The topic here is pretty obvious: What do you want to see in the next “Endless Game”, as in, Endless Legend 2, Endless Space 3, or a new game? Your answer can be incredibly specific things, what kind of game you hope it is, or even just general changes you hope they make. Above all else though, be respectful of one another’s opinions: Just because their idea might not be what you like, doesn’t mean theirs lacks any merit.

I’ll get us started though: I’m down for literally anything else in the Endless series, they’ve never made a bad game yet. If you put a gun to my head, I’d personally take another Endless Space because it’s my favourite mainline game in the series. Some things I’d want them to change in the next game though:

The engine

Unity is a modder’s nightmare to deal with, and frankly even outside of modding, leaves a lot to be desired. Given that the Endless series doesn’t exist on mobile or consoles, I’m unsure why Amplitude continues to use it, outside of familiarity. My hope beyond hope is that for the next game after Humankind, they decide to turf Unity and move over to Unreal, Godot or Nitrous. Unreal is extremely well-known, has a ton of potential and boasts excellent mod support, and has recently come down in price dramatically for smaller budget games. Godot brings that price all the way down to nothing, and in spite of being an open-source engine, seems to have been laid out in an incredibly intuitive manner, and is set up with PC in mind. Nitrous Engine is a brand-new, multi-core orientated engine from Stardock that was built from the ground up with modern PCs in mind, and is surprisingly easy to modify as well. Really, almost any engine choice over Unity would be a net-win, as Unity’s PreFab system makes adding new assets to the game pointlessly difficult, while its core engine is designed to account for ARM-based processors with low-multithreaded performance.

A return to the tech web

I realize this one might be divisive, as some folks love the tech blob of Endless Legend, but to me, Amplitude’s first game had their best tech layout by a country mile. If you’re unfamiliar, the first Endless Space had four tech trees set in to four quadrants – not completely unlike Endless Space 2. Where they differed was in operation. In the first Endless Space, getting to a later game technology meant working your way through that specific tree to get to that node, with nodes taking more research to accomplish the further along the tree they were. In comparison, I’ve always disliked Endless Legend’s and Endless Space 2’s tech systems, where any technology in any branch can be researched, so long as you’ve made it in to a certain era. As the cost increases with each researched technology, this system effectively penalizes experimentation and earlier tier technologies, and I’ve always personally considered it a massive step down from the first game’s system.

More Interesting Heroes

Heroes at the moment are in a weird spot where they have all these cool stories written about them, only to all have effectively the same skills. First things first, I would, again, remove the skill blob and make the system in to three proper skill trees, as becoming a better gardener shouldn’t suddenly allow me to become an expert commander. This would also have the side effect of making all skill trees more individually interesting to navigate. Secondly, the class system in the next game needs a bit more of a focus given to it. It’s strange to pick a fleet-orientated class and still have half your skills be useful in systems only. More specialization within the classes would go a long way here. Thirdly, I would make the faction side of things significantly more interesting. At the moment, there’s effectively a few big “classes” of faction trees, which means the overwhelming majority of heroes share their faction skill tree with approximately 25% of Heroes in the game. Instead, tweak it so every Faction has a specific skill tree that fits their individual lore. From there, I would also lock Hero selection down to your own faction, with minor faction heroes requiring ownership of that faction, and other race’s Heroes requiring either a diplomatic agreement, or control of the Academy. Lastly, and most importantly to me, I’d personally trade quantity of heroes, to quality of heroes. As I said earlier, many of the heroes have the exact same skill trees as one another, which means virtually none of them have any purpose. Removing the universal tree and putting in a Hero-specific one would give each hero a unique playstyle, and an opportunity for Amplitude to really make them pop. Imagine getting a certain ship class through this system, or a skill that no other hero in the game possesses… It could add so much to a currently underwhelming system. All this would of course require less heroes, given the amount of work required to tailor each one, but would also make for easy DLCs for Amplitude in the future, in addition to extremely satisfying mod options for modders to play with.

More interesting battle/invasion mechanics

I actually really like the hands-off approach Amplitude takes to battles in the Endless Space series, I think it’s cool to see your ships follow your orders to the best of their abilities, rather than just micromanaging your way to victory. However, the system suffers quite a few flaws. First up, is a relative lack of variety. Whether playing Cravers, Horatio or Sophon, you’re all drawing from the same option list. Imagine instead if certain tactics were reserved for certain factions, you’d have to account for that when planning your own strategy. On top of that though, a big push for balance should be considered for the next game. Now, I am not an “everything needs to be equal” player by any stretch – I don’t play multiplayer at all, and I frankly love the asymmetry of the Endless series. But having certain options that are straight up superior to one another isn’t the most fun, because it means it’s pretty much the only option you ever see used, by you or the AI. Lastly, all these changes would be meaningless if we don’t make the tactics a bit easier to peruse. Battle mechanics is one aspect of the game that is consistently hard to read in to, game after game.

Use your lore

A lot of things in Endless Space 2 were awesome call backs. Seeing the Sowers, Amoeba and Harmony still kicking around as Minor Factions was a decent nod back to them from the first Endless Space, so if you’re going to do another entry in the Endless Legend or Space series, use the awesome designs and lore you’ve come up with. Personally, I’d almost suggest not adding too much more new things to the lore, and instead flesh out the pre-existing lore even further. Imagine incredibly rich, complex minor factions that have their own technologies and ships, or seeing populations of Endless Legend factions dropped in to other planets and left to develop on their own.

That’s my list, what do you want or need to see in the next Endless game?

To be perfectly honest, I'd like Amp to break from their strategic roots and make a full-on open world RPG set in the Legend- or post-Legend-era of Auriga; a world decaying, major races scrabbling for dominance (or, means of escape from the planet), minor races caught in the crossfire, Endless ruins scattered everywhere, Fomorian sea-fortresses, colossal guardians roaming the land, and you're an <insert major race here> Academy mercenary looking for freedom and adventure rather than selling yourself to the highest bidder. Sounds like the setup for an Elder Scrolls title, just, you know, made by a company that somewhat cares about their consumerbase.

I agree ^

I'd love a nice Endless Space RPG. Or even a tactics game. Or a weird survival game where you have to escape a planet invaded by Cravers.

What about a colony building game?  The focus would be on a specific planet, with challenges and options based on it's biome and the native species.  You could frame it in the time period of the Lost, so you're ostensibly choosing which of the Lost to represent in your playthrough.  Conflicts, plagues, famine, natural or cosmic disasters could throw wrenches into your plans, whether those be to grow the civilizations on your surface or wipe them out so you can have some peace and quiet.  It could be an interesting take on the "god simulator" genre to play as a living planet, no?

What I'd like to see is a game that isn't rushed to market. Games that are pushed to market are typically imbalanced and full of bugs. These issues are made far worse with DLC's that introduce new content that can cause the imbalance or "OPness" to get much worse and/or introduce even more bugs that can make the game experience unbearable. DLC's also cause resentment since it puts an ever growing portion of the game behind a paywall and not every gamer out there is made of disposable income(I'm still running a computer with an Intel CPU that pre-dates Ivy Bridge(that's old folks)). So rather than go with a very generic base game with the intent of milking $$$ from DLC's, come out with a well thought out and polished game for a reasonable price that can be molded further by mods/plugins that the playerbase creates(and not creators of the game with the intent of putting it behind a paywall...). One game, as an example, that comes to mind is the old Escape Velocity series(first 2 were exclusively Mac games back in the day while 3rd was Windows capable). I sunk so many hours into those games its not even funny.... Good luck finding them though since Ambrosia is no longer active.

Some ideas or examples of features Id like to see in a new Space 4x are the following:

Heroes are mortal: One thing that rubbed me the wrong way on Endless Space 2 is that Heroes were basically immortal gods with skills that weren't categorized well. Although they could be "disabled" by being injured in combat(or via Hacking), they eventually come back with their abilities intact. One game that I think does it right on this front is Stellaris. They delegate Heroes or Leaders into 4 specific categories: Scientist, Admiral, General and Governor. Not only does that lead to Commanders or Heroes with abilities applicable to their role(unlike in ES2 where skill tree is divided into Fleet Admiral and Governor abilities, some of which are completely useless based on what assignment they have), it also gives them mortality since Heroes or Leaders in Stellaris eventually die off. Meaning a faction could be caught off guard during a transition period as their Leadership is replaced. Not only that but the abilities they have might be different than that of their predecessor, making games a bit more unpredictable.

Planetary Defenses: You honestly think Fleets and Orbital Defense platforms would be an Empire's only defense? What about Planetary defenses like Ion Cannons or Hypervelocity guns like in Empire at War? Shield Domes would also be a thing(see Star Wars Episode 1, Episode V or Star Wars Rebels Season 3 Episode 22) to protect against Orbital Bombardments. Meaning attacking an Empire would be a difficult thing if an Empire put in enough effort to fortify their worlds with not only orbital defenses(Space stations/defending fleets) but also planetary defenses. Basically takes Citadels and turns them into planetary improvements with a specific purpose. Also didn't make sense that an orbiting citadel(that's indestructible....) could send down 800 manpower to defend the planet despite a massive invading fleet in orbit... logic?!

Planet specialization: In Endless Space 2, what a planet produces is generally determined by the planet type(Hot Sterile = Industry rich). If you look at the Star Trek Universe, some of the best "Mining" or Industry planets weren't smoldering Char worlds(like Char in Starcraft) but often desolate moons or cold barren worlds. Even if they're not ideal for a specific specialization, it'd be nice to take any planet or moon and turn them into mining outposts/colonies as opposed to producing a pre-determined output. Namely if all we want is Industry/Mining systems and don't give a damn about Food, Science or Trade(Commerce), then damnit that's what we ought to get. Would mean the planet wouldn't grow very fast or rely on Food shipments to sustain it(making it vulnerable to sieges).

Real Time Gameplay: Although I'm fond of(and really used to) Turn Based 4x, I think having actions execute in real time is the way to go. Hence "Time" becomes a factor and can be the difference between reaching a destination in time or being late and suffering the consequences. An example from Stellaris is surveying a system and building an Outpost there to claim it. First Empire to build an Outpost wins and any delay, even by a day or two could be the difference. Pausing the game can give a player time to manage their Empire, making Single Player all but manageable. Where this would be an issue is Multiplayer and hence rules/terms would have to be ironed out to give players a chance to issue new orders. Then again there could be no terms in MP and hence its whatever goes in the wild wild universe(you thought I was going to say West... didn't you.... lol).

Will add or reply again if I have more to say.

Back with more ideas...

Fleet Formations: I'd like to see fleets being organized into formations. Circular formation is a classic example with the middle ship or ships being important, including the Flagship, and the rest of the fleet surrounding it to give it maximum support/protection. Naval fleets in WW2 often did Circular formations to protect Aircraft Carriers and this would be no different in a Space 4x. You'd have a strong Dreadnought or Carrier leading a fleet with a supporting cast of smaller vessels providing protection from enemy starfighters or projectiles/missiles. Other formations could be Double Column(2 vertical lines or "||"), Diagonal(kind of like "\\" or "//") or Vertical(single vertical line). Formation you pick could yield certain offensive and defensive perks and any Commander you assign to the Fleet is always on the Flagship(so protecting it is of utmost importance).

AI Combat: One thing I actually like about ES2 is that combat is taken out of the player's control when it actually takes place. If a new game is to be made I'd like that to continue so that its the choices the player makes before-hand that dictates how their fleet does in battle. Otherwise it becomes an RTS if there is active combat and not everyone is cut out to do Micro(an RTS term for those unfamiliar that basically means actively controlling your forces in battle to maximize their effect/minimize losses). However... when it comes to ES2, the AI never upgrades their weapons or defenses on their ships. I mean once I get Tier 1 Strategic's(Titanium or Hyperium) installed on my ships, I win like 99% of my fights against the AI on max difficulty(if not 100%). If I get Tier 2 Strategic(Adamantium/Antimatter), its a slaughter from that point and I never lose.

Azure_Fang wrote:

To be perfectly honest, I'd like Amp to break from their strategic roots and make a full-on open world RPG set in the Legend- or post-Legend-era of Auriga; a world decaying, major races scrabbling for dominance (or, means of escape from the planet), minor races caught in the crossfire, Endless ruins scattered everywhere, Fomorian sea-fortresses, colossal guardians roaming the land, and you're an <insert major race here> Academy mercenary looking for freedom and adventure rather than selling yourself to the highest bidder. Sounds like the setup for an Elder Scrolls title, just, you know, made by a company that somewhat cares about their consumerbase.

Daynen wrote:

What about a colony building game?  The focus would be on a specific planet, with challenges and options based on it's biome and the native species.  You could frame it in the time period of the Lost, so you're ostensibly choosing which of the Lost to represent in your playthrough.  Conflicts, plagues, famine, natural or cosmic disasters could throw wrenches into your plans, whether those be to grow the civilizations on your surface or wipe them out so you can have some peace and quiet.  It could be an interesting take on the "god simulator" genre to play as a living planet, no?

melkathi wrote:

I'd love a nice Endless Space RPG. Or even a tactics game. Or a weird survival game where you have to escape a planet invaded by Cravers.

Just wanted to say: I would absolutely play any of these three suggestions, they all sound awesome.

i think a open world rpg would be dope, or a tactics game sort of like xcom
a tcg would be pretty cool too

Endless Autochess

killjoy463 wrote:

i think a open world rpg would be dope, or a tactics game sort of like xcom
a tcg would be pretty cool too

Aye, would pay good money for that.

Sublustris wrote:

Endless Autochess

Doesn't turn my crank one iota, but I'm sure some folks would love it!

Having Amplitude break from their 4X strategy roots is a good idea. It's why I'm looking forward to Endless Dungeon even if it treads semi-familiar ground. 

People already suggested RPGs and something like Mass Effect 1 set in the Endless Universe sounds way too good to not wish for. That being said, I'd take plenty of other things if they put their best efforts into it and picked the right engine for the job.

Maybe I'm just being basic, but an Endless Space 3 would be great, with enhanced space battles, more factions, and more freedom for modding.

Medve wrote:

Having Amplitude break from their 4X strategy roots is a good idea. It's why I'm looking forward to Endless Dungeon even if it treads semi-familiar ground. 

People already suggested RPGs and something like Mass Effect 1 set in the Endless Universe sounds way too good to not wish for. That being said, I'd take plenty of other things if they put their best efforts into it and picked the right engine for the job.

Mass Endless.

Endless Effect?

itsyaboi wrote:

Maybe I'm just being basic, but an Endless Space 3 would be great, with enhanced space battles, more factions, and more freedom for modding.

Ain't a problem with me. I want the same thing.

Endless Horatio

Build up more cans to clone more PERFECT Horatio to occupy the Endless galaxy.

a shipfighting game. (endless Fleet?)

I'd love to see XP system that isn't drowned in mechanics bypassing its intended accumulation process through combat.

A sci-fi RPG (multiplayer or singleplayer) set in the Endless space setting

If they make a endless space 3, the faction comeback are:

-United Empire

-Riftborns

-Umbral Choir

-Sophons

-Exileds

-Hishos

-Cravers

-Vodyani

For the Hero question, I don't mind having them in the game,

maybe the can have the total war treatment were they can be killed but can unlock a skill further along the way that makes them immortal (can be tied to the lore, like a special cloning technology or something)

I would like them to be more unique with their skill tree. Instead of 4 class skill tree, a race skill tree and a generic one, you could have a specialized class, a more race specific skill tree and maybe another tied to the personality of the hero.

Voilà

A not shit alliance system.

No alliance system

Yes. An Endless Universe RPG or MMORPG.

The gameplay would be :

First part / Tutoriel on a Quasi-Sterile Auriga. You're one of the last native or a lost explorer, your goal is to leave the planet.

Leveling : You explore some "unique" planets of the lore, meet a lot of species.

Endgame : Something like GW2, with many gameplay styles and without a race to stuff.

If another 4X were made (ES3, EL2, or otherwise) I would like to see some serious cutting down of "fiddly" elements. Things like needing to delve into several submenus for certain functions or having to manage heroes as often as you do.

I'd also love to see more "Maximalism" with design. Crank up the asymmetry between factions to an even greater extent and make them play super different from each other. Maybe even different victory conditions for different factions? Balance-wise this would be a nightmare to figure out but it would allow the colorful personality of the Endless Universe to shine through.

Maybe I have been spoiled by Total War: Warhammer 2 but also having different UI skins for each faction would be a small wishlist item (though this can spoil readability). On a similar note, with Total War: Warhammer 3 on the horizon and it basically printing money for CA I would love to see a Total War game from them in the Endless Universe ;)

A turn-based strategy is more turn-based, then RTS, what a shocker!

Enable timers if you are looking for intense gameplay.

Groo wrote:

No alliance system

Step One: Select the Craver faction.

Step Two: There is no step two. =P

Storors wrote:

Yes. An Endless Universe RPG or MMORPG.

The gameplay would be :

First part / Tutoriel on a Quasi-Sterile Auriga. You're one of the last native or a lost explorer, your goal is to leave the planet.

Leveling : You explore some "unique" planets of the lore, meet a lot of species.

Endgame : Something like GW2, with many gameplay styles and without a race to stuff.

I would be so incredibly down for an RPG in the Endless universe. They could even skip Auriga and put it on one of the other important Endless Worlds, with you playing as a Hero from the Academy. 

Doodlegoop wrote:

If another 4X were made (ES3, EL2, or otherwise) I would like to see some serious cutting down of "fiddly" elements. Things like needing to delve into several submenus for certain functions or having to manage heroes as often as you do.

I'd also love to see more "Maximalism" with design. Crank up the asymmetry between factions to an even greater extent and make them play super different from each other. Maybe even different victory conditions for different factions? Balance-wise this would be a nightmare to figure out but it would allow the colorful personality of the Endless Universe to shine through.

Maybe I have been spoiled by Total War: Warhammer 2 but also having different UI skins for each faction would be a small wishlist item (though this can spoil readability). On a similar note, with Total War: Warhammer 3 on the horizon and it basically printing money for CA I would love to see a Total War game from them in the Endless Universe ;)

Agreed top to bottom. And as for your final point, I have a Youtube channel about Total Warhammer, and one of the series I've been running is "Where to go after Game 3". The Endless universe is next on the list for that series. Great minds think alike, eh?

I hope modifiers aren't arbitrarily delineated into affinities and traits.

i want a game that establishes the state of the official galaxy, and its history, we've only gotten glimpses of those, either through quests, hero information, and the short story comics, its been up to us to mainly interpret what the state of the endless galaxy is actually in with the amount of information we have on it, so a game that gives what the devs consider as the actual state of the galaxy would be cool.

would love to get more lore on Vaulters and the Mezari. Every game we have learned more and im loving it. also more on the endless themselves.

Storors wrote:

Yes. An Endless Universe RPG or MMORPG.

The gameplay would be :

First part / Tutoriel on a Quasi-Sterile Auriga. You're one of the last native or a lost explorer, your goal is to leave the planet.

Leveling : You explore some "unique" planets of the lore, meet a lot of species.

Endgame : Something like GW2, with many gameplay styles and without a race to stuff.

that would be cool.

Hmm maybe a community. that has better communication and not about 6k in unanswered threads. Loyal fans that help others with problems, errors or even help play test and complete mods. That's something I would like to see. 

Shall a new 4X in the Endless Universe be made, I think what would be important to me is a better modeled economy.

A more intricated one, for starters. Why should every city, every colony be self-sufficient on food production for instance? How about trade routes bringing food from a specialised planet having a surplus? What if these trade routes could be pillaged? What would happen in the event of a blocade of a dependent planet during a siege? What if maintaining the trade route going supposed an employed pop from both settlements?

A more visible effect of trade in strategy games - and a true depiction of it as a huge logistical weakness - would give players a real impact on its enemies' economy. I find pillaging tiles often lackluster to handicap another race/civilization development or ability to wage wars. How about using mobility to launch "chevauchee" style attacks deep in enemy lines, targeting poorly protected traders and killing/stealing pops?

And a bit of a more complex economy, also. It doesn't make sense, in the late game, to be swimming in Dust as you keep ramping up your economy while your upkeep costs stagnates; money tends to become a currency you are rarely lacking. In my view, it takes away a huge part of the decision making, as this economy-meter quickly becomes a matter of no-concern.

To conclude, maybe espionage systems could target economy and trade with a greater efficiency, offering means of sabotage that really do a difference in a nation's prosperity, to increase foreign commerce gains or steal a part of it. It's no mystery that nowadays, economic intelligence plays a big role in international relations. I would definitely like to see this represented in the games I enjoy to play.