No Titanium-70!

SirNitram

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:52:44 PM

I also have a problem finding Titanium-70 in my part of the galaxy (without going through a wormhole) in 3 games in a row now. There simply is none, making even the most simple rockets unobtainable...

Abremms

Newcomer

Abremms

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:04:47 PM

VieuxChat wrote:
It's more than strategic. Because without them you can't have beams ! (in theory. Because at the moment you just have to research the beams level 2 to get a beams without titanium restriction)

same with missiles. and I say GOOD. that means that whoever has Ti70 at the start of the game has an advantage. as it should be. Research far enough and you get the same tech, but people with the right strategic resources get it first.

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:05:25 PM

But if a whole portion of the game is locked through ownership of something that exist once or twice in the galaxy ?

Abremms

Newcomer

Abremms

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:09:41 PM

but it does exist! If it doesn't exist in the galaxy at all, then ok thats a bug. But as long as it exists, then It's working. If there is one system with Ti70, take it. With good AI, that system would be the most important battleground in the game. at least at the start.

And it doesn't lock you out of anything. As far as I know, everything that requires Ti70 at the start of the game, has a version that doesn't require Ti70 further down the tech tree. All it does is give the faction with the Ti70 that ship/weapon sooner.

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:11:36 PM

Abremms wrote:
but it does exist! If it doesn't exist in the galaxy at all, then ok thats a bug. But as long as it exists, then It's working. If there is one system with Ti70, take it. With good AI, that system would be the most important battleground in the game. at least at the start.

And it doesn't lock you out of anything. As far as I know, everything that requires Ti70 at the start of the game, has a version that doesn't require Ti70 further down the tech tree. All it does is give the faction with the Ti70 that ship/weapon sooner.

But I'm not sure that the tech are orking as intended. Why would the level 1 need titanium and not the future ones ? It's counter-intuitive.

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:14:43 PM

VieuxChat wrote:
But I'm not sure that the tech are orking as intended. Why would the level 1 need titanium and not the future ones ? It's counter-intuitive.

I don't agree because if they're further, it means that they are more powerfull, and so you have to wait longer to unlock them. It's that at a certain step in the game, you'll stucked because of your lack of ressources, and other will have an advantage. But if you survive, at the end, you'll be able to move on without this ressources.

Ebrim

Newcomer

Ebrim

Newcomer

12 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:30:56 PM

Yeah you can just research past the restriction, considering how quickly this goes by, I think the advantage gained by having access to Ti70 is actually less than it should be. Unlike say in Civ where if you don't have iron you're screwed until gunpowder.

Hobbesian

Titanium

SELECT that_fuzzy_tiger FROM digital_animals WHERE vocal='roars' AND description='loudly';

Hobbesian

Titanium

27 100g2g pts

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:45:44 PM

Ti-70 can be critical for certain hulls (based on I imagine race). I would suggest that the seeding system takes account and ensures that there's at least nodes of minerals appropriate to tech progression within 5 "Jumps" of your home system. Even if it's only one, it's better to have something which gives an out no matter how slim, as opposed to being hosed through lack of a mineral or resource. Researching past the restriction is all good and well, but it probably would be wise to ensure all races have the very basics of their civ available.

Oleyo

Newcomer

Oleyo

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 4:49:28 PM

And if you dont have titanium, then no one does...gives the play-through a different set of circumstances to deal with...I think thats kinda cool.

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:59:55 PM

All ressources are important in different steps along the game!

kitsunewill

Newcomer

kitsunewill

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 2:59:06 AM

Totally locking down an entire branch of technologies because you can't find the right resource just seems like bad design to me. But at the same time, I do like the idea of having strategic resources that give your side an advantage if you take the time to find them.

Maybe a middle ground is what is needed: make the weapons not require the resource, but create a second, more effective version that does. That way whoever finds the stuff can have an advantage, but everyone else isn't locked out.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

700g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 3:07:17 AM

I know a bit about the resource placement in Civ IV from writing mods. Most total conversion mods, as well as the basic game, have a step near the end of the system generation process which checks for this. If any of the key ingredients (for whatever the mod is) are not present near each player starting location, this step adds one. So instead of changing the tech tree, it may be better to add a step like this. I like this dependency in the tech tree, but I have quit a few early games if I get Core Mining and there are no systems near me with Titanium-70.

SomethingBlue

Space Musician

SomethingBlue

Space Musician

25 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 3:15:21 AM

I like the idea of a game with a few or even single examples of certain strategic resources. It would make for a very important holding, and you would want/need to defend it. I agree, though, that if a tech has a requirement for a certain resource, the rest of the similar techs should require it as well. It is probably just unfinished coding in the case of the alpha.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

700g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 3:39:05 AM

I guess we have to distinguish between resources which are "nice to have" and give a good bonus, vs those which are critical. In Civ IV, iron is pretty essential. I think this game should have some like that. I guess Titanium-70 is like that. It is possible, but very unusual and very difficult, to succeed on a start position with no iron. It should be very, very rare to have a start with no Titanium-70. It should never happen that an entire map should be without it, so perhaps this is an improvement needed in the map generator.

Draczar

Newcomer

Draczar

Newcomer

22 500g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 3:50:30 AM

kitsunewill wrote:
Totally locking down an entire branch of technologies because you can't find the right resource just seems like bad design to me. But at the same time, I do like the idea of having strategic resources that give your side an advantage if you take the time to find them.

Maybe a middle ground is what is needed: make the weapons not require the resource, but create a second, more effective version that does. That way whoever finds the stuff can have an advantage, but everyone else isn't locked out.

The tech branches aren't locked out though since you can research past it as the strategic resource only applies to about 3 versions of the modules out of a much larger family. Also the most powerful modules in every tech path don't require any strategic resources to build.

Jaccubin

Old Survivor

Jaccubin

Old Survivor

12 900g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 3:55:11 AM

In the unfortunate event where you can't get t-70 you can alwasy just rush lasers, you just need to adapt to what you've got.

RDSFirebane

Newcomer

RDSFirebane

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 4:05:07 AM

Had this issue as well but thought it kinda added to the realism of the game there's really no guarantee that certain elements are going to be plentiful.

kazi

Newcomer

kazi

Newcomer

300g2g pts

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 4:07:10 AM

I'm guessing that everyone wants it for the starting missile tech? I've had plenty of games without T70. It's not a big deal.

Ignore the missiles. Lasers reign supreme. Usually second-tier lasers + destroyers is enough to conquer the first empire you come across on normal. Chances are, they probably have your T70.

BlazerMortis

Newcomer

BlazerMortis

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:40:31 PM

don't be afraid to start a new game. that's the real benefit to ES. starting a new game is no biggie. playing multiple times gives you a better opportunity to learn the play style that you enjoy, what faction is your favorite, etc...

so don't hold back on playing multiple times. play with the settings to find what works best.

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:33:14 PM

When you create a game you can choose the rareness of the resources. Maybe just a bad luck ?

BlazerMortis

Newcomer

BlazerMortis

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:34:16 PM

What Vieux said. Resource rarity is a setting you decide. If you've having trouble playing with resources that are rare, go the other way.

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:36:32 PM

Did you unlock the technology or not? Since it, you can't find ressources.

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:36:51 PM

thing is, i havnt touched to the ressource rarity setting...

TheJami

Old

TheJami

Old

13 300g2g pts

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:36:58 PM

Ive had a little trouble with that too, first time it was because i hadn't gotten the tech that actualy discovers it! but the next time it was just sheer bad luck. got stomped that game because of it, was really counting on my new ship type. :/

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:38:20 PM

sooooo... i have to begin a new game again?

AGAIN????

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:38:54 PM

Did you unlock the tech or not?

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:40:06 PM

yes i did unlock it...

its like siderite... soooo damn rare!

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:31:56 PM

this is really annoying because: i've explored 3/4 of my galaxy and i did not find a SINGLE Titanium deposit... is it normal? and is there a way to createe some? and stupid horatio wants my ionic crystals... wich they won't have...

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:41:16 PM

i think i did that 5 times in 2 days...

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:48:08 PM

You can increase the amount of ressources before starting a new party.

Ebrim

Newcomer

Ebrim

Newcomer

12 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:49:25 PM

Can you trade for it, or is there just none? I also have found that my desire for small galaxies makes some things just not be there. I'm thinking my next game will be normal map with limited resources...

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:50:45 PM

noce of the existing faction have the titanium... i went to check in the diplomatic tech treade system and they didnt have it

Gordon

Newcomer

Gordon

Newcomer

200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:52:30 PM

Had the same problem. With a broken heart, I started a new game, slowly forgetting about the last. :rolleyes:

QcNoodle

Fresh

QcNoodle

Fresh

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:54:07 PM

this time i can be sure i'll boost the titanium deposits when i start a game...

Abremms

Newcomer

Abremms

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:56:24 PM

I haven't had a game with Ti70 in my starting area yet.

I kind of like it, strategic resources SHOULD be strategic! if everyone has them, then they don't have much of a point. they should be rare, sought after, and most importantly, fought after. My first game, I started a war to take a planet with Ti70 to get my first supply. Had the AI been less terrible, I can imagine the war going poorly for me at first. maybe losing a system or two while I focus on taking the Ti70, but once I have the Ti70 and start churning out bigger and better warships the tide turns! that makes for good gameplay.

Consider Civilization 5. for all of its faults, and I'd prefer not to get into them here, they did strategic resources very well. If you had iron in the early game and your neighbor did not, you had a serious advantage. If your neighbor had Iron and you did not, then I tried very hard not to start a war with him until I had a way to negate that advantage.

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

13 years ago

May 6, 2012, 3:58:27 PM

It's more than strategic. Because without them you can't have beams ! (in theory. Because at the moment you just have to research the beams level 2 to get a beams without titanium restriction)

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