How can I get more difficulty and challenge out of ES2?

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

6 years ago

Feb 23, 2019, 12:38:53 AM

Hey,

I'm a new player to ES2, I came from Stellaris, after 1k+ hours to try something new so I decided to try this game out.

I'm really trying hard to make this my 2nd 4x space game alongside stellaris but I started to struggle really hard as of now:

Cutting to the point, I'm currently 130 hours in the game, no dlcs except the music ones and I feel like I "figured it out" already.

I played all factions on endless and impossible except Lumeris (Because as warmonger, I don't feel like a proper one when my fleet is composed of oil tankers and flying fishing boats with space cranes).

The problem I have is that the AI is just impotent past the first stage of planet colonization.

I Play on endless and the AI just gives no challenge at all, whether it in space combat or general game victory.

It seems he can only win with economy.

I'm a player who likes to play war and conquest, so this is how I play my games, and I it didn't took me long to figure out the combat system, whats weak and whats strong and what goes with what..(whats currently overpowered as well...ahem..).

I got to the point that I field a fleet composition that the AI can't counter and I just crush him with 0 ship losses, by turn 70~ or so.

The AI also doesn't seem to upgrade its fleets in terms of weapons, as I notice that its fleet power doesn't increase as games goes.

I never seen him fields upgraded hunters or coordinators, for instance.

There are some very questionable balance decision and features made into the game that I can't put my head around why the dev implemented them.

Layer of HP buffer (Shields) and Damage mitigation (armor), never works well togather, Stellaris did the same mistake until the devs eventually gave up after countless attempts of balance and made both layers of HP.

And some heroes have the ability to get 80% shield penetration, turning lasers and beams into unstoppable killing machines...who thought that this skill is a good idea?

The AI doesn't know how to capture systems, it seems, since without siege modules it takes forever to invade a planet. This leads to a very stale galaxy that never changes hand.

I never seen an AI faction gets destroyed by another AI faction.

Once everyone colonize everything, the same pictures remains for the entire game.

The most enjoyable part of the game is the early game, since the AI actually does something.

Also, why is the AI warns me 40 turns before its going to declare war on me? I would rather be surprised and get back stabbed instead, its honestly just stupid...

I noticed that the game has factions that the AI is better suited to play, like Cravers, so I try to choose them over others, but honestly it doesn't seem to matter much.

I'm very confliced about buying the supremacy expansion, because at one hand the new faction looks interesting and it suits my game style, but on the other hand, whats the point if the AI is so impotent anyway and is just nothing more than a punching bag?

There is no satisfiaction of mastering a faction against an impotent AI that gives you no challenge.

Does the AI gets better with the expansions? does it plays the DLC factions better? is there something Im missing?

What can one do you get the most of the game difficulty?

Updated 6 years ago.

fixou

Newcomer

fixou

Newcomer

20 400g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 24, 2019, 12:49:15 PM

You are not really missing anything. I am in the same situation as you, as is probably any competent 4x player. The AI is crap and unless you did something truly wrong, you should be rolling over the AI by turn 70. Not only did i never lose a game in endless difficulty but i never felt even remotely threatened once. And i am far from being a great player.

The game shines in multiplayer. In single player, the AI is hopelessly outmatched.

Updated 6 years ago.

Minervo

Newcomer

Minervo

Newcomer

12 000g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 24, 2019, 8:28:47 PM

Really hope that endless space 2 will get a community patch like the endless legend got. This patch made endless legend much more enjoyable because the ai got much more challenging. I can't get pass the serious difficult on endless legend now xD

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

6 years ago

Feb 24, 2019, 11:45:47 PM

Minervo wrote:
Really hope that endless space 2 will get a community patch like the endless legend got. This patch made endless legend much more enjoyable because the ai got much more challenging. I can't get pass the serious difficult on endless legend now xD

Don't think thats going to happen.

From what I understand, after the next faction expansion, Amplitude is done with ES2.

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

May the force of Auriga be with you, young Padawan !

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

53 400g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 12:12:29 AM

SteveRaptor wrote:
Minervo wrote:
Really hope that endless space 2 will get a community patch like the endless legend got. This patch made endless legend much more enjoyable because the ai got much more challenging. I can't get pass the serious difficult on endless legend now xD
Don't think thats going to happen.
From what I understand, after the next faction expansion, Amplitude is done with ES2.

Community patch = Mod developed by community members - not by Amplitude.

As still recommended in Steam thread you posted same AI experience: Enhanced Space 2 and this one: Community Mod Project

Keep in mind, the mods work, but are going to be improved/extended, as long as the modders do have free time to care for. Latest patch and DLC require to adapt the mods (at least in parts). Thanks again to Kuma and Cyrob investing their time in these mods.

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 12:51:46 AM

Groo wrote:
SteveRaptor wrote:
Minervo wrote:
Really hope that endless space 2 will get a community patch like the endless legend got. This patch made endless legend much more enjoyable because the ai got much more challenging. I can't get pass the serious difficult on endless legend now xD
Don't think thats going to happen.
From what I understand, after the next faction expansion, Amplitude is done with ES2.
Community patch = Mod developed by community members - not by Amplitude.

As still recommended in Steam thread you posted same AI experience: Enhanced Space 2 and this one: Community Mod Project

Keep in mind, the mods work, but are going to be improved/extended, as long as the modders do have free time to care for. Latest patch and DLC require to adapt the mods (at least in parts). Thanks again to Kuma and Cyrob investing their time in these mods.

Unless I missed anything, those mods don't change or improve anything in the AI behavior and performance.

REDGUY

Harmonic Haroshem

Turn the crank to Frank

REDGUY

Harmonic Haroshem

37 200g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 7:34:38 AM

I only won once on Endless...

Updated 6 years ago.

videovillain

Pixel Twister

Improve yourself, improve the universe!

videovillain

Pixel Twister

26 100g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 8:29:55 AM

SteveRaptor wrote:

And some heroes have the ability to get 80% shield penetration, turning lasers and beams into unstoppable killing machines...who thought that this skill is a good idea?

Yeah, add to that 20% Hull penetration boosted lasers and beams and they are basically directly smashing away the HP in no time.

SteveRaptor wrote:

Does the AI gets better with the expansions? does it plays the DLC factions better? is there something Im missing?
What can one do you get the most of the game difficulty?

From what I can tell, no, the expansions don't do much to change the AI at all. However, the new pay styles of the new factions could provide you with some interesting matches... that is, until you figure those out as well.

Best bet is to try your hand at multiplayer or hope someone makes an improved AI mod!

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

May the force of Auriga be with you, young Padawan !

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

53 400g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 10:11:44 AM

SteveRaptor wrote: Unless I missed anything, those mods don't change or improve anything in the AI behavior and performance.

So my bad. I thought the fixes within these mods would lead to a more challenging AI when polishing some mechanics players make use of (intended by devs or not). Didn't test - as long as I wanted to wait for latest updates. By the way, did you check out normal game speed, yet? I would be interested, if the AI experience differs by chosen game speed. I remember there were discrepancies between chosen game speeds, when it comes to gameplay in the past.

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

SteveRaptor

Enthusiast

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 10:32:22 AM

Groo wrote:

SteveRaptor wrote: Unless I missed anything, those mods don't change or improve anything in the AI behavior and performance.
So my bad. I thought the fixes within these mods would lead to a more challenging AI when polishing some mechanics players make use of (intended by devs or not). Didn't test - as long as I wanted to wait for latest updates. By the way, did you check out normal game speed, yet? I would be interested, if the AI experience differs by chosen game speed. I remember there were discrepancies between chosen game speeds, when it comes to gameplay in the past.

I never played anything other than normal speed, actually.

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

May the force of Auriga be with you, young Padawan !

VIPGroo

Enthusiast Survivor

53 400g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 25, 2019, 3:37:25 PM

This case I can't offer any adivice no more - I surrender analyzing the different gaming experiences. Guess I'm just a bad gamer and reasoned by this experiencing AI behaviour from a different view. At least I don't seem to be the only one - fortunately.

HBumblebee

Wannabe Scout

Stay curious!

HBumblebee

Wannabe Scout

43 600g2g pts

6 years ago

Feb 26, 2019, 7:57:21 PM

In my experience games tend to be harder in slower gamespeed.

vampatori

Newcomer

vampatori

Newcomer

3 300g2g pts

6 years ago

Mar 1, 2019, 11:30:08 PM

Have you tried the Endless War mod, created by the developers as an example of how to mod the AI? It makes all the AI factions ally each other and wage war with you - not ideal but could be interesting.

I'm new to Endless Space 2 (still haven't completed my first game yet!) but I'm excited by the modding possibilities and have been having a cursory look around at what's involved, specifically with the AI. It seems that the developers put the framework in-place at the community's request, but from what I can see so far the community has done nothing of note with it - potentially because the documentation of the AI API is limited to non-existent.

If anyone does have any info beyond what's on this developer post I would be very grateful. I've not begun coding anything yet, again just having a cursory look into seeing if it's possible to do what I ultimately want to do.

Abrasax

Forgotten

- Any Amplitude Studios Game: Definitely Worth-a-Buy

Abrasax

Forgotten

32 100g2g pts

6 years ago

Mar 2, 2019, 5:22:33 AM

Give it time and there will be some Improved AI mods out there. Modding a game to that magnitude before the game is "complete" ends up being a lot of extra work, so anyone modding behavior will probably do so when all the DLC is out.

gap81

Old Timer

gap81

Old Timer

24 700g2g pts

6 years ago

Mar 2, 2019, 6:50:06 AM

vampatori

Newcomer

vampatori

Newcomer

3 300g2g pts

6 years ago

Mar 3, 2019, 7:14:01 PM

I think if you look at it from the perspective of creating an overall "better" strategically thinking AI, then yes it is very complicated and there's a lot to consider. Waiting for a complete game to work on that definitely makes sense (and I think is part of the reason why 4X games tend not to have strong AI generally).

Instead I want to focus on very specific things. While they won't make an AI that can out-smart you, I think you can get them to provide more of a challenge, and behave in more interesting ways. The included example of having the AI ally together and fight you is a great example of such a change... it's a minor change, but makes a big difference to how the game plays.

I think the AI's ship designs are less than optimal - there's lots of things we could work on now with that. Sure, another class of ship may get added, or some other mechanic, but the bulk of the work can be separate to that. For example I'd like to look at bolstering the AI's use of siege and invasion modules as there definitely seems to be a problem there. Small cahnges like that can have a big knock-on effect.

But it does look like some people are at least looking into it which is great. For now I'm working on something different (a sortof scenario generator) and playing the game, then when I've got a better handle on things I'll have a look at learning some of the AI stuff.

Updated 6 years ago.

Vacmidvalley

Officer

Vacmidvalley

Officer

26 600g2g pts

6 years ago

Mar 3, 2019, 9:10:28 PM

yes make the game harder please. Its too easy on endless.

Click here to login

Comment

Characters : 0