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Improvement of Alliance System

Diplomacy

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7 years ago
Dec 5, 2017, 10:24:56 AM

Hi. I think about some improvements in the alliance system. Here are some problems I experienced about Alliance:

  1. When I played with Lumeris, I made several trade agreements with various empire. But my alliance declared war so half of my agreements became null.
  2. I prepared to attack my neighbor riftborn. but suddenly he became one of my alliance.
  3. I declared war against Lumeris, but my alliance instantly formed a peace treaty.
  4. I was so angry with the alliance system that I wanted to play without alliance, but all four survivors were allied, I had to fight against the galaxy.


I thought of three goals to improve.

  1. Alliance means a military alliance, but it is not necessary to participate in the war of the alliance.
  2. Important problems (such as war, peace, new member joins) are decided together though meetings.
  3. The alliance may be lifted at any time, and other empires may be deported from the alliance.


Specific amendments are as follows. Meeting occurs when important matters happen. Through this meeting, we confirm everyone’s opinion and carry out work. The process of the meeting is as follows.

  1. propose the agenda.
  2. Each empire set their opinion. There are five kinds of opinion.
    1. Propose – It is the person who proposed the agenda. It means strongly agree with the agenda.
    2. Agree – agree with the agenda. If you adopt this opinion, the empire opposing the agenda hates you
    3. Neutral – not interested in this issue.
    4. Object – object to the agenda.
    5. Oppose – strongly opposes the agenda. if this agenda is accepted, this empire will leave the alliance. If there is an empire that has adopted this opinion, other empires hesitate to agree. Proposer and opponents hate each other.
  3. the proposer and opponents can change other empire’s opinion by giving gifts(other opinion: The Empire that agree or object can not change its opinion, it means only neutral opinion can be changed.)
  4. Agenda will be accepted or rejected depending on the conclusion of the meeting.


The agenda includes war declaration, defense support, truce, new empire join, empire expulsion. According to each agenda, opinion can be changed. For example, opinions in the agenda for the new empire to join the alliance is as above. but in the agenda for expulse empire from the alliance, the opponent empire forms a new alliance with the expulsed empire.


Here are opinions for declaration of war.

  1. Propose – It is the person who proposed the agenda. declare war.
  2. Military support – Participate in the war.
  3. Economic support – Don’t participate in the war. Supports dust, manpower or strategic resources to empires that participate in the war. Trade or research agreements with enemy empire will remain because it is not declaration of war.
  4. Object – object to the war. 
  5. Oppose – If war is declared, this empire will leave the alliance.

Agenda: [Defense support] only works when we are declared war. Basically, it is like declaring war, but there are some differences. First, the empire that proclaimed the war becomes a proposer. An empire that choose economic support receives an influence penalty. proposer will hate economic support. Third, you can’t object. Fourth, an empire that oppose leaves the alliance and receives massive influence penalty.


Adding some agendas will make alliance system more interesting. One of them is about the alliance policy. it is a policy that applies to the entire alliance. It is not bad that this polices require influences, but it would be better to have a strong bonus and penalty.

Updated 3 months ago.
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7 years ago
Dec 5, 2017, 11:51:04 AM

I view alliances more like a UN-style treaty in order to prevent internal wars and protect from external wars. If someone's being attacked, they might want to be protected under it, and if the entire body other than you attacks, you've been overruled.


That being said, some kind of internal politics system would be nice so it's not just "well, I decide what we all do".

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7 years ago
Dec 5, 2017, 12:49:20 PM

Alliance still protect its member. if you don’t want to save invaded ally, you must leave the alliance and receive massive influence penalty. Even if you provide economic support, you will receive influence penalty and your invaded ally may propose to deport you. Because it is a clear betrayal that the alliance does not help when attacked, the alliance will help the invaded empire.

But when the alliance attacks, the situation is completely different. Your friend does not perish without help. Therefore, even if you do not participate in the war, you are not driven out of the alliance. Of course, if you do not help, some of your alliance dislike you. If you are concerned about your relationship with the alliance, you may be able to provide economic support. This is not a declaration of war, so it does not hurt the relationship with the enemy of the alliance.

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7 years ago
Dec 5, 2017, 9:59:41 PM

There should be no uniliateral dessionmaking in allience politics, every memeber must have the right of veto.

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7 years ago
Dec 6, 2017, 9:27:26 AM

This is a very neat way of managing alliances. I love this. It makes your stance clear, and the AI considers opinions of friends first. Perhaps influence can be used as a currency to change opinioins on a resolution? 


Perhaps an alliance member can make a single unilateral war, but in order to get his alliance on board he has to go through the steps you describe. Propose, vote, reconsider (factions giving gifts or analysing effects of other members' positions), enact. 


This is a good way to prevent alliances from simply becoming conglomerates. It would be healthy for alliances themselves to rise and fall. 


One thing that should be added is ways for one alliance - or single faction - to help the breakup of an alliance. Perhaps a peace treaty should give the option of the loser leaving an alliance, or perhaps joining it. 


What would be nice is the ability to kick a member out of the war. If you have a war against an alliance, then putting significant pressure on one of their members should give you the option - if they accept - of switching to neutral. You shouldn't have to conquer a faction to force an alliance to break up. 

Updated 7 years ago.
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7 years ago
Dec 6, 2017, 11:53:42 AM

Thank you for your interest in my idea. It may be a good idea to use influence to change opinions on a resolution. Or we could put diplomatic pressure on it.


I agree that there should be a way to divide other alliance. I have added a situation in which the alliance is engaged in internal strife, but if it can not be intervened outside, the alliance will still look static. If spies are added to Endless Space 2, it would be a good thing that the Spy would alienate the alliance.

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7 years ago
Dec 6, 2017, 5:54:42 PM

Alliance espionage is a brilliant idea. 


Alliances really give a great opportunity for deeper diplomacy/politics. In one of my ideas I suggested that perhaps there should arise leaders within an alliance. Perhaps if you have dominant influence over all members then you should gain more alliance actions, such as forcing a member to leave and overriding vetos (which they should put back in the game). With this idea and your idea the AI has to gain a more negative opinion of you whenver you propose or enforce something against their interests. Perhaps in your idea if an AI "strongly objects" (leaves) then his relations with the alliance should decrease while increasing relations with whoever the resolution is against. Factions voting together for or against a resolution should also increase in relationship. 


I love your idea, it makes alliance diplomacy effective while preventing it from becoming muddy. Espionage will add a new layer to this. 

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