders

This is one of the problems that we've fixed and which all players will benefit from when Shifters comes out (April 7)



We'll go into some more depth during the livestream this evening

wilbefast wrote:
This is one of the problem that we've fixed and which all players will benefit from when Shifters comes out (April 7)



We'll go into some more depth during the livestream this evening

Any chance we could bump that release date to the 4th instead of the 7th?

wilbefast wrote:
This is one of the problem that we've fixed and which all players will benefit from when Shifters comes out (April 7)



We'll go into some more depth during the livestream this evening

Is that livestream available somewhere now to watch?



Really looking forward to the Shifters.

The livestream is still available on their Twitch as a video-on-demand (https://www.twitch.tv/amplitudestudios/v/57972393)

Another problem that persists, is A.I.'s sudden change of the mood. It breaks peace, returning to cold war, yet it's very happy to make another peace I propose at the very same turn after break. And it's happy to sign commercial/research agreement on top of that.

Why did it break peace at the very first place then? We could both benefit from long-standing partnership, yet A.I. prefers to force me to spend Influence



It feels like A.I. has way too high threshold on upholding current relationship, and it breaks them way before it ends being beneficial for them.

I hope this will be addressed too, as it's quite annoying behavior.

Sublustris wrote:
Another problem that persists, is A.I.'s sudden change of the mood. It breaks peace, returning to cold war, yet it's very happy to make another peace I propose at the very same turn after break. And it's happy to sign commercial/research agreement on top of that.

Why did it break peace at the very first place then? We could both benefit from long-standing partnership, yet A.I. prefers to force me to spend Influence

There was a consistency issue between the "diplomatic agents" (which decided when to make declarations or offer contracts) and the term evaluators (which put a price on diplomatic terms). So the AI could declare war when the evaluation of peace was still positive. For Shifters we've done a pass to ensure that the two aren't in disagreement under any circumstances.

Thank you for clarifying this. Looking forward to update and expansion.

wilbefast wrote:
There was a consistency issue between the "diplomatic agents" (which decided when to make declarations or offer contracts) and the term evaluators (which put a price on diplomatic terms). So the AI could declare war when the evaluation of peace was still positive. For Shifters we've done a pass to ensure that the two aren't in disagreement under any circumstances.

Sounds nice ! Can't wait to play it.

turn x: pay AI for open borders

turn x+1: AI closes borders

It's not April 1st so I can't pretend we're gonna do it.

Frogsquadron wrote:
It's not April 1st so I can't pretend we're gonna do it.

Hope your releasing concept art and how you came up with the art like the original races, as an aspiring concept artist its of great intrest to me

Good idea, I'll see what we can do.

Another thing thats still happening.



reload save: all diplomacy changes

eXistenZ wrote:
Another thing thats still happening.



reload save: all diplomacy changes

Right, I did reload a savegame four or five times today (yes, I really messed up ...).

On one occasion, I did get an instant diplomacy change from another faction. The others went with no change ...

eXistenZ wrote:
Another thing thats still happening.



reload save: all diplomacy changes

icarus86 wrote:
Right, I did reload a savegame four or five times today (yes, I really messed up ...).

On one occasion, I did get an instant diplomacy change from another faction. The others went with no change ...

Curious... what exactly is changing when you load the save? And could you send us the offending save so we can look into it?

wilbefast wrote:
Curious... what exactly is changing when you load the save? And could you send us the offending save so we can look into it?

What happened is that as soon as I loaded the game, another empire immediately declared "Closed borders" on me.

This didn't happen the first time I played through the game, and neither the other 3-4 times when I re-loaded the game. Again, in my case it was just once.



Sadly, I overwrote the savegame in the meantime. I'm using four "slots" (ICARUS01-ICARUS04) and cycle through them when saving ...

If this happens again, I'll send the file.