How would you deal with the huge pressure? We can barely get to 11 km here on Earth, how would you deal with 100 km? And what would you do down there anyways?

Biodomes seems the most likely way for it to start, but from there... difficult to say really what would be feasible with Mars' atmosphere and distancing from the sun.

Hopefully it will end better for any colonists than it did in Red Planet though.

Nosferatiel wrote:
In which sense?

The magnetic shield doesn't keep the atmosphere in, only most of the charged particles out of cosmic radiation out. Do you think the impact of the heightened radiation would lead to a radioactive isotope laden atmosphere?

Some scientist say that solar wind would slowly blow away the atmosphere (in fact that is why they think it has so little atmosphere currently), you could over come this by constantly replenishing the atmosphere but that increases the cost.

Omniverse wrote:
As others stated at the start, Terra-forming Mars most likely won't happen without some kind of technology to replace the natural magnetic shield (magnetosphere). Without it, you wouldn't be able to maintain any atmosphere.

In which sense?

The magnetic shield doesn't keep the atmosphere in, only most of the charged particles out of cosmic radiation out. Do you think the impact of the heightened radiation would lead to a radioactive isotope laden atmosphere?

As others stated at the start, Terra-forming Mars most likely won't happen without some kind of technology to replace the natural magnetic shield (magnetosphere). Without it, you wouldn't be able to maintain any atmosphere.

If you aren't afraid about reading big books, the Mars Trilogy by Kim Stanley Robinson gives a good example of how Mars could be terraformed : some nuclear reactors (not to pollute the atmosphere but to rise the temperature), chemical plants releasing a mix of greenhouse effect gases in the atmosphere, giant holes drilled in the planet's crust down to the upper mantle to release huge amounts of heat in the air (the moholes), bringing icy asteroids to the planet and make them burn in the atmosphere to release more water, etc. Solutions have already been imagined. It is mainly a matter of wishing to do this and some technological matter also, as many of the work in the novel (such as drilling the moholes) is accomplished by autonomous and auto-replicating machines.

Igncom1 wrote:
Where you hiding the planets dude?



Also wasent this topic about Mars and Venus?

I hide the planets in my pocket.

repbunny wrote:
I think we'll skip mars for several years by colonizing other more habitable planets.

Where you hiding the planets dude?



Also wasent this topic about Mars and Venus?

Raptor wrote:
How would you deal with the huge pressure? We can barely get to 11 km here on Earth, how would you deal with 100 km? And what would you do down there anyways?

Two points on a physical basis.



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Europa has only 0.134g on surface states wikipedia. That means it has roughly a tenth of the pressure. It seems to be exactly the same problem as on earth.

But you have to take into account that you're talking about 100km water depth out of 1560km radius of the moon. While 3020 km of mass are pulling the water down on you, 100km of water are pulling you up. So the gravity at this depth is a lot less than on surface. So should be the pressure. I haven't made the calculation, but it might just be that we'd end up with 0.1g and then 100km depth would be the same as 10km on earth.

[/LIST]

I think we'll skip mars for several years by colonizing other more habitable planets.

Raptor wrote:
How would you deal with the huge pressure? We can barely get to 11 km here on Earth, how would you deal with 100 km? And what would you do down there anyways?

Not to mention, how would we get everything there? It took us thirteen years just to build the ISS, and that's in our own backyard (virtually speaking). Then again, I guess we're already assuming it's year 2xxx, when we might have the technology to do any of this...



I'd see anything on Europa as more of a science outpost or lab, as opposed to any real kind of colony. There's just too much that could go wrong, in my opinion, for a colony of any decent size to be established. Mars would likely start the same way, as a small science area focused on just getting a small area ready for life, be it by some kind of bio-dome, or something as bizarre as that greenhouse in the Mission to Mars movie that came out in 2000.



Venus, I'm not sure we'd have much hope for. Between the toxic atmosphere and the incredible pressure, it might just be wasted work to make it habitable.

As we all know, terraforming any planet is a major undertaking and would take hundreds, even maybe a few thousand, years. Despite the long times required for such a thing to happen, there is a lot of talk about one day possibly terraforming either mars or Venus. How do you think we could achieve it, or what you think would be some of the limiting factors of ever accomplishing this? Do you believe that it's possible?



I'm interested to know from this community.

Raptor wrote:
No way this can be colonized with our present and near future tech. This thing has virtually no atmosphere and is radioactive hell on the surface. The ocean below might support some primitive life forms but that's it.

I don't speak about colonizing the surface, but the ocean floor. You just need some kind of entry valve. Beneath the ice and loads of water, no radioactivity due to cosmic rays should remain. Water is a lot more effective than air in that perspective.



Then you've got tons of water which you can split to hydrogen and oxygen via simple electrolysis, for which you get the energy out of geothermal plants. All the techs you need but the space faring ones are techs you could easily try out and develop on earth in the deep oceans.

Nosferatiel wrote:


Getting anything out of jupiters gravitational field and then a whole moon is a tad bit unrealistic. XD

Anyways I'd rather colonize that moon since it has probably got warm fluid water below the ice crust due to tidal heating, if there's not life there already.

No way this can be colonized with our present and near future tech. This thing has virtually no atmosphere and is radioactive hell on the surface. The ocean below might support some primitive life forms but that's it.

Igncom1 wrote:
Well one of the ways proposed is to build a bunch of nuclear reactors and have them pollute till the air density is right, then to use chemistry to make it tolerable.

Not nuclear reactors, good old coal energy plants to produce CO[SUB]2[/SUB]. Nuclear reactors produce no air pollution, only nuclear waste. And despite that being warm, it has no effect on air density.

Igncom1 wrote:
Well how do you think we got our water?



From the asteroid belt baby! awwwwwwww yeah!

A few asteroid hits would also warm up the planet a bit, but the resulting ash clouds would probably cool it down again.

If we did this, it would take long and careful landing of the asteroids on the surface.



I'd also add that we might be able to use oxides and hydrides, if present on the surface or just below, to generate a bit water.

H.P.Winrarsauce wrote:
Or maybe Europa, that moon has a lot of ice.

we could also pollute the atmosphere with methane to warm it up a tad.

Getting anything out of jupiters gravitational field and then a whole moon is a tad bit unrealistic. XD

Anyways I'd rather colonize that moon since it has probably got warm fluid water below the ice crust due to tidal heating, if there's not life there already.

Off the top of my head.You might be able to decrease radiation by creating giant orbital satellite shields either made out of lead or magnetized massively. If that works it becomes a matter of creating enough atmosphere and warming up Mars witch at that point is feasible if you are willing to wait long enough.

The problem with terraforming a moon like Europa would be keeping the atmosphere in place. As is, solar winds would continuously blow it away if it wasn't replenished constantly/shielded.

Or maybe Europa, that moon has a lot of ice.

we could also pollute the atmosphere with methane to warm it up a tad.

Well how do you think we got our water?



From the asteroid belt baby! awwwwwwww yeah!

Turning mars into a biosphere would require some incredible breakthrough that would either allow us to create an artificial magnetic field, or the re-animation of the planetary core, both which are likely to be extreme and difficult undertakings. Venus would present a similar problem, but would be slightly easier to terraform because of the already existing atmosphere. It's a matter of taking out, not putting in.



Both planets present the challenges of mass hydration and water body creation though. While frozen water does exist on mars, it really isn't enough :/. A true biosphere would require whole oceans and lakes to be created- A difficult process, but still achievable with some breakthroughs I imagine.