Hi there,



first off: Great Game!! Finally a game that really is a worthy successor to Moo2



However... if there was one thing, only one thing, that I would change, then I know what it would be. The only area where Moo2 is still clearly ahead is the wonderful old ship combat (shield facings, weapon diversity, special abilities ... a dream). On the other hand, I like playing Endless Space with friends in MP. And I don't want a change that results in 15 minute battles, or even longer. So, instead I'd borrow an idea I've seen in Dominions. Namely the ability to write combat scripts (call them battle orders, if you will).



The idea is, that each ship (or perhaps only each ship design) has a set of orders that can be customised for each round of battle.



For example:

Round 1: Target smallest enemy ship

Round 2: Target most damaged enemy ship

Round 3: Target least damaged enemy ship



I would think that the following "orders" should suffice:

-Target W (W= largest, smallest, most damaged, least damaged, with most missiles/beams/guns, with strongest defences, with weakest defences, with most hull points, with least hull points). If multiple targets are applicable, one is randomly chosen



-Cover X (X= own ship in fleet with either most damage, least defence, least hit points) where Cover applies half of own defences to covered ship (at expense of using them to defend oneself) and ship fires randomly at an enemy whilst covering



-Coordinate Attack on Y (Y = same last as with W, the difference being that all ships with the same Coordinate Attack choose the exact same target ship)



-Maximise Damage on Z (Z = same list as with W and Y, however here the ships will *estimate* how many ships are needed to destroy an enemy and, once this limit is reached, the remaining ships will choose another ship (of an applicable type if possible, else a random enemy)



These orders could even be attached to certain technologies, as could the target list. This would allow a greater tactical element to combat whilst retaining the great advantage, that all combats are quickly resolved.



So, anyone else think the idea might work or have an even better idea for improving space battles?

Good points in there, I like your tactic options, especially the Cover one!

i agree, agreat idea, it could have been mine

I also have to admit, it is a fantastic game with lots of good ideas.

I would like to add an option to send my ships on collision course, some fights are lost from start, would be fun to do some damage by crashing my ships into the enemy. I would implent that manouver though only in manual battle not as an straight kamikaze squad roaming space.

@Meltreness: Oh I don't know, we call them fire ships rather than kamikazes, but the principle of suicidal ships plays an important role in many of our battles. Ramming would be an interesting addition, I admit. At the moment we fill ships with missiles, perhaps an engine and power generator to boot, and send them off to die. A fleet of the things is devastating against enemies.

Yeah, I really would like to see an option to ram, even Jean Luc Picard does it.

I think this idea is great. I think an addition that could be made to it would possibly be fleet formations? I don't know how many times I've had battles where my weakest ships are up front and just get blasted away when the more heavily armored ships should be in front taking the brunt of the damage.

Adral wrote:
I think this idea is great. I think an addition that could be made to it would possibly be fleet formations? I don't know how many times I've had battles where my weakest ships are up front and just get blasted away when the more heavily armored ships should be in front taking the brunt of the damage.

Hmm, I wonder how fleet formations and the manual/automatic battles would fit, but good idea, yeah

Has anyone played Final-Fantasy 12?



The combat-system was hilarious from a programmers point of view.



The game-engine basically provided you with a Combat-AI-SDK. The better you had "programmed" your Characters AI, the less you had to do manually in battle.

You would continually unlock brain-extensions that allowed for more commands to be added and more complex behaviour.

At the end my "AI" was playing much better than I could have done manually. It would never forget to recast haste, would always pick the best heal for the situation, would always focus-fire the target with the lowest HP.



You would think fights would get boring like that. But I was always closely observing and afterwards adjusting the AI. For normal non-boss-encounters it just saved tedium of always doing the same. Just sit back and watch them execute what you tought them to do.

Then an enemy with Mana-Burn came along and my whole AI was completely useless for him. (They all tried to cast regenerate mana all the time until they were beaten dead.) ^^



I'd love to see something anywhere near that in another game. Could well imagine ES to be like that.

Ail wrote:
Has anyone played Final-Fantasy 12?



The combat-system was hilarious from a programmers point of view.



The game-engine basically provided you with a Combat-AI-SDK. The better you had "programmed" your Characters AI, the less you had to do manually in battle.

You would continually unlock brain-extensions that allowed for more commands to be added and more complex behaviour.

At the end my "AI" was playing much better than I could have done manually. It would never forget to recast haste, would always pick the best heal for the situation, would always focus-fire the target with the lowest HP.



You would think fights would get boring like that. But I was always closely observing and afterwards adjusting the AI. For normal non-boss-encounters it just saved tedium of always doing the same. Just sit back and watch them execute what you tought them to do.

Then an enemy with Mana-Burn came along and my whole AI was completely useless for him. (They all tried to cast regenerate mana all the time until they were beaten dead.) ^^



I'd love to see something anywhere near that in another game. Could well imagine ES to be like that.

Yeah, FFXII offered a nice battle system, would be a great idea for automatic combat!

I think it's important to not go too crazy with options in the battles. You don't want to veer too close to tactical combat...ES is an empire building game after all, not a tactical combat game.

And why can't it be both? Did it hurt Master of Orion that it was an Empire-Building AND a tactical combat-game at the same time?

Ail wrote:
And why can't it be both? Did it hurt Master of Orion that it was an Empire-Building AND a tactical combat-game at the same time?

This article by Brad from Stardock says it better than I can. This is why I always preferred GalCiv to MOO.



http://draginol.joeuser.com/article/88762

Besides, ES should develop its own way of doing things and not just copy the ones used in MOO.

Igncom1 wrote:
Besides, ES should develop its own way of doing things and not just copy the ones used in MOO.

Well said.

n18991c wrote:
Well said.

Word!



I like the little bit "uniqueness" in ES