So I've gone over this list I don't know how many times over the last few days, changing things over and over as I went through my learning process.



I'm thankful for all of you who have helped me, your comments have been very helpful. This has been quite the ride... and I have a feeling it's just starting, in a way.



But new developments since this fiasco started are such that I probably won't be buying my shiny new comp any time soon, instead waiting and getting something shinier later. It won't be for naught, though, as this will definitely happen, just later than I might have hoped for.



Despite this, I'm still including relatively low-end options (even if they're not -that- low-end), both in case I change my mind, and in case someone stumbles upon this and finds it useful.



Honestly, I'm mostly writing this for myself, at this point, to have a list and links I can come back to. Though further input, of course, is always welcome.



Anyway, here we go...





Monitors:



Acer 23", 1920x1080, 250 cd/m2, 5ms, 12m:1/1k:1, HDMI - 175$

Hanns-G 27.5", 1920x1200, 400 cd/m2, 3ms, 15k:1/800:1, Speakers, HDMI - 270$

Samsung 24", 1920x1200, 250 cd/m2, 5ms, 1k:1, USB - 340$



The Hanns-G, understandably, is incredibly tempting. For the size and resolution, it's an incredible bargain. This, of course, means that it's not the best monitor out there, but given my situation, it definitely seems like a good bet. I'd rather spend my cash on a solid machine with a somewhat-adequate monitor than on a somewhat-adequate machine with a solid monitor.



The Samsung is the cheapest 24" Newegg has with a native 1920x1200. And though I'm sure it would be a very fine basic monitor, for the price, the Hanns-G remains much more tempting.



Turns out the 30" from my friend is off the table; there was an error in communication, it's just a 23". So… not worth it. There goes that pipe dream.



I've included the 23" Acer as a budget option, but for 100$ more, I'd be extremely tempted to go for the Hanns-G instead. I admit I'm somewhat worried by the Hanns-G, though... seems like too good a deal for it to be true.



Then again, none of these are particularly fancy. They're more of a temporary solution than anything else. Price/value-wise, the Hanns-G seems the best deal by far... as long as it doesn't explode.



As a side-note, I'm amazed how hard it is to find a decent 1920x1200 monitor. Plenty of 1920x1080, but the 1200s are quite rare. And it's not even like there are many more options if I look at higher price brackets: they're simply not there.



I guess that's one thing iMacs have going for them... they have good screens.



Favorite Pick: 27" Hanns-G



Processors:



Pentium G630 2.7Ghz Dual-Core, Sandy Bridge, 65w* -70$

i3 2120 3.3Ghz Dual-Core, Sandy Bridge, 65w - 125$

i5 3450 3.1Ghz Quad-Core, Ivy Bridge, 77w - 200$

i5 3550 3.3Ghz Quad Core, Ivy Bridge, 77w - 220$

i5 3570k 3.4Ghz Quad-Core, Ivy Bridge, 77w - 245$



I've thrown the i3 in there as a budget option. But since it's "just" a dual-core, I just know I'll wish I got something bigger, even if I also know that it'll no doubt be enough for me for a while.



Once I jump to the 3450, it's only an extra 20$ to the 3550, and once I'm there, hey, it's only an extra 25$ to the 3570k…



The i3's got a low power requirement, but if I was going for last gen's i5s (or i7s) instead, I'd be looking at 95w instead of 77w (the Ivy i7s are also 77w), so that's an added bonus of going with Ivy over Sandy.

Mansen wrote:
(And CPU overclocking is as easy as one push of a button these days - nothing more)

And considering this… I'm that much more tempted by the 3570k, now.



Everything I've read to i7s basically being overkill for anything that's out there right now. Sure, I could future-proof, but seems to me an i5 3570k (especially if I over-clock) will be plenty future-proof for a good while yet. Especially since, apparently, games rely more on GPUs than CPUs now. An i7 would be nice, but the extra costs don't seem to warrant what would basically amount to nothing more than bragging rights.



*Thank you Theodemir for the suggestion. I added the G630 after being done with this list, but it seems like an excellent choice for a budget option; better than the i3. The price difference between the G620 and G630 is only 4$, so I went for the G630 (prices I'm listing are rounded up: the 620's 64$, the 630's 68$).



Favorite Picks: G630 and 3570k



Motherboards:



ECS H77H2-M - 80$

ASUS P8Z77-V LE PLUS - 180$

ASRock Z77 Extreme6 - 230$



This is the list I've come to, changed and updated the most times out of all of them. As I've gone through this process and learned more things, I kept finding that I had to come back and tweak my mobo choices.



The ECS is for a a throw-away budget build (not literally, of course, but one which I'll never upgrade and instead keep as a second computer) to go with the G630.



Both of the others are quite decent, and should be more than I need. Despite this, I'm more tempted by the ASRock despite the extra 50$, because I know myself and I just know that if I go for the Asus, I'll wish I'd paid a bit extra and gone for the ASRock... so, the ASRock wins.



The main reason for the gap and lack of other options is because I've been reading about UEFI and ARM. It's probably just paranoia, but I don't like it, so I automatically ignored any card with UEFI... which is most of them.



Honorable mention to the GIGABYTE GA-Z77X-UD5H, which was my favorite until the whole UEFI business.



Favorite Pick: ASRock Z77 Extreme6



Memory:



Mushkin Enhanced Blackline, 4gb (1 x 4gb), Latency 9 - 25$

Mushkin Enhanced Silverline, 8GB (2 x 4GB), Latency 9 - 45$

Mushkin Enhanced Blackline, 8GB (2 x 4GB), Latency 8 - 60$

Crucial Ballistix, 8GB (1 x 8gb), Latency 8 - 85$

CORSAIR Vengeance, 8GB (2 x 4GB), Latency 7 - 90$

Mushkin Enhanced Blackline, 16GB (4 x 4GB) , Latency 8 - 115$



For once, my choice seems clear across the board (the 60$ Mushkin). I've included the others more as a comparison than anything else.



The single 4gb stick is included as a "budget" alternative, but honestly, even in a budget build, I'd probably go for the 60$ 8gb.



The 45$ Mushkin are, well, cheaper, but for ~15$ more, I figure I might as well go for the slightly lower latency.



The Crucial Ballistix in the middle seemed like a fair choice among those available for a single-stick option. But given the price, I can't say I'm really interested. Is there an advantage to going single-stick over dual-stick which would be worth nearly doubling the price?



The Corsair's included as a "high-end" alternative, with the lowest latency of the bunch. I can't see that warranting the price difference, though.



The 16gb offering is basically exactly the same thing as the 60$ Mushkin, just double the fun (and completely pointless).



Favorite Pick: Mushkin Blackline 8gb



(cont.)

Thanks a lot Mansen!

I'll sniffle around the Internet for more info about ssd's.

That list looks good. I'm not too knowledgeable about SSD's. I've heard good things about the M4 Series from Crucial - that was back in late 2011 though. I have the 64GB version for just my OS and it runs really well.

What do you think about this: ?

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/61472747/mm.xps



Also, I like an additional SSD, but I can't find on with SLC instead of MLC (i don't want my SSD dead after 4 years)

Do you know a good one (I only want to place windows on it, so i shouldn't be a big one)

CPU strict "performance" benchmark comparison - This doesn't translate entirely well into games since multi core support will vary. The 8150 takes a slight lead over the intel, however from doing a quick google search the 8150 uses a considerable higher amount of power to run than the Intel. So that means a slightly higher Wattage requirement on your PSU, as well as a higher electrical bill (these things matters, haha)



AMD - 8,252

Intel - 7,725



Yes - you'll need to switch motherboard when going from AMD to Intel. Both companies have gotten better to using the same "socket" across generations these past few years, but to get new "features" you typically still have to get a newer motherboard.



And lastly, the RAM speeds. The slightly older Intel processors locked the speed at 1333 (The 2500K series and such). The new 3xxx generation has upped this to 1600. This doesn't mean you can't go higher than this though, you just have to force the RAM to run at the higher speeds in the motherboard BIOS. Not that RAM speeds really matter these days due to how the CPU's are set up - 1333 is pretty much the roof of gaming useage, any higher and you'll only see a difference in benchmarks and "farm" work such as 3d rendering and number crunching.

Thanks for your reply

So basically, this AMD with 8cores is less good then the intel:

amd

3750k

They both cost about the same amount of money.

I also noticed, the AMD supports more types of ddr3 ram:

DDR3-1066, DDR3-1333, DDR3-1600, DDR3-1800, DDR3-1866

intel:

DDR3-1333

DDR3-1600



Also, I need to change mother board if i go for intel, don't I?

It's a balance of several things - CPU, GPU and RAM (Processor, Graphics card and RAM). If one of these is greatly better than the others you might experience next to no performance gain when compared to "your old" part.



For gaming, I'd suggest the 3750K right now (keyword being K). It is pretty much the sweet spot when it comes to "Bang for Buck". You can go higher, but they start to become increasingly expensive per "mhz gain" so to speak.



Why a model marked with a K? Those are built for being easy to overclock - they are "unlocked" so to speak. Even if you don't overclock they'll have a greater "used" sales price the next time you upgrade - and overclocking really is as simple as one click of a button these days, as long as you replace the intel cooler that comes with the CPU with a better one.



I can't comment on AMD since I don't use it - and I haven't heard good things lately about them.

Hello everyone!



I didn't wanna make a new topic about this, since I only have 1 question:

What CPU is best for gaming (I don't need a monster PC, just a decent one that can run game on high settings)



I've read that AMD performs worse than Intel and everybody always says: Buy intel (like Mansen did (3th post))

But, correct me if I'm wrong, doesn't your GPU do most of the calculations when gaming?

Therefor I figured that a AMD would also be a good CPU for gaming, and they are cheaper (I'm not a millionaire, so I need to watch my budget)



What do you guys think?



>>this is what I would go for if I'd buy AMD:

AMD FX-4100

or (which one is the best?)

AMD Phenom II X4 965





>>This is intel:

Intel® Core™ i5-661

I doubt this is the best intel, but there are soooo many, I have no idea what to pick





Thanks in advance lol

-adder

Ill throw my two cents in as I recently built a new computer myself.



Here are some of my favorite resources for building a computer.

http://pcpartpicker.com/

tomsharware.com

http://www.anandtech.com/





My recommendations:



Processor: i5 2500k should be more than enough for what you need and if you think you need more it can easily be overclocked. I frequently hear that it can be overclocked to 4.3ghz on air.



As far as sandy bridge vs. ivy bridge ivy bridge uses less power, small performance increase, generates a lot more heat. Personally I would stick with the sandy bridge.



A very good heatsink to go with it is the Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO.





Motherboard: I find that both the Z76 and Z77 series are good choices.





Video Card: I have the Sapphire Radeon 6870 and I can run most games on the highest settings without any problems on a 1920x1080 monitor. Anymore really takes you into the world of overkill.





Ram: 2x4gb is your best bet. 800Mhz-1600Mhz performance wise there isnt much difference at all. Having lower timings will have a larger impact.



Also check to make sure it is compatible with your motherboard.





Hard Drive: SSDs give fast boot times, low power consumption other than that I would stick with a HDD.





Power Supply: anything rated at or better than 80 plus bronze. Having a higher efficiency will cause the voltage supplied to all the components to be more stable reducing wear.





Case: If you get the heat sink I recommended above you will need a fairly large case to fit it. I got the white/red NZXT phantom full tower.



Cases will last the longest out of all your parts so it is worthwhile to get a good case now rather than later. There are a lot of really good cases out there so in the end it more or less comes down to aesthetics.





Monitor: I would get a 1920x1080 or 1920x1200 around 20-23 inches lower timings and higher refresh are nice but not required.



here is what I got minus monitor and OS. With the Ram I needed to increase the voltage to get it to be stable.

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/a6Zv





Thats it for now; It is late and Im going to sleep.

Video Card:



ZOTAC GeForce GT 520, 2gb, 64-bit, DDR3 - 50$

SAPPHIRE radeon HD 6670, 2gb, 128-bit, DDR3 - 80$

ZOTAC GeForce GTX 560, 1gb, 256-bit, DDR5 - 180$

SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 6870, 1gb, 256-bit, DDR5 - 180$

ASUS Radeon HD 7850, 2gb, 256-bit, DDR5 -260$



Ahh… now we get to the good stuff! Probably the hardest decision to make.



The 520's crap, worse than what I used to have (8800m rebranded, basically). The 6670's a small upgrade, and for only 80$, seems the best option for a budget card with a bit of oomph.



The 560 and 6870 are pretty evenly matched. I'm tempted by the 6870, but the GTX 560 has a 30$ mail-in rebate, making it cheaper. I don't quite trust mail-in rebates, though... (I've been screwed over by them in the past)



The 7850's in a class of its own. And though that's definitely the one I'd pick at this point, it's a bit too rich for my blood.



I'm mostly leaning towards the 6670 or the 6870. The price difference matches their theoretical benchmark pretty well. I believe that benchmark's for a 1gb 6670, though, so I'm not sure how much of a difference it being a 2gb would make.



There's a SAPPHIRE 7850 OC available from CanadaComputers.com for 240$, which is tempting.



All that being said, I've recently heard bad things about AMD's reliability, especially when it comes to their drivers. I'm still favoring them over Nvidia (obviously, given the list above), but it makes me uneasy. Hence, three favorite picks.



Favorite Picks: 6670, GTX 560 and 7850 OC



PSU:



Rosewill HIVE-550, 550w - 70$

CORSAIR HX650, 650w - 130$

CORSAIR HX750, 750w - 150$

SILVERSTONE SST-ST75F-G Evolution, 750w - 170$

COOLER MASTER RS800-80GAD3-US, 800w - 180$



All are modular, all have PFC, all have single rails. All support SLI, the Corsair HX650 doesn't do Crossfire, but all others do.



I ended up having a higher max power on most models than what I was originally going for, but that's more by accident than anything else. I was looking for other features and certain price-points, and this is what I ended up with. I'd rather have too much power than not enough, anyway.



The Rosewill's the budget option, and would no doubt do fine in that role. There's a big jump from there to the 130$ Corsair, though, and from there it's only an extra 40$ for my the most expensive one, which also happens to be my top pick.



Going for a budget rig, everything would need to be replaced/upgraded, so I'd probably just keep everything as is and simply buy a whole new everything.



If I'm going for anything less than budget, though, I like the Cooler Master, as it's probably the last PSU I'll need for a while, and would do just fine in any upgraded build I end up going for down the line.



Favorite Picks: Cooler Master RS800



HDD:



Seagate Barracuda, 2tb, 7200rpm - 120$



Oh god! Finally, something simple! I could get a 1tb for 10$ cheaper, but... why bother?



Favorite Pick: Um... yeah...



SDD:



Crucial Adrenaline, 50gb (64gb) - 95$

OCZ RevoDrive Hybrid, 1tb - 320$



After looking at my options and doing a bit of reading (such as this, among other things), my choices here are actually a bit simpler than I originally thought they might be.



Basically, the Adrenaline is Crucial's new series, designed specifically for SSD caching. It's a 64gb card with 50gb available for caching, the remaining 14gb dedicated to "performance optimization", as they call it.



Given Mansen's comments about the M4 (and the fact that from what I've been reading, many agree), I'm quite tempted by this. OCZ offers something similar, but it's apparently not quite as good.



The alternative is going for the OCZ Hybrid, which basically acts as a HDD with integrated SSD Caching.



One of the reasons I'm keeping my options in this category so limited is that I've been hearing a lot of good about the Samsung 830 SSDs, but given that they're apparently quite new, they're nearly impossible to find in Canada.



TigerDirect.ca does have some, but they don't have the best of prices, generally, and I'm not finding them anywhere else. I think I'd prefer waiting a bit so there's more competition and I can find a better deal.



From what Newegg offers, my choices are between using the Crucial Adrenaline and SRT with the 2tb Seagate Barracuda mentioned above (~215$ total, 2tb) or going for the OCZ Hybrid (~320$, 1tb).



If I was looking at the Samsung 830s in a serious manner, I'd be considering both the 64gb offerings (to use with SRT) or the 256gb drives (to use as direct boot).



Crucial + Seagate is interesting, as I'm liking the sound of Crucial's optimization, I'd end up with 2tb instead of 1tb, and it's a cheaper option by nearly 100$.



The OCZ route, though, would be simpler, and would still leave me with a faster-than-regular-HDD drive if/when I upgrade to the Samsung 830.



If I wanted to complicate my life and money was no object, though, I'd probably go for a 256gb Samsung 830 to use as direct boot, and use the Crucial Adrenaline to cache the Seagate 2tb.



This is apparently possible, but requires some messing around, as SRT is supposed to be used for boot drive caching, and not secondary drive caching.



All in all, this makes me lean towards Crucial + Seagate right now, and adding Samsung later. Especially considering I haven't read great things about OCZ. No that they're bad, just… Crucial & Samsung are better.



Favorite Pick: Crucial Adrenaline



Drives:



LITE-ON iHAS224-06, DVD+R DL, LightScribe - 21$



After wrapping my head around this one, I realized it was an extremely simple choice. Yay for that.



For ~20$, I get a little bit of everything. And I rarely use my DVD drive anyway. I even get extra toys like writing on dual-layers, and LightScribe.



Favorite Pick: Hurr Durr.



Cases:



Rosewill CHALLENGER-U3 - 60$

COOLER MASTER HAF XM - 130$

COOLER MASTER HAF X - 190$ (170$ w/ MIR)



Okay, keeping this short because I'm tired, and I kind of like these options. I would add more, but... meh... really getting tired of looking at cases.



The Rosewill: seems decent for a budget option, offers a decent amount of drives n' bays and what-have-yous. Two concerns: small (so, less airflow) and only has USB 3.0. If I really go for a full-budget build, it might not support USB 3.0, so I'll have to look for a new case. I'd really rather not go -that- budget, though, so I'm not too worried.



The HAF XM and HAF X look shiny. I like that they're big (really big, in the case [nopunintended] of the HAF X; it's a monster), more airflow, tons of space to grow into.



I admit I'm biased, because both had review vids, and they seemed quite nice. Upside, it helped me understand cases in general.



I'd love the HAF X, but I'm not sure I can rationalize the extra 60$ (extra 40$, if the mail-in rebate works out).



Basically, what I get for that 40$/60$ is slightly more space, more front ports (mic, eSATA & FireWire) and a bigger front fan (230mm instead of 200mm). Not sure if entirely worth it. Tempting, though.



I've been reading a fair bit of good about Cooler Master. And though I'm sure there are plenty of other great options, I'm honestly tired of looking, and I appreciate the HAF (High Air Flow) design philosophy.



Favorite Pick: Cooler Master HAF XM

(tl;dr found in second post -- post too big to put it all together)



As I've mentioned in another thread, it's time for me to get a new computer, and I'll be switching from Mac to PC.



This being a brave new world for me, I was hoping to get some tips and insight from you guys.



Sadly, I can't afford a top-end monster gaming rig like I wish I could, but that's one of the main issues I'd like help with:



I've been wanting/planning to get a new computer for a while now, but I meant to wait longer until I could afford something closer to the higher end. Unfortunately, my iMac's GPU died, which pretty much means I have to buy a new machine (for those of you blissfully unaware of Apple's ridiculous practices, replacing the card would be technically possible, but a lot of trouble, and way more expensive that it would be worth).



My main question is, which of the following two approaches do you think is the most sensible?



1) Spend less now, but upgrade sooner than later.

2) Spend more now, but upgrade later than sooner.



Actual budget is undetermined, but the cheaper the better--I really shouldn't be spending -any- money on a new computer right now, but I'm kind of being forced to (live without a computer… are you mad??).



Thankfully, my general requirements are relatively low. I mostly play older games and indies, which tend to not ask for much juice. Even a low-end crap-fest would do moderately fine for a lot of things. I don't do multiplayer, and I don't do graphic-intensive AAA monsters FPS like BF3 or whatever.



Still, I'd occasionally like to play things like Skyrim or Deus Ex: Human Revolutions on max settings… not just play pong. And there's the simple fact that the better a system I get now, the longer it'll remain relevant for.



I've been looking at i5s, in terms of CPU, and from what I've read, that would be would be the way to go; i7s are better, but nothing out there (yet) warrants the price bump--especially if I'm not looking to max out the other aspects of my rig. I've looked at comparisons with AMD, but it seems that the i5 out-performs even the FX-8 cores… though that's possibly because not enough things (yet… again) use that many cores.



In terms of GPU, I get even more confused. I've tried to do some research, but it all sounds like gibberish to me. I'm looking for a card that would work decently on its own, though; no overclocking, crossfire, or SLI. My last card was basically a GeForce 8800 GTS, and it did alright, even with recent things (I could play Skyrim on almost max settings, and it was acceptable), but I'm looking forward to an upgrade. Between GeForce and Radeon, though… I don't know. Radeon seems to do better with mid-end, whereas GeForce seems to do better for the higher-tiers, but even then… seems close and game-dependent.



Since I'm new to PCs and would like a minimum of headache, I'd rather a pre-built rig than something I'd put together myself. A home-built rig is still an option: that was my original plan (though it was more of a long-term plan). Since now I'm kind of in a rush, I don't know if I'm up for the all the research putting something together from scratch would entail at this point.



I'm in Canada, which sadly limits options somewhat. I'm sure there are places I could order from in the US, but that means extra shipping, and potentially having to pay duty or face other such complications at the border. So I'd prefer not to unless there's an absolutely amazing deal I simply cannot pass up.



I've looked at Best Buy and Future Shop, nothing much interesting there (no surprise). A friend recommended ncix.com, which seems fairly nice. One of the great things about them is that they really give you tons of customization options. You can choose all your parts and they'll put them together for you for something like 50$, which is a nice service for a nub like me. But my favorite for the time being is newegg.ca; best prices I've seen up to now, with ncix.com being second best.



Some examples of what I've been looking at with Newegg:



(all have DDR3 RAM, a 1tb 7200rpm HDD and 64-bit quad-cores; there are slight differences between type/availability of slots, but nothing major)



1. AMD FX-4100 3.6Ghz, 4gb RAM, GeForce GT 520 1gb, 450w PSU, 560$

2. i5 3450 3.1Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 6670 1gb, 500w PSU, 750$

3. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 7750 1gb, 600w PSU, 845$

4. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 16gb RAM, GeForce GTX 560 2gb, 800w PSU, 1040$

5. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 7850 2gb, 800w PSU, 1050$



I'm not saying these are final choices (I'm always open to suggestions), but I've spent all day looking at options and researching, and these seem to be my best bet given the circumstances.



I'm most tempted by numbers 1, 3 and 4, here's why:



1. Cheapest "vaguely decent" system I found. I've seen a bunch of random crappy bundles here and there with integrated graphic cards for maybe 100$ less or so, but considering that even this basic system is roughly equivalent to my old iMac (if not slightly better), it would be… enough… kind of.



3. The 7750 is about half the power (roughly; in general terms) of the 7850, but it's still not a bad card at all, and this is the first of the five options above to have a 3570k, which means at least I'll have quite a solid CPU. I can always upgrade the graphics card once I feel rich enough and/or the higher-end models come down in price. This rig would feel like a significant upgrade from what I had while remaining below the dreaded 1k$ mark.



4. I don't understand why this one's 10$ cheaper than the next option on the list. The GTX 560 and the Radeon 7850 have a similar price, so the only major remaining difference is the 16gb of RAM instead of 8gb… so why is this one cheaper? And this is why I chose it over number 5. The GTX 560 is also a well-rated card. And though I've heard only good about the 7850, from what I understand, that's mostly due to its overclock potential, which isn't something I would do. Here's a comparison chart between the GeForce GTX 560 and Radeon HD 7850. Though keep in mind that in the comparison, it's the 1gb 560, and the one included here is the 2gb one (though not Ti, but still). So I'm guessing the difference between the two would be quite minimal.



And now we get to the issue of the monitor...



I know someone who's selling an Apple 30" Cinema HD Display, which is very tempting (390$ for the monitor plus an old g5 tower). 30" is sweet, and I've been wanting to "upgrade" to 2560x1600 for a while. Considering it's so old, though, I don't know in what kind of shape it's in. I'll have to go see it. If that screen's not an option, I've looked around for alternatives a bit, and same story as with the comp, back to Newegg:



(both of the following monitors are 1920x1080 and LED)



a) 23" Acer, 5ms, 140$

b) 27" Philips, 3.5ms, 299$



What kills me, though, is that my old screen was 24" and 1920x1200, so I'm taking a drop in res either way (the few 1920x1200s I saw were too expensive for what they offered, I found). The 27" tempts me due to the extra size, though… but then I wonder if I can rationalize spending 160$ for 4".



Now, if I can get that 30" and it works well, I'm a happy camper. It's not LED, but neither was my old screen… I'm sure I'll live. Of course, if I do get the 30", then that affects my decision about which rig to get, as I'll need a good GPU if I want to run things at 2560x1600 on anything but the lowest settings. In which case… well… I'm wondering if even the 7850 would be enough…



So, say low-end, I go for the AMD (560$) and the Acer 23" (140$), I'm looking at 700$ + taxes & shipping... estimated total just a bit under 900$.



Mid-end, I get the cheapest 3570k (845$) and the 27" Philips (300$), taxes n' shipping, roughly 1350$.



High-end, I go for the 560 or 7850 (~1050$) and I buy my friend's screen n' old mac (~400$). That comes out to about 1500$. But I also get a spare comp, old as it may be.



And then there's all the mixes of the various other options. But overall, those are the lower/higher ends of what I'm looking at here.



Thoughts? Tips? Suggestions?



Thanks in advance for the help!

Theodemir wrote:
The latest intel chips work perfectly with 1600MHz RAM

Yes I just read that today in fact - Wasn't aware the new platforms had raised the official support to 1600 (not that it matters on the P67 or newer platforms since you can simply bypass the BIOS recommendations and set your +1333MHZ RAM to run at whatever they're supposed to - H67 excluded)



It won't matter much at all in games though. The increased speed is more for Benchmarking and high end office production applications (3d rendering, video editing et cetera). Games are more interested in your CPU specifications.



Never heard of the Gxxx CPUs so I can't really comment on their performance



@Caveman: I'm stingy so I can't recommend using an SSD for games. It wears them out from all the copying (reading isn't as bad) with time (this has become much much better in recent generations however). You'll fill out one of those babies very quickly anyway, and not all games load noticeably faster anyway (sadly).



As for the Hybrid drives - As I recall they have software that determines the files you use more often and puts them on the SSD portion of the drive. So you won't see as much as a speed improvement across the board as you would with an SSD, and not as much "control" over what gets "fast" as you would with a SSD + HDD setup. But they're certainly interesting.



SLI should never be a consideration when you build a "budget" gamer PC. For one the "new" generation of cards almost always outperform 2 card SLI. You also save a noticeably amount of money by not having two cards running instead of a single one (which probably uses less power than the single SLI card anyway due to the generation shift)



And lastly - not all games benefit properly from SLI. You'll have to wait for nVidia (or ATI) to make profiles for each game and properly tune the drivers. In short - SLI is interesting for people with enough money to want super performance - not so much for the budget gamer.



Overclocking really IS just one press of a button - all modern motherboards come with a suite of tools. Such as one for overclocking that automatically "steps" up your performance slowly until it crashes, and then goes down a few steps to ensure stable performance. It isn't as perfect or optimal as an old school "dirty technical fiddle fiddle" approach but it will give you a noticeable boost.



Integrated PSU's are mostly for special cases - like small gamer cases for LAN parties and such. I'd go with a regular ATX standard one any day - they're more of a standard and easier to replace when broken.

That's some great input, thank you all!



I've been working on a list of potential purchases for each part-type for the last day or so and I'm almost done. I'll be posting that soon and would appreciate any further input you might have.



Mansen: Interesting about overclocking being so easy, I always assumed overclocking was a messy, black-magic-like business… lol



If it's a simple matter, then it's definitely something I should look into, at least for low-end OC (I don't think I'm ready to deal with the potential complications of pushing my system to its absolute max, at least not until I understand things better in general).



I've definitely been leaning towards the Z77 as far as mobs are concerned (only the cheapest mobo on my list isn't one, and I doubt I'll be bothering with that).



The Ivy series has as a K in both i5 and i7. The 3570k[/i] (top-end Ivy i5) is the one I've got my eye on, actually.



Another thing I like about Ivy Bridge over Sandy Bridge is that the new gen has a lower power requirement (77w vs. 95w).



I used a "PSU Requirement Calculator" thingy to give myself a rough estimate of my needs, and it was between 550w and 750w, depending on how many theoretical toys I loaded up, so your 600w-650w sounds like a pretty solid guess.



Not overly concerned about sound. I use headphones, not fancy surround speakers, so I guess onboard will be fine enough, at least at first. Thanks.



The Crucial M4s look quite interesting (I'm at the SSD portion of my list now, so I just started looking at them), thanks for the tip!



ZZGashi: That's an excellent thread, thank you kindly! Definitely helps demystify the whole thing a bit, at least. Looks like I'll be looking for MLC and not SLC.



The GTX 560m isn't quite as powerful as its non-mobile counterpart, but it's quite decent. Just a tier below the 6670, which is what I've got my eye on as far as budget cards go (~80$); great to hear that it runs the games I mentioned at max.



Theodemir: The 7850's still at the top of my list for GPU choices. I'd love the 7870, but it hardly seems worth the extra 100$ or so (~250$ vs ~350$).



The ones I'm most leaning towards at this point, other than the 7850, are the 6670 (80$), as mentioned above, or the 6870 (~180$), which isn't quite up to par with the 7850, but still matches up fairly well, considering.



I'm also considering the various GTX 560 models (Ti,not Ti, 1gb, 2gb, etc.), but at first glance, it seems that the 7850's a better deal instead of the higher-end 560s. The lower-end ones, though (not Ti, 1gb) are somewhat tempting, going for roughly ~140$, and they're quite close to the more-pricey 6870.



The more I read about SSD, the more I'm coming to the conclusion that it's pretty much a must, I agree.



There are some decisions to be made, though, between using a small SSD with SRT (SSD Caching), or simply using a (possibly larger) SSD as a boot drive. I hear the larger-capacity SSDs have better read times?



I'm also tempted by the OCZ RevoDrive Hybrid, which, from what I understand, is basically a regular HDD with a built-in SRT-like system (though using a 100gb SSD, which is bigger than the max of 64gb allowed by SRT).



Thanks for the parts suggestions! It gives me, at the very least, something to work with and compare to.



The Corsair HX is actually on my list of potential PSUs (the most expensive one, actually… >.>), so I guess I'm doing something right.



The mobo you listed's a bit pricey compared to what I've been looking at, but I'll check it out. It might be worth spending a bit extra. The most expensive one I've been seriously considering is the Gigabyte UD5H, which is 185$, so, not too far from the Asus Maximus V which you suggested (~215$). Still kind of within range.



General: Thoughts on SLI/Crossfire?



I also assumed that was at least moderately complicated, but if it's jus a matter of slotting in two cards instead of one and pressing a button or whatever, it's something I might seriously consider, even if not right away.



Would I be better off with a dual low-range card setup than a single mid-range card?



I guess if I do find that SLI/Crossfire is for me, I'd probably be most tempted in a single mid-range one now, and adding a second of it later.



Once I'm done with the SSD section of my list, the only one left to look at is cases. Anybody have any general tips about what's important in a good case?



Size isn't an issue for my set-up, so I'll probably be looking at full towers, or mid-towers at least. I'm more interested in wiggle-room than a small footprint.



What about cases with integrated PSUs? There are a few available on Newegg, but I haven't looked at them in detail. I'm guessing I'm better off getting a separate PSU, no?

The latest intel chips work perfectly with 1600MHz RAM RAM. Get the 7850 over the 7750 as its a lot better (and can overclock easily to and above the 7870) and you can wait a good few years till you really need an upgrade (or add a second!). With the 7750 you'll need an upgrade within 6 months and that's wasted money already!



SSD is pretty madantory [formeatleast] nowadays. The difference in response and in-game load times compared to a HDD is too much to pass up.



Case: Fractal R3

PSU: Corsair 750w HX Mod



I know for certain those will serve you well, as I've recently built myself [endoflastmonthalapayday]a new PC with those two. The case was a saving of £40+ against the corsair 550D that has a 'similar' design ethos. The PSU at least here in the UK has jumped up in price by £20 since I got it but still worth the money as its such a quality product; easy to install with good length on the cables but most importantly really quiet.



I can only say on what stuff I've used but my newest comp uses the Mobo. Again its simple, really good OC'n out of the box and with all the bells and whistles needed for a decent PC.



As for where to invest your money to begin with I'd go with a good case, PSU and motherboard. The rest you can simply change in/out as needed.



Starter CPU: I'd suggest CPU G620; Fits in the mobo and gets your pc running.

Starter GPU: the 7750 you mentioned if you don't mind knowing you'll throw it out after you upgrade.



Good luck!

http://www.cheathappens.com/show_board2.asp?headID=112119&titleID=8463



That was a topic I was reading on another site about SSDs, if you want a little more information about them, that should help distill the important information.



As far as everything else goes, Mansen has already done a good job. The only thing I can add is that I have a GeForce GTX 560M, it performs great, I maxxed out the settings for those games you have mentioned in your first post. I am not sure of the exact comparison between a desktop GPU and a laptop version of the same GPU, obviously the laptop version will be a bit less powerful, but beyond that, there usually is not much of a difference.

- Graphics card.



Personally I don't have any preference as to whether I buy Radeon or nVidia. It all rests on price, performance and power usage (an important one when gaming as much as I do :green. I keep hearing that nVidia has better "day 1" drivers and that Radeon is a bit behind when it comes to those - nothing I've ever noticed though. nVidia also has better PhysX support, though few games use it even to this day.



I'm personally upgrading my 560TI to a 7870 which is a bit of a leap up in price, but I'm only paying the price difference so it's manageable. As for advising you, use this site to compare video card performance and see if you can find something within your price range that performs well.



- RAM



As far as I keep hearing, you'll noticed next to no performance gain above the 1333mhz limit that intel motherboards have as standard (at least the P67/H67's). But you may as well buy higher since RAM is pretty cheap overall - and bigger sticks are better. Don't fall for the 4sticks of 2GB RAM. Go for 4GB sticks instead. Less sticks = easier to install and configure. Some motherboards are notoriously bad at handling 4 sticks at once.



- Motherboard



As for the motherboard, I'd go with a cheap Intel Z77 Express based motherboard. It's the newest platform they make and it allows you to take full advantage of an i5 3xxx CPU.



I'd suggest looking up some fan cooler comparisons and find one that suits your needs. The coolers that come packaged with CPU's are very basic at best and can be noisy (you may want to hold on this particular purchase till you've gotten your base parts to see if you can live with it)



I have the slightly older 2500K so I don't know if the 3xxx series have any with the K letter on them. Might be a good investment though as it means it is unlocked allowing for overclocking. Might not be relevant right now, but two years down the road you can extend the lifetime of the old hardware by some time if you buy a bigger cooler, instead of having to upgrade straight away (And CPU overclocking is as easy as one push of a button these days - nothing more)



- PSU



As for the PSU I believe a 650W (maybe even 600) of a good brand (Corsair, Chieftec, Coolermaster) should last you well for up to 5 years (they slowly wear down and become less wattage effective, which is why you usually aim a bit over your requirements). This depends mostly on the graphics card and number of harddrives though.



- Sound



If you're not particularly picky about sound (especially microphone), then the built in soundcard on the motherboard should be sufficient. If you buy a headset that uses USB it'll use its own soundcard anyway.



- Optical Drive (DVD, BLURAY)



Get a cheap one if all you do is read discs. If you're also looking to burn the occasional backup you may want to read some reviews beforehand as burner quality (and features) vary a lot.



- Harddrives / SSD



There's a ton of opinions on these but personally I don't really care. I've never had brand specific issues with any of my harddrives. As for SSD's I've always heard good things about the M4 series from Crucial. I bought my 64GB one back in late 2011 though so a new contender may have appeared since.





Think I pretty much covered everything

I'm not sure how solid a metric "pretty" is, but pretty is generally better than ugly, yes… lol



Good point about the resolution, Mansen, thank you. I admit it would be hard for me to "take a step backwards"; I'd already come to find 1920x1200 at 24" to not be enough. Guess I should take this opportunity to consider a real upgrade.



Good to know about the G5, though I wasn't specifically thinking of gutting it and upgrading to PC on it. As I said, I still prefer OS X to Windows. I won't be buying a new Mac, but I'm not against using an old one (despite its age, I'm sure it'll be more than sufficient for basic tasks such as simple surfing, email, etc.).



As for the RAM, that's another excellent point. I've been mostly looking at 1333, but I guess it might be a good idea to take that extra step and go for 1600. The price difference is minor.



Your comment about the 560TI made me curious, so I did some more searching about prices. It seems that Newegg's 7850s are especially cheap compared to other places… or maybe it's their 560s which are expensive, I'm not sure. But bottom-line is that they're quite evenly matched as far as price goes (depending on exact model). Especially when looking at the 2gb TIs, and not the 1gb ones.



Any thoughts on GeForce vs. Radeon in general?



At this point, it seems to me that going for home-built is definitely the way to go, despite the potential headaches (hey, it'll be a learning experience!). I took a better look at Ncix, and though they do offer some decent things, overall, Newegg is still better, though their pre-builts are… not exactly optimal.



Looks like I'll be ordering parts from Newegg.ca and putting them together myself, so that brings up more questions...



Anybody have tips about motherboards and PSUs? What about cooling or extra fans or whatever? Do I need a sound-card? Does the DVD drive matter at all, or are they all pretty much the same? (I have no interest in Blu-Ray whatsoever)



I've mostly been researching CPUs, GPUs and RAM, so I feel I have at least a vague understanding of those. I have -no- idea what to look at as far these other things go, though, though. As far as HDDs go, I'm probably looking at Seagate, 1tb or 2tb, 7200rpm. Suggestions about other manufacturers would be appreciated (coupled with an explanation of why you think they'd be better than Seagate), but I'm not touching Western Digital.



I would also consider an SSD to use as boot disk if I decide to go for more of a high-end rig instead of just a "simple starter", so if you have any particular favorites when it comes to those, go ahead and share.



For the record, I'm pretty set on an i5 at this point, in the 3xxx range. As far as GPU, I'll either go for a cheap (below 100$) and upgrade in the not-too-distant future, or go straight away for something medium-high end (not a GTX 680, but… yeah).



Again, I'd like to emphasize that I won't be overclocking or tweaking anything, so suggestions offered by anyone should take into account that I'm looking to optimize based on stock specs, not OC potential.

You pick the prettiest stuff you find in the market. There, helped.

2. (Get an intel processor. Your world will be such an easier place to live in)

b. (Or rather - insist on finding a 1920x1200 monitor. You'll regret a lower resolution - especially at +23" sizes)



Keep in mind that the G5 case is NOT compatible with PC components - the screws (and general layout) do not fit each other. It'll take a load of custom work if you were thinking of using it for anything.



As for graphics cards, the 560TI (GTX) is as far as I'm concerned and informed the best price/performance compromise. Get 8GB 1600mhz DDR3 RAM. 4 is too little and 16 is utterly overkill unless you actually edit videos or render 3d models. (I am not kidding here - don't go overboard)

TL;DR



Need new comp; am poor. Wat do? Options:

1. AMD FX-4100 3.6Ghz, 4gb RAM, GeForce GT 520 1gb, 450w PSU, 560$

2. i5 3450 3.1Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 6670 1gb, 500w PSU, 750$

3. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 7750 1gb, 600w PSU, 845$

4. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 16gb RAM, GeForce GTX 560 2gb, 800w PSU, 1040$

5. i5 3570k 3.4Ghz, 8gb RAM, Radeon HD 7850 2gb, 800w PSU, 1050$



a) 23" Acer, 5ms, 140$

b) 27" Philips, 3.5ms, 299$