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7 years ago
May 1, 2018, 8:38:22 PM

Ships for Peace – not War!


Civilian Ship - Gradan Hull Class


Ships should have a greater versatility beyond military. There are certainly any number of reasons I could think of for space explorers to build ships that don't involve blowing things up, but there is currently no game mechanic for ecologist ships that are built to terraform planets, or religious ships that spread the gospel (playing someone other than Vodyani).


What if industry ships could mine asteroid belts and return to fledgling systems with a haul of raw materials (industry) – or science ships research black holes and provide a big one time science time boost? Or they could orbit around an interesting anomaly and provide a small boost until the anomaly is completely understood (+x science for x turns while actively researching).


Influence based ships could traverse the known galaxy touting the virtues of their civilization– A spacefaring tour, if you will, for the greater (Religious) good, with amount of influence based on distance traveled and/or other major and minor factions encountered on the trip. In similar fashion, pacifists could conduct trade missions. Return home and boom! Mega loot! Get destroyed on the way? Sorry about your bad luck and lost booty.


If a political affiliation was attached to each of these actions / modules, this would also offer an easy and straightforward way for players to directly influence the desired political party, and I for one, want more options to do this.


Module / Political Affiliation Overview


  • Pacifists - Create Wormholes Lanes / Trade Missions  
  • Militarist – Steal Resources
  • Scientist - Research Special Nodes & Anomalies 
  • Industrialist – Industry Transport / Planet & Node mining 
  • Ecologists - Minor Faction Propagation / New Terraforming Options / Food Harvest
  • Religious – Religious Conversion / Main Faction Propagation / Spacefaring Tour


Different special nodes could have different bonuses for mining, similar to planets. An uncolonized system could be mined for luxury or strategic resources, providing you have the right tech.


A significant strategic element could be added by ‘stealing’ resources from a blockaded system, or linking two faraway places via wormhole! Don’t just stop your enemy from producing Orichalcix… take it! 


These modules would be standard support modules and added to a new buildable civilian ship - gradan class. Additional research options should be added to upgrade the number and/or effectiveness of the modules.


I realize the ideas above have some game balance issues. They are just a starting point and could use tweaking. The point is, there should be more reasons to build ships than just destroying your enemy (mid to late game)


Special Ship Modules Expanded:


Modules for each of the following actions would be available through a module that is added to an existing technology [For example Research Special Nodes could be added to the Prev-scale Accelerators technology]. I’ll use the following format for ease of reading.


[Edit from Kitkun comments] - To reduce potential micro with some ships below a Route Planner feature could utilize the Trade Scan view to make preset routes that could be selected instead of using movement selection. An auto explore type option should also be available.


Module / Action Type (Political Affinity) ­ Technology Quadrant [tech level]

Description


Trade ship missions (Pacifists) Empire [2] – 

A ship would ‘launch’ from a system with a planned route, selected ahead of time. Trade mission modules could be loaded with luxury and/or strategic resources, and dust is earned for visiting major factions in cold war, peace or alliance and minor factions with positive relationships. The amount of dust increases based on distance traveled, resource tier (Tier 1/2/3), resource Qty, and relationship status (Alliance>peace>cold war). Additionally, the amount of dust earned from each faction stop depends on the distance away from the launch point of the trade ship (farther is better). 


Cargo will be sold automatically at each stop point so the ship will return with the cargo modules empty. Depending on desired complexity, minor races could have pre-set resource preferences and major races could provide the player with preferences for resources, depending on in-game needs. Destroying a trade ship would grant the attacker 1/2 the dust carried resources still on board.


Create Wormholes (Pacifists) Empire [4]– 

two ships would be able to create a wormhole between them. Each must have the module, and the larger the distance, the more modules required. It would take a minimum of 5 turns to create, with x turns added for distance. Trade networks could be established through these wormholes to bypass hostile factions and pirates. 


Steal Resources (Militarist) Military [3]– 

As said by velorace “If you invade a system, you will "drain" from your opponent [or pirate / minor faction] all the resources he is producing on the planets he already colonized and is producing resources [from], but you will only drain those resources from that system your invading (whit specific militarist module) if he has the research for that strategic and is able to harvest it. Consider this as opportunity to harvest quadrinix in key situations even if you don’t have the research to do so. This would open opportunity to a deeper strategical gameplay in the game!” – perfect. This is exactly what I meant


Research Special Nodes / Anomalies (Scientist) Science [2&4]– [Tech 2] 

Special nodes can be orbited using a ship with the research module to further examine the unique properties of that node, and once completed, it provides a single large science boost. The length of time depends on the number of science modules present and the science boost depends on the quality of the node (a new quality that would have to be added to the nodes). Nebulas might provide more benefit than asteroids, for instance. Anomalies can be studied for a small continuous science boost to the system for x turns, where x is based on the anomaly (some can be researched for a long time, and some are simple, thus have shorter durations). 


[Tech 4] Anomaly Upgrade -Great idea velorace! – advanced science modules can amplify the anomaly benefits by combining a ship (or multiple ships) with terraforming and science modules to upgrade its effects permanently! The module should cost tier 3 resources and be expended upon use.


Industry Transport (Industrialist  Economy [2&3] – [Tech 2] 

The module would have a max industry capacity, similar to manpower, which would be filled as a percentage of the total industry of a system (Or a new build option could be implemented to fill the module instead of producing ships / buildings). The ship could travel to another colonized system or an ally system to deliver the stored industry. Multiple modules can be combined to increase total stored industry. If the ship is destroyed, so it the industry. [Tech 3] Total Storage capacity increased.


Node / Planet Mining (Industrialist ) Economy [2&3] – [Tech 2] 

A ship with a mining module could orbit a node or uncolonized planet and extract luxury and strategic resources at a rate of ¼ that planets output / turn per module to a max of ½. A module can hold a maximum of 10 resources (luxury and strategic) combined. The proper resource tech must be researched to extract it, but the planet does not need to be colonizable. The ships must return to a colonized planet for the resources to be received. When multiple resources are available, the player may select what to mine. Industry may also be mined but must be combined with an industry transport module. [Tech 3] Resource capacity is increased to 20 and a max of ¾ total output from a system is available (3 modules total). Industry mining rates for nodes and planets are increased.


Food harvest (Ecologists) Empire [2] – 

Similar to mining for industry, except it could only happen on planets with food production. Food could then be transported to colonized systems.


Minor Faction Propagation (Ecologists) Empire [3] – 

An upgrade to the food harvest module, selected foods specialized for specific minor factions can be harvested. Each minor faction would have a preference of which planet type the food came from, and when delivered to a system would increase the chance a member of that minor faction would be produced next.


Increase Terraforming Options (Ecologists) Science [3] – 

ships with this module would be able to terraform planets backwards and with more options than the current system allows for. Ship must remain in orbit for the duration of construction. Multiple modules may be required.


Spacefaring tour (Hero Point Generation) (ReligiousEmpire [2] – 

Mechanics work the same as for the trade ship mission, except instead of dust, influence is earned. Additionally, hero points are gained relating to the factions visited (you are inspiring their heroes to come to you).


Major Faction Propagation (Religious) Empire [3] – 

Must have at least 2 colonized systems. One influence per turn is accrued (regardless of # of modules) while in orbit to a max of 5 per module. This influence is received when the player moves the ship from one system to another, and the likelihood of producing a major faction population in that system is increased relative to the amount of influence gained.


Religious conversion (Religious) Empire [3] – 

This works like a combination of siege and colonization. A ship must orbit a system for x turns (somewhere between 10 and 30), spending influence to slowly convert its citizens. If the ship leaves orbit, conversion progress reduces at twice the speed it is gained. As a boost, spacefaring tours can dump their influence on the system under conversion, and if the orbiting ship is hero led, a boost is also applied. Religoious heroes get the biggest boost. 

A colony that is converted becomes fully under control (not rebelling) of the new owner in ½ the time as normal and starts at 30% happiness, rather than 0%.

Updated 2 days ago.
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Implemented

The IMPLEMENTED status designates ideas that have been implemented in the game.

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

DEV The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

status updated 5 years ago

While they are not small hulls, the Behemoths can be used for various economic purposes.

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6 years ago
Jul 27, 2018, 12:48:44 PM

@ Kitkun


Valid criticism for sure. The game can already be a little micro heavy, so adding more could get tedious. I like the option of an Auto-explore like button that says, just go do things! I could also imagine a route planner button which could utilize the trade scan view (This would actually be nice, because who uses this thing?!?). There different routes could be planned and saved and then these routes could simply be assigned to ships.


So it would go sometihng like this: Build a ship - set a home base (where the ship comes and leaves from) - add cargo - select planned route - go!).


-or-


build a ship, (default home base is set as place of construction), add cargo (or don't), press auto explore.


I'll update the OP with said edits. Thanks!!

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6 years ago
May 24, 2018, 2:09:46 PM

This would be a great change to the game! Hope the devs pick this up and implement it! I always have one or two probe fleets and what feels like several thousand military ships, different ships and approaches to harvesting resources would be a great addition!

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6 years ago
May 29, 2018, 12:32:44 PM

The idea has gone through several revisions now. Some of the new civilian ships could have a BIG impact, such as creating new wormhole lanes, or stealing enemy resources, while others are more fun - spacefaring tours, new terraforming options. 


We are really looking at a whole lot of ideas here with many more that could be added, and easily some taken away. The real idea is a new civilian ship class that does cool stuff (and doesn't blow tihngs blow things up). These are just some of my thoughts of what these civ ships could do. 


So what do YOU think are the best civilian ship ideas?


 My favorites are the trade mission ships and science modules. I also really like the idea of religious conversion, but I'm still not convinced on how that should work. 


Let's get a new ship class in this game!

Updated 6 years ago.
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6 years ago
May 30, 2018, 6:10:09 PM

I think you better make a forum post asking for a new civillian ship design. I also believe that "civillian ship" is not really a good name for these ship classes... it seems like it is carrying "civilians" but civilizans are... pop? These ships carry modules, not pop. I believe that if you rename civilian ships to Traveller ship designs, it would sound more pacific, and more atmospheric to the theme you are trying to create. Travellers  are a more peacefull approach of the normal military ship designs, and as the name says, they Travel across the galaxy, spreading peace (mostly) and expanding your empire as they Travel. Traveller ship designs seems the best idea for you by now. 


Also, when you say best civilian ships ideas... you mean, you want to create a new ship design, or you want to ask me what is the best Traveller ship module combination? Just to make sure :) 


Also, congrats on your Religious Conversion idea. It is pretty good by now. It almosts make me want to convert a system using influence and religious power only to expand my empire better :) 


Would feel great to put a civillian / Traveller ship on a system, place a huge fleet above them that the enemy cannot beat and guard it, and just say: La la la. Soon you will be mine! ;D 


Really liking this idea so far :D

Updated 6 years ago.
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6 years ago
Jun 8, 2018, 1:17:00 PM

Good call Velorace - Here is a thread. For civilian, I was thinking more along the lines of civilian vs. Military. In the US, and military personell who get a job outside the service are working in the civilian area, or as a civilian. So it's not a term meaning population, rather a distinction in the purpose of the mission. but really, I wouldn't care what it was called, if they would add it to the game 

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6 years ago
Jun 8, 2018, 7:12:15 PM

OOOh yeah! i haven't thought it following that term! Good call, Zyantree! i will try to update my ideas. 


But i thought you where requesting a civillian Ship design? 

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6 years ago
Jun 18, 2018, 11:51:39 AM

No comments from any devs yet... maybe if we get to 1,000,000 pts? past 800k now.


Or maybe is we start a chant. Ci-vi-ship... Ci-vi-ship...Ci-vi-Ship... 


Okay maybe not lol

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6 years ago
Jun 18, 2018, 12:54:26 PM

They're likely focused on upcoming tests for the next expansion, they may touch base once that begins wrapup. Meanwhile, I'm working on my idea for unlockable Heroes, and faction variants.

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6 years ago
Jul 9, 2018, 7:25:51 PM

This is an idea I very much like, as there's very limited ways to affect other systems outside of your influence, aside from blockade, and open up new gameplay options. Might even be able to repurpose models of some of the pirate ships to cut down on the work. And perhaps integrate with existing features such as trade companies, or even add whole new ones.


I do have some criticism though, and that's that some of these would be awfully micro-heavy. Planning out a trade route every time or moving an influence ship every few turns would get very tiring for players who like long games. I'd recommend adapting something like the explore command to seek out useful planets/resources/etc or just being able to set up looping routes.

Updated 6 years ago.
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6 years ago
Jul 21, 2018, 5:11:15 PM
Kitkun wrote:

This is an idea I very much like, as there's very limited ways to affect other systems outside of your influence aside from blockade and open up new gameplay options. Might even be able to repurpose models of some of the pirate ships to cut down on the work. And perhaps integrate with existing features such as trade companies, or even add whole new ones.


I do have some criticism though, and that's that sime of these would be awfully micro-heavy. Planning out a trade route every time or moving an influence ship every few turns would get very tiring for players who like long games. I'd recommend adapting something like the explore command to seek out useful planets/resources/etc or just setting up looping routes.

Hey good idea! To reduce micro-management you could create another screen where you could automate the whole process of moving these ships, or only create an automatic button to influence the most nearby system, or something like that.

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6 years ago
May 23, 2018, 11:39:05 PM

Good job, zyntree. I believe whit some civilian ships or (Travellers) it will be posssible to place a fixed amount of modules in them, and ensure that it has some sort of atmosphere (like i told you) And make your idea better. :)

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6 years ago
Jul 27, 2018, 9:45:32 PM
Zyntree wrote:


I'll update the OP with said edits. Thanks!

That reminds me that it would be quite nice to make your own trade routes and not have pop ups about blockades so often. The Anno series of games has good trade route creation capabilities: Create route, assign ships, set what cargo you want to buy/sell at each place. And AI trade units would visit your ports and fulfill standing buy/sell orders to keep stock at a certain level. And incidentally your response reminds me of another idea I'd like to see.

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6 years ago
Aug 21, 2018, 9:36:43 PM

Aren't behemoths like 75% of what this idea purposes? :/

Updated 6 years ago.
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6 years ago
Aug 27, 2018, 4:12:58 PM
Despell wrote:

Good idea, but with the latest DLC the Leviathan cover some of these points.

Sad :<

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Implemented

The IMPLEMENTED status designates ideas that have been implemented in the game.

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

DEV The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

status updated 5 years ago

While they are not small hulls, the Behemoths can be used for various economic purposes.

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5 years ago
Oct 8, 2019, 12:39:54 PM

Very cool Cat-o-Nine-Tails! Great to hear that :D. I will have to go check it out. I just began playing again and I don't have the Behemoths yet, but I've got to get em and check this out now :)

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6 years ago
May 15, 2018, 4:39:56 PM

Even though I didn't read absolutely everything, the couple of ideas I saw are absolutely great and should be in the game !

I personally think (sorry in advance if you said it already, I'll edit it out if you did) that ships could also be used to be stationned in systems to reduce disapproval rates, forcing them on a minimum to avoid complete rebellion.

Aside from my personnal note, it's a great idea that is sure to give a whole new dimension to ES 2 if added, which seems mandatory in my opinion, even though it would bring more micro management with the trade ships you mentionned (I guess it could do something automaticaly like giving a set amount of ressource/ luxury per turn to a fleet of trading ships and getting something else in return in a couple of turns, or even adding an "intercept trading ships" mechanic, like taking its holds or capturing them and ransoming the faction that sent them to get them back ? Maybe I'm going too far, but it could be a Craver-only mechanic)


Edit : seems like you didn't mention it, so I guess it's another idea that could get thrown in this thread !

Updated 6 years ago.
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