Logo Platform
logo amplifiers simplified

Influence border growth too fast

Reply
Copied to clipboard!
8 years ago
Dec 6, 2016, 1:03:08 AM

@Bayes, you can DL my mod and try it, it should fix the problem i belive, but i can tone the nerf up or down depending on player return

0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 6, 2016, 8:46:31 AM

+1 Pejman:

Bayes, try Pejman's mod, it should temporary fix the main problem of the game now.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 14, 2016, 9:01:25 AM

Hi,


Don't wnat to start another thread. Just look at this screenshot:



The tooltip says that I have to pay 1000 influence to get the system, but when the bar sent full I got the system without paying anything. It was with last patch.

Not sure if a bug, or if intendend.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 14, 2016, 10:49:14 AM

the buyout is a know bug i think, it will be fixed probably for next update but i may able to fix a mod for that though, i'll take a look


PS : so i taook a look and i can remove the automated absorbtion while leaving the buyout option, however for now the buyout is still a fixed value as i couldn't find a way to set the interpreter's contect for this formula ( will ask some dev how to do it <.< )

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 30, 2016, 2:37:24 PM
WeaponizedCaffeine wrote:


Kweel_Nakashyn wrote:

What is the formula used for influence circles ?

How much a capital gets as a bonus for influence area ? +200% ?


Is it possible to mod this ? Say +50% or +100% only ? +61.8% :p ?


Hold your horses, I haven't even looked at it yet!



Please do man.

The influence border push is so ridiculous, that my entire cluster, ALL working with SPIN, is covered in AI influence on Endless difficulty by turn 30-40.

I literally have no influence on my capital.

They are working my asteroid fields, next to my capital.

This is ridiculous.


0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 12:29:43 PM

Same with me. It seems the will of the Emperor is just too grand that his fleets can't keep up with the conquest.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 4:16:39 PM

The influence push from AI on Endless difficulty is obscene.

1 freaking colony with 1 freaking planet pushes my influence off my capital, that's with SPIN running everywhere.

In 40 turns I never have influence over my capital.

That is, while being at war with everyone who is "influencing" me, which means, their sh*t is shot on sight in my empire.

So, how exactly are they influencing me?


TL;DR Influence border pushes are broken as f**k and badly need fixing.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 5:46:25 PM

Influence is definitely going to need some adjustment. I'm not entirely sure how it functions but it seems to run purely off of Influence gain which is a problem because the Empire generates enough of that stuff to feed it's entire empire. I feel like their needs to be a sort of cap to how much influence can grown per system, forcing you to atleast have control of systems nearby an empire to actually start encroaching on it.


P.S. That is the perfect image.

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 8:21:41 PM

tl;dr: yeah I'm a nerd.


We all had the same idea, with UE, abuse  and see what happens.

Hmmm.


I've got 3 planets at turn 50 (I know). Using a 45° ruler on my screen +/-2cm:


Planet - Radius (cm) - System  output - area (cm², gross estimation)

Planet K - 10cm - 22 - 314

Planet P - 19cm - 72 - 1133

Planet M (capital) - 32cm - 161 - 3215


I though the problem was inf output related to inf radius instead of inf area but no.

It seems area covered by circles is related to something else OR that capitals have a huge, very huge boost (product in cross are no equal for the capital).


If it's area, it's fine.


161 output in planet M is broke into 73 from planet, 12 from system improvement, 47.3 from hero skill, +28.8 from happy


Products in cross says inf output in capital should be somewhere near 500 instead of 161 (under the heavy hypothesis that inf output is what rules influence area).
In that case : wow, that one boost for sure :)

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 8:34:01 PM

or maybe have all the other systems that arn't yours that are inside your influence sphere slow down it's developpement (meaning that your influence will have to be greater than the combined influence of every zone it's eating through to continue to grow)


PS : you need to factor in the moment they started having an influence zone, but i think asking a dev for the formula would be easier and better ^^

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 9:00:05 PM

Experienced the same yesterday, too:


http://imgur.com/a/jnQ3K


Also system assimilation by influence seems to be too cheap and easy. (still)

And then you auto assimilate systems you don't even want and can't raze them.



0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 10:07:18 PM

I also think that the influence radius effect should be toned down a bit or two.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 25, 2016, 10:49:49 AM

Hi everyone,


I'll have a look at the rate the Influence circles grow today. 

It probably won't be the definitive balancing though, but it might help your experience a bit


Thank you for the feedback!

0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 25, 2016, 11:06:47 AM

What is the formula used for influence circles ?

How much a capital gets as a bonus for influence area ? +200% ?


Is it possible to mod this ? Say +50% or +100% only ? +61.8% :p ?


Setting this could be a game option by the way :)

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 25, 2016, 11:14:28 AM

Kweel_Nakashyn wrote:

What is the formula used for influence circles ?

How much a capital gets as a bonus for influence area ? +200% ?


Is it possible to mod this ? Say +50% or +100% only ? +61.8% :p ?

Hold your horses, I haven't even looked at it yet!


0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 25, 2016, 11:21:43 AM

My horses are pawing the ground :)


+61.8, golden ratio, golden ratio, go, go, golden ratio !


:)

0Send private message
8 years ago
Nov 24, 2016, 10:45:07 AM


THOSE LOOKING FOR A FIX : DROP THE FILE IN Endless Space 2\Public\Simulation (overwrite when asked). It's a handmade mod there might be issues with it (there shouldn't be any actually, but we never know). Don't forget to make a backup of original file (or you can just verify integrity of cache to restore the official version)


Mod Border Growth Nerf.rar














More seriously, while playing a normal game as UE (by that i mean no cheat or bug abuse) i simply noticed than in 100 turns 70% on the galaxy was in the influence zone of my capital

It makes influence too strong as there is no way to counter it (except having more and going to war i guess)

I belive the time it would take to assimilate a colony should increase depending on the number of improvements and population (and maybe approval) (it would take les time to convince 2 setlers in a shelter they are now part of your empire than a great city of milion of inhabitants that provides everything they need)


I don't know the formula used but a more logarithmic one would be better (based on the surface to add and not to the radius of the circle for instance)







!!!!! UPDATE : I tweaked the files a bit to tone down the border growth (basically used the volume formula instead of area)


Here are some Before after shots : 














Note that on the 2nd screenshot i used the old value calculation and used it for the vision range so we can clearly see the difference.



Path is : Endless Space 2\Public\Simulation


SimulationDescriptors[ColonizedStarSystem].xml



PPS : fixed a bug that resulted in systems behaving like they were in rebelion even though they were content O__o


Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 1, 2016, 8:38:51 PM

A system's Empire points generation is the same dimension as a length, not a area, in formula used.

(lines 262 - 271 in [Your drive letter]:\SteamLibrary\SteamApps\common\Endless Space 2\Public\Simulation\SimulationDescriptors[ColonizedStarSystem].xml )




If a system is generating 100, then the radius growth is (((what it was + 100)/pi)^0.5)*0.75.

This formula seems to be totally wrong in my point of vue, or maybe I can't read those xml (total noob there).


If you add a radius to a sum of , then  is supposed to be a length (dimension L), not an area (dimension L²).

(yeah, I was a physicist in a previous life)


I'd try (what it was + ((100 ^ 0.5)/pi) * not 0.75 but a balance factor that would be tied to the go-go-go-golden ratio again :D (be it 161% or 61%).

I'm lazy to try to mod the file and start a new game. Also, this could destroy my current games since the "what it was" part must be serializable and may be saved in savegames.


Warning, my studies are 15 years from now so my maths have to be double checked.


I would try formulas tied to volume to, because space is supposed to be volumes (volume of a sphere = 4/3*pi*r^3). Not sure at all if this is probant.


The thing is the current formula is "working" somehow with the basic systems, and balanced for the game, so, meh. I don't understand the xml maybe.


Formula aside, what I'm suspecting to be the culprit bug is for Homesystems only. I think that the $(SystemInfluenceStock) of Homesystems only is the whole Empire point generation. So, the sum of all planet's empire point generation. The colony systems seems to be fine. (but I don't understand the xml formula)


I have been searching for confirmation there but I don't really know where to find this.

Can you confirm this, WeaponizedCafeine ?

Updated 8 years ago.
0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 1, 2016, 9:34:32 PM

This is a basic question ... but I gather that the rate the your influence border grows is tied to the influence output of the system?


I ask because I was going through the tech tree looking for any reference to border growth and seeing none.  It isn't stated anywhere in game from what I can tell that border growth is tied to influence generation.  I thought it was only tired to population - but obviously those two are linked.

0Send private message
8 years ago
Dec 2, 2016, 12:42:36 AM

yes the total influence generated by a system is used for it's border.



#Kweel_Nakashyn : the formula is correct let me show you : 


we want to have the border radius in function of the area (imagine influence is a liquid you are pouring on the ground and you want to see how big the pudle will be depending on the amount of liquid you poured)


the formula for circle is X = Pi * R^2


Now X is the amount of liquid we have and we want to know how big the puddle will be so it becomes R = (X/Pi)^0.5 


The thing is the amount of influence increase much too fast, i believe replacing the multiplication by 0.75 by a ^0.75 would work much better, i'll try and leave a xml for those who want to try it out


also there is a possibility that homesystem get a +% to border growth (it is present in a lot of game, and the starting building in the home system provides extra influence i think)


PS : why are you so obsessed with Phi?




0Send private message
?

Click here to login

Reply
Comment