AI lost ability to make colony ships ??

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 3:05:05 PM

Ail wrote:
I have not used the standalone=false thing. Infact I have a huge problem when selecting mods. In 2 out of 3 tries the game won't load again after selecting a mod.

So right now I'm modding directly in the source-files and when I've got something done I copy it to my mod-folder. But currently I'm not getting anywhere cause I lack information about how to perform mathematical operations with parameters instead of just using simple values.

Easy answer is that you don't.

Long aswer is that you need to do it quite long route by making your own funcions and then just in binary bunch 2 of those together.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Dec 13, 2012, 9:43:57 PM

@ sargatanus, are you using the "imperium aeterna" mod? Please see the thread for that mod where the exact same discussion is happening. There is no solution but at least let's all discuss on the same thread.

Sargatanus

Newcomer

Sargatanus

Newcomer

10 600g2g pts

12 years ago

Dec 13, 2012, 7:35:56 PM

So... in the mod I'm having this issue with, it has the building and technology docs... so I could technically just copy the remaining two docs (Hero ones I think) into the AI/Parameters directory in the Mod folder and that should clear it up?

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 14, 2012, 5:33:01 AM

davea wrote:
Actually we have identified the most likely problem: when only one file in AI/parameters is modded using standalone=false, the other files never get loaded from the game directory. I will try this out in 12 hours from now.

Confirmed. When I put the other three files from AI/parameters into the mod, I get the correct behavior. Another protip.

Hupailija

Timer

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 4:47:56 PM

Ail I recommend reading posts in my mods, it's not only about how wonderful I am and smalltalk between me and me... there is sometimes quite valuable pieces where I try to explain how something is done and where one gets values for different things.

I usually hate to repeat myself even more if I forget what I have said firsthand

Anyway I recommend looking how for example foodconsumption is done, that should give you wonderful picture how this games xml works with different aspects of game.

Ail

VIP

Ail

VIP

6 400g2g pts

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 4:13:26 PM

Hupailija wrote:
Long aswer is that you need to do it quite long route by making your own funcions and then just in binary bunch 2 of those together.

That's not longe enough. I'd relly like to see an example for the function I posted in the other thread. I was assuming that it would work like operations in a bash-script since stuff like "gt", "and" and "or" also works.

For that BinaryOperationType-Thingy I found in the forums I've seen that with up to 3 things... If I need that, can I define new variables to store intermediate results?

Implementing formulas seems just so much easier in normal-programming languages. :\

Also a list and description of all accessibly-variables would be really nice. In Personality.xml there's a lot of stuff that sounds really interesting but doesn't make a whole lot of sense without context.

1.2

1.2

What do these affect for example? They sound like they have to do with how much the AI desires to produce food.

Or 1... I've played around with that and maybe it did something but maybe it didn't.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 3:59:09 PM

Hupailija wrote:
You act like I am selfish dickhead who thinks way too much of himself .

Please show any quote of mine which made you feel that way, and I will try to improve.

Hupailija

Timer

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 3:45:42 PM

I am trying to find a polite way to say this, but could you please stop assuming I am a moron?

mmmmmmmm, I have always felt that it's that small connection which keeps our conversations going. You act like I am selfish dickhead who thinks way too much of himself and I act like you are moron

.

Then again I'm fairly sure that neither of us really thinks that way.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 3:17:06 PM

Hupailija wrote:
I mean if Ail says that his mod works well and that he doesn't meet problems and you say that you have changed things but haven't tested without Ails mod...

Actually we have identified the most likely problem: when only one file in AI/parameters is modded using standalone=false, the other files never get loaded from the game directory. I will try this out in 12 hours from now.

a) Your mod does something badly (and of course I first suspect this... because we are speaking about me :P)

b) These 2 mods uses same files and overwrites each other.

I am trying to find a polite way to say this, but could you please stop assuming I am a moron?

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 12, 2012, 11:59:04 PM

This is a curious one. I have combined two small mods and there is a painful side effect. I took a file from Ail here:

https://www.games2gether.com/endless-space/forum/37-modding/thread/15776-ai-modding

This file changes the assignment of AI heroes to either fleets or systems, which is apparently very mixed up in the original file.

I also made a change to the ship template names built by the AI, so that you see "FALCON" instead of "MEDIUM1HISSHOTEMPLATES". The resulting mod is attached to this post.

After playing 80 turns of a game, I noticed I was very far ahead of the other AI, and when I jailbroke the game, I found each AI had stalled at two systems: they sent their initial colony ship to another system, and that was it. No further colony ships. There is no message in output_log.txt, and no reason why either of these mods should have caused any problem. I did not touch the colony ship templates, only the medium/large ones.

I can't put up a save game, because I did this using the VIP version which doesn't cross-load with the distributed game. But, it is easy to reproduce in about three minutes: load the mod, pick a research, and click "next turn" 50 times. Then jailbreak.

Can anybody suggest what may have gone wrong?

Ail

VIP

Ail

VIP

6 400g2g pts

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 2:52:37 PM

I have not used the standalone=false thing. Infact I have a huge problem when selecting mods. In 2 out of 3 tries the game won't load again after selecting a mod.

So right now I'm modding directly in the source-files and when I've got something done I copy it to my mod-folder. But currently I'm not getting anywhere cause I lack information about how to perform mathematical operations with parameters instead of just using simple values.

Hupailija

Timer

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 2:50:51 PM

Well from my part is just logical deduction,

I mean if Ail says that his mod works well and that he doesn't meet problems and you say that you have changed things but haven't tested without Ails mod...

Actually there is 2 options:

a) Your mod does something badly (and of course I first suspect this... because we are speaking about me :P)

b) These 2 mods uses same files and overwrites each other.

To know where problem is you would need to play couple dozen turns without Ails mod and report situation after that.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 2:08:10 PM

@ Hupa, as I wrote in the OP, I did *not change* the colonizer names, only the medium/large ship names.

@ Ail, when you made your changes, did you use a "standalone=false" mod, that is, did you create an empty modding directory with only this file plus an index.xml? Or did you copy all the files, or edit the files in the game distribution? I have run into other problems where "standalone=false" is only partly implemented. For example, if you change galaxysettings.xml, you have to include the other 15 files inside plugins/galaxygenerator or the game will crash. I will try copying all the files in AI/parameters in 12 hours from now.

@ harel55, see this thread for jailbreaking:

http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?2131-!!-able-to-rejoin-game-as-any-ai-player-!!

Hupailija

Timer

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 11:51:54 AM

And based to these we know exactly where is problem and what causes it.

AI doesn't like new ship names and therefore it doesn't want to build those!

(well ok, more like it can't find ship x and therefore it just can't build it)

Notice that there most likely is value:

ShipColonizerTerran (or any other race) in AI section, instead there isn't %ShipColonizerTerran ... either one has to change it in AI part or name back to original. AAND this is why I do AI changes last in my mods

Ail

VIP

Ail

VIP

6 400g2g pts

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 9:51:43 AM

I'm pretty sure it's not my part of the mod that is causing this as I have run 2 test-games with it and the AI did infact colonize as usual.

Harel55

Newcomer

Harel55

Newcomer

100g2g pts

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 9:05:25 AM

Have you double checked that both mods are required for the glitch to occur? If it is in fact caused by only one of them, then it would probably be easier to pinpoint the fault.

P.S. I don't know what you mean by jailbreaking your save, could you please elaborate?

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 6:13:05 AM

Hupailija wrote:
Uhm, small question: has someone tinkered food values?

No, I listed all the changes: rename AI ship templates and change whether specific heroes are fleet or system heroes. No changes to food.

Hupailija

Timer

Hupailija

Timer

12 years ago

Aug 13, 2012, 4:01:06 AM

Uhm, small question: has someone tinkered food values?

If AI decides to aim to get more food and/or more population it may feel like colony ship is not good idea... you know, this is difference between human and AI thinking. We can realize that if we build settler and make it build new city we can get more food, production and money which may lead be further upgraded by building traderoutes later..

AI doesn't see this and instead for it building settler is something what lowers population production in city.

This is another reason why I am tend to steer away from changing AI behaviour atleast when I am doing something big elsewhere