Very fast, I think right now Nidya is the best cannonfodder in the game. They can cripple reinforcement flags and will necessarily give your entire army initiative.



They´re not great damage dealers and won´t survive like Ended and Daemons, so if you need tanky units Nidya should be a secondary assimilation, but they´re one of the best secondary for sure.

BPrado wrote:
Very fast, I think right now Nidya is the best cannonfodder in the game. They can cripple reinforcement flags and will necessarily give your entire army initiative.



They´re not great damage dealers and won´t survive like Ended and Daemons, so if you need tanky units Nidya should be a secondary assimilation, but they´re one of the best secondary for sure.

I tend to just research the racial tanks both for Vaulters and Wild Walkers and look for a healer for the other assimilation slot - with a preference for Sisters since they are slightly tankier than the others, as well as have better aesthetics. If I were to seek a tank, is Harmonites the clear superior option?

I think so. Harmonites have great assim bonuses and are naturally durable. Tbh, I've been assimilating the same races over and over again and haven't really dabbled outside of Kazanji, Haunted, Silics, Urces, Dorgeshi in terms of units. Out of those, I really only build the Daemons, Ended, Harmonites with a splash of the other two.



I will also assim Erycis, Eyeless for their bonuses in sufficient amounts of a six movement for scouts/quick troop movements.

KissBlade wrote:
I think so. Harmonites have great assim bonuses and are naturally durable. Tbh, I've been assimilating the same races over and over again and haven't really dabbled outside of Kazanji, Haunted, Silics, Urces, Dorgeshi in terms of units. Out of those, I really only build the Daemons, Ended, Harmonites with a splash of the other two.



I will also assim Erycis, Eyeless for their bonuses in sufficient amounts of a six movement for scouts/quick troop movements.

Interesting. I've only assimilated the Sisters, Silics, Nidyam and Dorgeshi for their units. I guess I haven't really looked at what the assimilation bonuses are, since I am musing MFs for purely as unit supplements.



Edit: By the way, is there a reason to pick a cavalry unit at all if you have access to fliers? That is, are there any roles where cavalry are clearly superior than fliers?

Silics make fine tanks, if you need them, but in my opinion the real reason to assimilate them is the passive bonus. If you're just using them for the units, there are good alternatives-- urces, kanzanji, factional tanks like the walkers.



Cavalry tend to have higher initiative than flyers, which makes them especially good at rushing reserve flags or ranged units. But I don't think it makes a lot of sense to think about cavalry as cavalry, as a single monolithic group. Bos have good movement and can make effective tanks thanks to free counter. Burdeki have an all-important stun that you can use to control threats. Gauran are good all-around, but they're probably your best bet for ranged control.

Cavalry also have more battle movement than flyers.



In addition, Geldirus and Gauran have winter immunity, which is quite valuable.

Nosferatiel wrote:
That's why you should always have a cultist unit with your minor faction armies to convert while looting.

broken lords by far, at least in the mid to late game (if they can make it that far):

-instant dust heal

-passive healing within battles

-decent units

This is a tough question to answer without understanding what you want to know.



The faction with the best economy (IMO) is the best in military as they can build the most, so that means the Vaulters (what I voted above). Roving Clans and Wild Walkers (early) also have economic advantages that allow them to bring a strong military to the table.



Now if you looking at straight up units and abilities where economy is equal, that's a different story (please read on)...



Note:



- I play pretty much every game on Fast speed with a tight (MP) map and as much multiplayer as possible. This means wars are starting sooner than later.



- I like to see Major Faction units (especial the ones that require research) bringing something unique to the table and that's captured in "Faction Unit Selection"



Wild Walkers



POWER =

FACTION UNIT SELECTIONS =



Range 4 + a hero that gives more range is nuts and Rangers are the most powerful starting unit and one of the best in the game. I've never (not even the AI) seen a Shaman in game and Tenai Walkers are easily substituted by MF tanks, both units should be more distinct and bring something unique to the table. I don't see Wild Walkers as a military faction, so I don't think they should be too strong.



Broken Lords



POWER = 1/2

FACTION UNIT SELECTIONS = 1/2



Stalwarts and Dust Bishops are nice units. Just under 4 stars for power as they need ranged backup. Dust Bishops seem to be more balanced since release. Ryder's Stun hammers + drain are cool (if unoriginal), I'd like this unit not to be a Dervish. The healing and life drain in battle make them vary resilient. IMO, the BLs should be strong militarily with a balance between defense and aggression.



Vaulters



POWER =

FACTION UNIT SELECTIONS =



Like the flexibility. Marines are nice starting units but nothing special. Dawn Officers and Titans are easily substituted by MF units and need to bring something unique to the table. Easy access to the Teleport make up for the blandness of their units. I'd like to see the Vaulters as low-middle of the pack for Military, but stronger when on the defensive.



Necrophages



POWER =

FACTION UNIT SELECTIONS =



Out of all the Major Factions, I like this set of units the best and the power level feels right (when played properly). All units have a place and have a unique ability that is not replacable by MF units. I don't like what the big Proliferator stacks do to combat pace, but they aren't necessarily OP. Necrophages should be at/near the top of the military pile with focus on aggression.



Ardent Mages



POWER =

FACTION UNIT SELECTIONS = 1/2



Like the Necrophages, these are a nice set of units. Like the glass cannon flavor and feels like the right power level. Ardent Fire is an interesting ability and makes these units unique. Zealot has been toned down so that's good. I've never used the flyer but the spells are nice. I see the Mages as middle of the pack in military with focus on offense.



Roving Clans



POWER =

FACTION UNIT SELECTION =



Love the all-cavalry speed theme here. Yirmak doesn't bring anything unique to the table over the Dervish. EDIT (Thanks GameSlayer989) Double health on Mercenaries adds a lot of extra punch mid-later game. A good player can play nasty with the fast units. Feels a little over-powered. I don't consider RC to be a military faction so I don't expect a lot of power here.



Drakken



POWER = 1/2

FACTION UNIT SELECTION =



Like the Fast Learner "elite" feel. I don't understand why the Drakkenling has the most health in the game. Wyverns are a strong Era 1 unit. Not sure what to do with the Ancient. IMO Drakken should be middle of the pack with small numbers of Elite troops



Cultists



POWER = ?

FACTION UNIT SELECTION =



I've played exactly 2 games as the Cultists so I don't have an opinion on power but it seems like they can be bottled up early if opponents put their mind to it. I like the Preacher as a support unit with strong buffs to allies, not sure if they are strong enough ATM. Fanatic and Nameless Guard are stock cavalry and archers . However the conversion mechanic brings a lot of unit diversity. I tend to think Cultists need to be strong militarily, but should that strength come from their core units or their converts?



[hr][/hr]



Overall, if you disregard economic advantages, I don't feel there's any big issues with military power. No faction stands out as really bad or exceptionally OP. Many units are a little bland though. Of course, you really can't ignore the economy because great units don't matter if you can't buy/make enough of them.



EDIT: One additional point - Most units have two variations of weapon. In most cases the choice is a no-brainer. It would be nice if the weapon options made some interesting variations.

While Cultists could be countered by an enemy attacking them early on, I believe they have many advantages over any other faction for military power. First, the cultists has the ability to convert minor faction villages. If the cultists get enough villages, they can obtain an overwhelming force of minor faction units, which are produced without burdening the main city's economy, allowing it to build up itself even more while other factions focus all of their cities into building units. Second, Cultists have the ability to raze a city automatically upon its capture, which makes them the most successful of all raiders, as they do not have to defend the captured city until they have the option to raze it. Third, the Cultists have a lot to gain from razed cities, with all of the bonuses for razing a city and the freedom to convert and defend the villages within.

I have yet to play as the Cultists in a MP game or play against a strong Cultist opponent so I'm unsure on their power.



I'm positive that if they are left unchecked they would turn into a nasty force, but so would any other faction. Just like the Necrophages, a good opponent (especially one nearby) is going to recognize that they are coming after you sooner or later.

I feel that the double health on mercenaries trait is so strong that the roving clans have the best military. However since that's not a racial ability...

They didn't specify that these were based on affinity, so I am going to assume that this is vanilla factions balance only.

Propbuddha wrote:
Ryder's Stun hammers + drain are cool (if unoriginal), I'd like this unit not to be a Dervish. The healing and life drain in battle make them vary resilient.



[...]



Overall, if you disregard economic advantages, I don't feel there's any big issues with military power. No faction stands out as really bad or exceptionally OP. Many units are a little bland though. Of course, you really can't ignore the economy because great units don't matter if you can't buy/make enough of them.



EDIT: One additional point - Most units have two variations of weapon. In most cases the choice is a no-brainer. It would be nice if the weapon options made some interesting variations.

About the ryders, maybe I have missed something, but their lifesteal ability seems too low to be of any value. Could you please explain why you consider their drain ability 'cool' (~5hp per attack for a level 5 unit, which has ~300+hp seems quite irrelevant to me)?



That being said I quoted your conclusion because I agree with you : on overall the military balance looks quite good. Of course it needs some tweaks here or there, but I think it is more gear related than unit related.

Naturally, the Necrophages have the best military efficiency. So I voted for them. However that does not mean they are overpowered. It feels just right, considering their diplomacy handicap.

The cult seems a little weird with their conversion, as destroyed villages cannot be converted, so all enemy's need to do is burn all of your little villages and there doesn't seem to be anything you can do about it.

Igncom1 wrote:
The cult seems a little weird with their conversion, as destroyed villages cannot be converted, so all enemy's need to do is burn all of your little villages and there doesn't seem to be anything you can do about it.

Destroyed villages can be converted at twice the cost. It hurts them, but it doesn't kill them.

Nosferatiel wrote:
Destroyed villages can be converted at twice the cost. It hurts them, but it doesn't kill them.

huh, i must have missed the option when presented........



Now I remember, minor faction units can't be used to convert villages, I distinctly remember being un able to convert with them.

Igncom1 wrote:
huh, i must have missed the option when presented........



Now I remember, minor faction units can't be used to convert villages, I distinctly remember being un able to convert with them.

That's why you should always have a cultist unit with your minor faction armies to convert while looting.

Hello everyone!



Here is a new poll to vote and debate. This will help us to get and analyse your general feeling for balancing purposes

Please feel free to develop your thought and your vote if you want to. Bullet points are always welcome.



Thank you!