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Strategy and tactics in battles

Space BattlesShip DesignMilitary

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7 years ago
Mar 20, 2018, 7:15:19 AM

ATM, preperation for battles is essentially instantaneous. You see an enemy fleet, you insta retorfit if you have dust and change your card and positions in the battle screen.


What I propose is seperating "tactics" from longer term strategy.

How?

Certain changes to ships and cards should be possible to do fast while others should take more time.

How to acheive this?


1) Add more cards, change them and divide them into 3 card types. 

The player will be able to combine 3 cards, one from every card type(as soon as he has 3 cards to use).

During battle, you will only be able to change 1 card for a price, based on the cost of your fleet in that battle. Changing cards outside of battle will also cost time and only one card will be able to be changed at a time. Changing a card might take 1 or more turns.


2) Retrofitting ships should take time based on how many parts a ship type needs to retrofit.

This mans you can't just immidiately retrofit your ships. Retrofitting ships should be able to move after initializing the retrofitting procedure. 

So, if you retorfit one part then perhaps it will be instantaneous or only take one turn but if you want to retrofit more parts then it will take longer. 


Why do this at all? 

To create a certain feeling of continuity in strategy while still allowing some flexibility. This will add more depth to combat and will create interesting dynamics for espionage and for deciding who to fight because you might be at a bigger disadvantage versus certain races and their current fleet strategy.

It will also remove the clunky way in which it works now where every battle can essentially be you using some completely different stratgey from 1-2 turns before. It will also have the framework to solve probe abuse.

Updated 2 months ago.
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7 years ago
Apr 23, 2018, 1:48:40 AM

Hello father. Answering what you just said in my idea trend, i will post it here so i can give you some small feedback for your idea. Hope it helps 


Hello father. I like some concepts of your idea and i believe there are some points in which our ideas connect to each other, but i believe there are a few flaws whit your current idea, in which im going to state: 


1- More cards whit more specific orders 


Thats a great variable to the game i would like to see in play. Also whit battle cards related to ship sizes, we can create countless different variants of battle cards for the game that could be upgraded whit other research stages, and make gameplay whit those battle cards better. 


2- Ability to use more than one card 


If battle cards would be multiple in a single battle, how the lanes in space battles works? will you merge the lanes of battle cards? i dont think such term is necessary, yet. 


3-Changing cards should take time and should be gradual. Meaning? That if you are using 3 cards you cannot just change them all. You have to change one card at a time and it has a cooldown. 


Why? 


4- Card Levels


It seems like a good idea, but isn't the good part of gameplay focused in making people able to change their cards instead of keeping them? I believe that the more people can change their battle cards to adapt to the current situation they have, the more the game would be diversified and more intuitive. Why you believe the game would be better if we could change the cards less?


About the combination of cards in game, i dont see why they are necessary. Why we need to combine battle cards? to get more bonueses for battles? isn't one bonus enough instead of 3:


Retrofitting ships should talke time. 


Why retrofitting ships should take time? isn't it good enough having the ability of retrofitting your ship every time you need to counter attack the enemy fleet? Isn't great part of joy in multiplayer come from retrofitting your ship fast enough to counter another fleet tatic so you can beat it? 


Why do this at all? 

To create a certain feeling of continuity in strategy while still allowing some flexibility. 


Aren't you making the game more limited instead of flexible whit those changes? i don't get it... 

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7 years ago
Apr 25, 2018, 6:32:16 PM

The idea is to not have cards and retrofiting be THAT flexible so that you can more easily predict what your enemy will have. Together with have more cards and changing what cards do there will be a strategic continuation that can be changed but not compeltely in one turn...This way each can anticiopate a bit what other guy is doing so its not so random. 

To have good interactivity you need to allow players to smei predict what the other guy has but not completely so you still have space for pyschologicla games.

If you can retorfit immidiately and change cards immidiately there is no interaction except seeing enemy invasion force and retrofitting and thats it. There i no long term war strategy.

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7 years ago
Apr 27, 2018, 9:16:04 PM

Ooooooh. now im understanding it. the trick is to make things harder to change so people dont clearly change from one thing to another at any random time, like for example: 


"Enemy ship has 20 missles and 20 kinetic slugs. In order to counter him, i will place 15 kinetic slugs and 25 beams if he has no energy defense, or 40 kinetic slugs if he has it" 


Then thats the retrofit ship design tatic you are planning: to make this feature more difficult to implement in game, so fleets can`t instantily retrofit their ships so they need to "work out" whit what they currently has, right? 


So, here is my tip father: Do not make retrofitting ships more difficult. thats a core point of the endless space mechanic, in which, i believe, makes space battles more unique and much more tatical. removing such feature or making it difficult to retrofit your ship could cause serious trouble in the game, because... well, in the tatical game, its better when you are able to instantily change your ship to whatever you desire, because, THAT is tatic and strategy. whiteout this ability, things would work closer and closer to "lack of consistency" in space battles, which is very bad for the game, i believe. 


But now the card tatic: hmmmmm, it can be a good idea. but you still have to take in the factor that, the problem of those battle cards, are not How you utilize them, but according to my idea, the battle cards themselves. what is the point of having 95 different battle cards you can use if only 3 are usefull in 100% of all space battles? hm? 


So, thats a point you should also attempt to work on man. We need to find good battle cards for the game that have significant impact on choices, and mostly, all time. not some battle cards that are only usefull in specific VERY RARE  situation because, what is the point of creating a logical gimmerick of "I will use this card! HAHA! " if there are nearly to 3 choices to choose from? :/ Not cool man...

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7 years ago
Apr 27, 2018, 9:19:48 PM

Here is a tip: You could help me to think about new types of battle cards we can create that functions like my idea, in a upgradable system of some sort. Think of it: What type of cards could be usefull in game that would have significant impact, but in a very strategical way? 


think about most types of bonueses that would help to increase the strategy level of space battles and make a list of them. that way you can help me develop my idea, Upgradable Battle cards. 


https://www.games2gether.com/endless-space-2/ideas/1818-upgradable-battle-cards

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