icarus86 wrote:
Your suggestions are interesting. I would like something like "world diplomatic meeting", a kind of international meeting formally express, where all players may decide sanctions against another player : trade ban, break peace, or war.

Hmm.. I'm not sure a council of auriga, a la Civ 5, would really fit within the theme and mechanics of EL.

Collaborative quests are probably the best equivalent/alternative because, like a council, they can be both collaborative and competitive at the same time.

The global quests in place right now are more focused on competition, offering rewards to only one party and the removal of a debuff for all. Plus they tend to be quickly completed once someone decides to deal with it.



"The minor factions are all starving and need food. whoever contributes the most food stockpiles in X amount of turns will recieve X, 2nd place will get y, 3rd place will get z. Those who dont contribute at all will have all of their pacified villages become aggressive again."

Somthing like this is non-location specific and ensures everyone has a chance to participate... though probably not this exact example since it excludes the broken lords... but still.

I think force alliance and force peace should not exist, because it has no sens and I don't feel it correct with their background.



I think force truce should force a 10 turns of cooldown during the time it cannot be used again the same person.





In multiplayer, this suggestion of force truce for another player could be interesting too. But it needs a cooldown.

I think that suggestion for drakken to have a force truce on other factions is really fantastic. Thought about that too. I could be really, really cool lorewise and in terms of gameplay.

Offering market ban in exchange for something - well, you should watch out for the possibility of lifting it straight after signing the deal. I mean, you market ban the empire, get your benefits, and then lift it right away... which makes it not really usable.

KnightofPhoenix wrote:
I don't think additions like brokering peace, requesting market bans, or requesting the breaking of an alliance would pose too much an obstacle to AI programming, as they are quite similar to other options available (at least to my layman's perspective).



I do agree though that completely new mechanics should probably not be a priority.

It would be tricky to implement in terms of AI, but once the AI is revamped in its diplomacy skills, the addition would be easier to code for.

I don't think additions like brokering peace, requesting market bans, or requesting the breaking of an alliance would pose too much an obstacle to AI programming, as they are quite similar to other options available (at least to my layman's perspective).



I do agree though that completely new mechanics should probably not be a priority.

More diplomatic actions means harder to develop AI, should we not let the devs first fix the current AI ?



I'm not here to tell you to stop speculating about diplomacy in EL2 or a future expansion, I'm a great fan of the idea of a Great Council of Auriga and of all the awesome ideas you posted here.



But maybe should we think of a way to fix the current broken diplomacy first...

Yeah I do like the IDEA of the council but I do not see any simple way to implement it in endless legend because of the structure of the game. I wouldn't want it to be like CIV V because I don't like the way they did it but it would be interesting to maybe have maybe a "market control system" that maybe votes could be done to make certain things in the market cheaper or more expensive other than just using typical economic strategies.

That alliance coordination idea is just brilliant.



It actually makes your alliances (diplomatic slant) something of a military strength as well by allowing the AI to be a resource to be used rather than a speed bump. Would you, as the aggressor, really be willing to pick a fight with 3 allied factions, knowing that you end up with a war on three fronts?



And the Necrophage ability to get buffs depending on how many wars you are actively participating in acts as a natural counter agent to a player trying to "contain" the hive through alliances.

+1. Really nice suggestions. Me gusta

I completely forgot about letting us split alliances diplomatically. Then again, in my experience the AI never made alliances.

I love the way you have designed the diplomacy features in Endless Legends, and would like to see a few more options.



1. Allow players to offer cities in exchange, if they are in an alliance (the same way that cities can be offered as part of a truce proposal). Reason: It should be possible for me return control of a city to its former owner without declaring war on them. For example, I am in alliance with Player A. Player B besieges one of player A's cities and seizes it. Player A is too weak to reclaim it by themself, but his ally, that is me, can do it. I declare war on Player B, besiege the city in question and seize it for myself. At this point I should be able to just return the city to Player A's control. This is only possible if I declare war on my ally and then propose a peace treaty, which will cost me a ton of influence and lose us both 20 turns of alliance. If I keep the city for myself player A's economy remains crippled and I might suffer an approval penalty.



2. Add an option for the other empire to sign a truce treaty with a third party (like the current declare war on third party option) I.E. I offer Player B some compensation for them to make a truce with Player A. This might not be so straight forward, though, since truce proposals in Endless Legend currently need to be ratified by the other party, unlike in say, Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. Would the item in my proposal to Player B be instant truce with Player A (Player A gets no say in it, this seems troublesome), or for them to make a truce proposal to player A (How would that work)? Or maybe I should have to make a simultaneous proposal to both warring parties, and if both accept my proposals they get a truce? Well, this might just be an issue with A.I. empires since human players can be communicated with through chat so now that I think about it this seems pretty low priority for the amount of work involved.

-Expanded Diplomacy Trade

I too would really like be able to broker peace between two empires, but I think alpha centauri may have been a step in the wrong direction with only being able to interact with the initial aggressor. What if the initial aggressor is both your ally and suddenly losing badly?



Being able to make these truce deals with empires at war would be nice, and may best play out as a sort of demand: Make truce with X and I'll give you some stuff, refuse and I go to war with you.



Further, requesting/bribing empires break alliance or make peace with other players would also be a nice extension.

I can distinctly remember running into situations where I wished this were an option. Only problem is that now we have a more direct three way trade going on depending how it plays out...



-Direct unit/army trade.

Right there in diplomacy: I give you 1st stone legion (which contains xyz + this hero), you give me the governor you have in ____ city and some dust.

The only real problem with this would be differences in army size, but im sure that could be worked out in some way.

With this, we could have some legitimate cold wars going on.





I really like the idea of requesting that the roving clans market ban others and the further suggestion that they also receive the ability to increase the market prices on other empires, though it would get complicated with multiple roving clans, but, then, so is market ban.

A council of Auriga would be a nice feature, although I don't see how the Necrophages can participate (perhaps they shouldn't be able to). We can see a council being present in the Drakken video, so it's also "canonical."

Jojo_Fr wrote:
KnightofPhoenix,



Your suggestions are interesting. I would like something like "world diplomatic meeting", a kind of international meeting formally express, where all players may decide sanctions against another player : trade ban, break peace, or war.

+1, sounds lovely. Perhaps in a 'diplomatic-focused' expansion ?

KnightofPhoenix,



Your suggestions are interesting. I would like something like "world diplomatic meeting", a kind of international meeting formally express, where all players may decide sanctions against another player : trade ban, break peace, or war.

The Roving Clans already gain access to inflation, which lowers trade income in another empire, when they progress in their faction quest. It is another, and welcomed, means to wage economic warfare (that I would if anything, buff a little. No one should be able to profit from trade as much as Roving Clans unless they have much longer trade routes).

Would a more gradiated version of Market Ban help them out? Something like "+50% cost on marketplace goods" for the affected empire, in addition to the outright ban. Then they'd have a bit more control over who does what.



Perhaps even make it so that they get that extra 50% in their own pocket.

Turns out this was the right place to suggest new ideas and I got mixed up (apologies newspring). I'll paste my ideas here:



The problems with the AI in diplomacy aside (which I am confident will be improved now that Amplitude has a larger AI team), diplomacy and diplomatic options feel a bit limited in SP (and SP imo should take priority as far as mechanics are concerned).



I propose the addition of new diplomatic actions that would add both flavor and interesting gameplay possibilities:



- Broker peace between two players: the opposite of having a player declare war on another. It would be a costly action, influence wise, and not easy to achieve, but it would allow the player to manipulate the balance of power in more interesting ways. Of course, like in Alpha Centauri, one can only broker that truce with the initial aggressor and not the victim of aggression. I personally would also like to see the Drakken have a Force Truce option on two players, for the sake of flavor and lore, but if it is to be implemented, it needs to cost a lot of influence. In addition, this sort of action if successful, would contribute significantly to diplomatic victory, making the victory condition feel more dynamic and as an actual accomplishment; that you were the diplomatic power that kept Auriga stable and in relative peace.



- Ask Roving Clans to market ban / offer market ban: As it stands, market ban is a nice weapon the RC have, but unlike war which can be asked / offered, the Roving Clans can't use market ban as a diplomatic tool except with its victim. Not only does it fit the lore to have the Roving Clans use its ability to market ban as a diplomatic leverage with all empires, but it would also give more interesting options for the RC diplomatically, given their lack of ability to wage war. It would also make the RC, in SP at least, a more useful ally.



- Alliance coordination: as it stands currently, there is not that great of a difference between an alliance and being at peace. I would like to see alliance open up new options, like being able to coordinate a war effort by setting targets. You can request for an ally to attack one specific city or to send reinforcements to defend one of your own cities. Hopefully the AI can also do the same (it shouldn't be too difficult, I hope). This would make alliances more interesting, as opposed to them being just a tool to get more diplomacy points.



I think having these options would make diplomacy more interesting, and I hope that the AI will be improved to be able to use them effectively as well as the options already present (AI never asks us to go to war with anyone, for instance).

Such improvements would make diplomacy more interesting, dynamic, and more flavorful.

Oh, what a nice coincidence! I'll check it out now.

Oh, I just made a thread about this right here, before I saw yours. I also used Alpha Centauri as an example!



Since I posted my thread in the balance section, where the devs are asking for new ideas and suggestions, feel free to post your ideas there!