So, basically every time I hit turn 140 and make my choice for the Academy quest, I inevitably have this exact same thing happen: Every member of my Alliance or AI I'm at Peace with chooses the opposite of what I chose, everyone I'm still at War with chooses the same as me. Suddently, in order to complete this big, fancy end-game quest, I either have to sneak through allied territory with a Hero to claim the Lodestones or go to war with basically everyone to clear the opposing team off of them. Oh, and then someone with the same goal as me shows up and kicks me off of the Lodestone with a bigger fleet. Yay.

We already know the AI waits to see what you picked before making their choice, they always have it be a 50%/50% split in AI games. Why not have their first priority be "Match Alliance members"?

Yeah, I got so annoyed by this, and that pointless quest in general, I turned it off for all my games. 

Yeah, that seem quite a problem.

I really don't like the Academy quest at all. It just kind of happens all of a sudden with almost no lead up.  I know it's sort of supposed to be a replacement for harsher winters in EL or act as an end game crisis, but it accomplishes neither of those things.

This is why I always leave that choice at the last moment before ending my turn and saving. I've had it happen twice before and it's been fixed by reloading my save and picking another option. Still, I've said before that the AI allies should either tell you what they will pick or pick whatever you choose. I prefer the latter since that means it gives the player the freedom without screwing alliances.

It might seem boring to let the AI allies follow the player, but it's the best one. It'd be bad if the AI did whatever they wanted since you can't vote someone out of an alliance, which is another thing that should be added.

Ridiculi wrote:

I really don't like the Academy quest at all. It just kind of happens all of a sudden with almost no lead up.  I know it's sort of supposed to be a replacement for harsher winters in EL or act as an end game crisis, but it accomplishes neither of those things.

There's usually a prelimiary quest relating to it on turn 120-ish, like "Who can produce the most Industry" and whatnot where if you win you meet Isyander. It is a bit abrupt, though.

Numinumi wrote:

This is why I always leave that choice at the last moment before ending my turn and saving. I've had it happen twice before and it's been fixed by reloading my save and picking another option. Still, I've said before that the AI allies should either tell you what they will pick or pick whatever you choose. I prefer the latter since that means it gives the player the freedom without screwing alliances.

It might seem boring to let the AI allies follow the player, but it's the best one. It'd be bad if the AI did whatever they wanted since you can't vote someone out of an alliance, which is another thing that should be added.

The Diplomacy system in general can be a bit clumsy. AI don't seem to have much of a memory beyond specific tags like "You attacked us in open space" or "You refused to give us tribute that we asked for for no reason and with no threat to back it up."

The5lacker wrote:

Ridiculi wrote:

I really don't like the Academy quest at all. It just kind of happens all of a sudden with almost no lead up.  I know it's sort of supposed to be a replacement for harsher winters in EL or act as an end game crisis, but it accomplishes neither of those things.

There's usually a prelimiary quest relating to it on turn 120-ish, like "Who can produce the most Industry" and whatnot where if you win you meet Isyander. It is a bit abrupt, though.

While there is some flavor text in the quest mentioning Isyander, it by no means acts as a prelude to a quest that's supposed to have the potential of "restarting" the galaxy... not that the final Academy quest feels like that anyway.

Yeah I think the academy quest could stand to change so that something crazy happens like unused heroes suddenly start to lead fleets into battle against random factions. Make the galaxy dangerous.

This has come up a few times, and Amplitude has said one way to make privateer fleets to clear fleets from lodestone systems. I'm not sure if the best solution is to have all alliance members be on the same side in the quest. What if a majority of the races are in one alliance? Then there is no 50/50 split.

Maybe normal diplomatic relationships should have no effect in Lodestone systems: have your fleets in orbit around a Lodestone able to attack any fleet on the opposite side of the quest (whether or not you are normally at peace with them). Of course, this could have the side effect of weakening your ally's military if you take out their fleet.

Maybe there should be an option to negotiate with an AI to ask them to switch sides in the quest after it has started, or to switch sides yourself if you find your allies picked the opposite side.

eruanion wrote:

This has come up a few times, and Amplitude has said one way to make privateer fleets to clear fleets from lodestone systems. I'm not sure if the best solution is to have all alliance members be on the same side in the quest. What if a majority of the races are in one alliance? Then there is no 50/50 split.

Maybe normal diplomatic relationships should have no effect in Lodestone systems: have your fleets in orbit around a Lodestone able to attack any fleet on the opposite side of the quest (whether or not you are normally at peace with them). Of course, this could have the side effect of weakening your ally's military if you take out their fleet.

Maybe there should be an option to negotiate with an AI to ask them to switch sides in the quest after it has started, or to switch sides yourself if you find your allies picked the opposite side.

"The best way to maintain an alliance is to sneakily stab your allies in the back!" strikes me as a somewhat lazy, haphazard solution. Especially when the easy, obvious, safe, non-convolued solution is just... don't have Allies inconvenience each other for no reason. Because otherwise, I see no reason to enter an alliance before turn 140, as I'll inevitably have to just blow up their ships.

I agree that the quest is poorly executed and implemented, and yes the fact that it doesn't take already established alliances into account makes it difficult to complete.

I mean on one hand I appreciate it potentially leading to the breaking down of established coalitions but at the same time this 'side quest' shakes the core game too much to be worth it. 

I'm not sure if the best solution is to have all alliance members be on the same side in the quest. What if a majority of the races are in one alliance? Then there is no 50/50 split.

There's a limit how many factions can be in an Alliance, which is 50%, so at 12 players an alliance can only grow to 6 players. With uneven numbers, it's 50% and -1, so an alliance can never break the 50% threshold.