I felt that endless space was unique and played much better then civ 5. I put 600 hours in it and I must say, the patches really made a difference.





But now that you guys have money, its time to immerse us in the game.







Please for the love of god give every faction character. I don't care if it is subpar voice acting and slideshows, just give us some level of immersion.





The reason I spent 1000 hours on civ 5 wasn't because of the amazing gameplay. It was immersion.





When I see attila wipe china off the map right next to me and i choose to ally him so he doesn't attack me, he asks for open borders in his voice and visual. I accept. He marches his army around my capital then comes on my screen at the end of the turn saying, "Ha, playing your friend was amusing but I think its time we finished this. Don't worry though, you will always have a place in my heart."





Dead. Lose campaign. Best loss ever. I was like, Man I sure do love the crazy attitudes these guys got.





Its one thing to see the cravers declare war on you. Its another to see the craver leader come on your screen and say," I am going to eat your children. Nothing will stop us. You foolish sentient chose to expand into the wrong people."

The giant full-screen diplomacy pop-ups were probably one of the worst changes made to the Civ series, even if they were pretty. Especially when they'd pop up for five seconds just to go "LOL You're an idiot and I hope you die" without actually doing a damn thing. The AI attitudes and reactions in Civ5 are also not what I would call "immersive."

I develop here why I feel the current game mechanics are not in adequacy with the setting. Endless Legend is a close parent to Endless space and the continuity and shoutouts are welcome but so far I'd say the immersion is good in early game and falls around the second era. Why?



Consider that at the start of the game you got this hero and his few loyal explorers, you wanders in the unknown, have to deal with neighboring villages, you don't know if these armies on the prowl are gonna ignore you or suddenly attack... you start getting hold of your first region, then bam, winter.



But then it kinda fades off. You realize you won't struggle to feed your cities (4 food per pop? In the very very worst case put half of them to work on a sterile desert and you can support everyone). Once dust settles in, whenever you don't feel like going though an annoying battle or quest you can bribe every village for a slowly increasing dime. You reach Era 2, you unlock your third (and last!) faction unit, and from there onward you won't unlock anything new, save for some market option. Techs and plans are just upgrades with a precise and somewhat cold efficient aim. Are you building a story, playing a nice or evil empire? Who knows? Only one tech (and it's debatable) does infer you're may be doing something nasty.



I imagine more lore will be available through quests, artefacts and events. They will gradually be added to the game. But the rules themselves? What your faction is decided upon selecting it, and not really apparent there after. Vaulters? A nice science perk, mechanical units, sure, but how does it translate at all in the way you play? Are you cutting down forest, installing labs in ruins? As a windwalker, are you using those jungle as a powerful economic and defensive boon? When playing the broken lords you don't care about food but dust, to the point they just feel like playing a merchantilist/trader faction, without any tie with their knightly nature.

Only the necrophage have arguably gameplay mechanics that permeates their nature : hunt, kill, eat... hunt, kill, eat... build nest.



Some media based immersion will be fine.. but I hope that the game itself let us be immersed beforehand. I'm feeling like I'm playing developped empires with a similar mindset, not a group of people struggling to survive and tame Auriga.

would be great to make winters get worse (along with overall hue change in the game during winter).Also they should add a large chunk of random events that only fire later in the game that have to do with winter (or recovery from winter).

uriak wrote:
I develop here why I feel the current game mechanics are not in adequacy with the setting. Endless Legend is a close parent to Endless space and the continuity and shoutouts are welcome but so far I'd say the immersion is good in early game and falls around the second era. Why?



Consider that at the start of the game you got this hero and his few loyal explorers, you wanders in the unknown, have to deal with neighboring villages, you don't know if these armies on the prowl are gonna ignore you or suddenly attack... you start getting hold of your first region, then bam, winter.



But then it kinda fades off. You realize you won't struggle to feed your cities (4 food per pop? In the very very worst case put half of them to work on a sterile desert and you can support everyone). Once dust settles in, whenever you don't feel like going though an annoying battle or quest you can bribe every village for a slowly increasing dime. You reach Era 2, you unlock your third (and last!) faction unit, and from there onward you won't unlock anything new, save for some market option. Techs and plans are just upgrades with a precise and somewhat cold efficient aim. Are you building a story, playing a nice or evil empire? Who knows? Only one tech (and it's debatable) does infer you're may be doing something nasty.



I imagine more lore will be available through quests, artefacts and events. They will gradually be added to the game. But the rules themselves? What your faction is decided upon selecting it, and not really apparent there after. Vaulters? A nice science perk, mechanical units, sure, but how does it translate at all in the way you play? Are you cutting down forest, installing labs in ruins? As a windwalker, are you using those jungle as a powerful economic and defensive boon? When playing the broken lords you don't care about food but dust, to the point they just feel like playing a merchantilist/trader faction, without any tie with their knightly nature.

Only the necrophage have arguably gameplay mechanics that permeates their nature : hunt, kill, eat... hunt, kill, eat... build nest.



Some media based immersion will be fine.. but I hope that the game itself let us be immersed beforehand. I'm feeling like I'm playing developped empires with a similar mindset, not a group of people struggling to survive and tame Auriga.

I agree with this completely, some flashy screens aren't going to increase immersion, varying the factions and letting you craft a story will.



Also they're the Wild Walkers, not the Wind Walkers.

lukemacu wrote:
I agree with this completely, some flashy screens aren't going to increase immersion, varying the factions and letting you craft a story will.



Also they're the Wild Walkers, not the Wind Walkers.

Haha my bad, thanks!



Thanks for your support. I wonder if the whole thread I created gets no answers because of wall of text or simply people disapproving? I consider this to be a pretty important feature of the game in the long run. So far the lore kinda seems to jump from heroic/fantasy to pretty industrial (just read the tier 4 techs descriptions...) But if it's the latter, then those units should be usings guns, somehow.

for you to use what we would call a "gun" you would need some sort of gunpowder which is unlikely to be implemented, secondly there are still the mystery 5th and 6th ages in which the technology could potentially make radical changes.

I hope to see improvements in diplomatic interactions beyond those seen in Endless Space. In ES, I would just get a notification that X race was now at war with me and I'd shrug and move my fleets to prepare for their attack. So far in EL, I'm experiencing the same thing. When Y race declares war, I make sure to reinforce the nearest city to them and move armies in their direction. It would be nice to see the leader of the Necrophages appear upon clicking the notification, screaming threats and obscenities at me when he declares war instead of a notification saying my relationship has changed from cold war to war. This could be done with each race to give them some more character. I imagine the Vaulters would be cold and calculating, the Broken Lords would be pretentious and overbearing, and the Wild Walkers would mostly be very sensible but if angered they lose a part of themselves to the Sharing and lash out violently with their words and actions.

Adventurer_Blitz wrote:
for you to use what we would call a "gun" you would need some sort of gunpowder which is unlikely to be implemented, secondly there are still the mystery 5th and 6th ages in which the technology could potentially make radical changes.

Or any kind of propellant. I don't really want guns or more modern units (they have giant robots somehow) but that the heroic/epic setting would be more present in the economic and expansion mechanisms.

uriak wrote:


Or any kind of propellant.

I would love to see the devs get creative with gun like weapons that don't use gunpowder, we could end up with some very creative steampunk-esque weapons I think.

lukemacu wrote:
I would love to see the devs get creative with gun like weapons that don't use gunpowder, we could end up with some very creative steampunk-esque weapons I think.

They could use something like air guns which already existed back in 1580 and were quite effectiv.(air gun history).

So they wouldn´t be a piece of advanced technology in comprasion to the Titans for example.

Add a bit Dust and you have a gun without gunpowder is is effective like one with gunpowder.

Im fine with Golems (titans), and this whole "technology read as magic" theme, assuming that Dust is a nanobots left by cosmic civilizacion.

And guns will fit to that, pneumatic guns are one path, also if Dust provides sufficent energy output railguns are possibility.

Vaulters running around with railgun rifles are fine for me.

What is important is to look awesome, and give it a bit of steampunk outlook, so it will be fantasy.



Back to OP, it would be nice if at some stage each AI leader have a personality. Like Wildwaker king will talk how much your faction is bunch of barbarians. Or Necrophages will boast "i will swallow your soul! " In civ5 the interaction with leaders was indeed fun, and more familirial when we seen them on screan. (even if all of them was just bunch of backstabbers!)

After trying a bit the BL again, I guess it's more the population shadowing terrain thing that annoys me, not the industrial premise. What's important is allowing both players and AI to have personality with their empires. Leaders with their specific lines would be a very nice addition indeed, but I hope there will be something included in the empire plans/tecnologies that adds that flavor too, bedised just being generally peaceful (and trade) or aggressive.



For instance if there are some destructive techs or way to produce, have it be a penalty with WildWalkers. Or have Broken Lords hate underhanded tactics (razing cities/improvements)

uriak wrote:
After trying a bit the BL again, I guess it's more the population shadowing terrain thing that annoys me, not the industrial premise. What's important is allowing both players and AI to have personality with their empires. Leaders with their specific lines would be a very nice addition indeed, but I hope there will be something included in the empire plans/tecnologies that adds that flavor too, bedised just being generally peaceful (and trade) or aggressive.



For instance if there are some destructive techs or way to produce, have it be a penalty with WildWalkers. Or have Broken Lords hate underhanded tactics (razing cities/improvements)

What could be interesting is if your city changed how it looked depending on which you way you set your Empire Plan and how often you go into those areas. I can't remember the actual name off the top of my head but say if you went into the military tree at least a bit three plans in a row your city would start to look very militaristic. This would merely be aethesitical but at least it means that a BL Empire focused on war and a BL Empire focused on Science would look different.

lukemacu wrote:
I would love to see the devs get creative with gun like weapons that don't use gunpowder, we could end up with some very creative steampunk-esque weapons I think.

Now we seem to be at a sort of impasse, while many people enjoy creative new applications of real world technologies in video games, many of those people would rather something more fantasy themed like dust weapons rather than a traditional gun. Secondly as far as steampunk goes, it really doesn't fit the feel of this game, at least not to me but I could be in the minority on that one. Thirdly, There are also going to be a few people, wanting this game to be alike to civ and the like, and will push to keep traditional gunpowder based firearms.

The game won't be be anchored in reality weapons wise, even the strategic resource are scifi-fantasy themed materials. It's still low fantasy, but a blend of pre industrial technology with scifi or uchronic science added to the mix. I think so far Endless Legend has it's own unique setting, but the mechanic of the game are still too "cold" and streamlined for this setting (they worked for Endless space).