Planetary Institute - Endless Space

Planetary Institute

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Maclardal

Newcomer

Maclardal

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:06:58 PM

Does the Planetary Institute seem a bit overpowered? It offers +6 to each FIDS and -3 to Dust for maintenance as a system improvement. (You get it at the same time as Lava terraforming in the bottom tree) To me this seems a no-brainer. You have an improvement which isn't based on population so you always come out better off. I appreciate it might just be a nice structure that is meant to be designed like this, but most others in the game require you to check on your population levels and planet types, rather than being definitely useful.

Anyone else find this? Other opinions on the structure?

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Igncom1

Craver

Infantry win firefights. Tanks win battles. Artillery win wars.

Igncom1

Craver

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:10:10 PM

I think this may be the case of 'Alpha is Alpha'.

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Maclardal

Newcomer

Maclardal

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:12:24 PM

Oh I fully agree, I had just wondered if it was intended this way.

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Platescale

Drakken

Platescale

Drakken

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:14:43 PM

Does it add +6 to the resource rate, or just a flat +6 to the system? I thought it was a flat +6 to the system. The system as a whole produces six food, six production, six research, and six dust more than it did before. (Three dust, after maintenance.) This is pretty good for getting a new system up to scratch, but it's not massive to a heavily developed system. I've only played the game through once (Sophon to an Economic Victory). What I found in that playthrough was that the Planetary Institute was good for any system, and worth rush-buying for fresh colonies. It didn't seem like a game-changing technological unlock.

I may just not be very experienced yet, of course. I'm playing my second game now.

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Maclardal

Newcomer

Maclardal

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:17:11 PM

You're right, it is a flat +6 in each group, it just seems too easy

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MaterialDefender

Newcomer

MaterialDefender

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 5:37:17 PM

Mostly it's for helping new systems start out because of the food addition. THe production and dust boost is too small to make a god damn difference with late game stuff and the science boost is just hilarious compared to needing 12k to research stuff.

SO yeah, basically it's for fresh systems to get a leg up so it doesn't take them like a billion turns to get going.

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Maclardal

Newcomer

Maclardal

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 6:05:15 PM

True, but it is quite far down the tree if you are evenly researching in each tree, or if you are say forced down the military tree early on due to evil neighbours. I'm not saying it's no longe useful for an established empire when colonising, but it is considerably less useful than it would be to a civ at an earlier stage in the game. Maybe that's just it, perhaps giving it a bit earlier in the tree.

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Platescale

Drakken

Platescale

Drakken

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 6:30:22 PM

In games like this, I always play on slow time and huge maps. I'm trying to optimize the efficacy of development - it's a good feeling when something builds in one turn on a slowed down timescale, because it means I've optimized production better than would be possible on a faster setting.

Maybe that's why I haven't been forced down the military tree yet. I also have been playing No Pirates. There's no real sign of independent stellar civilization... so why should pirates exist? Maybe if 'city state' NPC systems are added, I'll turn pirates back on too, because then they'd make sense.

Anyways, with no need to research evenly, I tend to go down the 'east' and 'south' tech trees first. Which is to say, Applied Sciences and Exploration and Expansion. That makes Planetary Institute easier to reach early.

Unless one of the not-revealed factions happens to be reptillian, I can't imagine I'm going to play very often as anything but Sophons. (On a related note, I really hope there's going to be a reptillian faction.) When I play something else, I'll probably play them more or less like I play the Sophons. It's because I'm not warlike by nature... and the power of technological supremacy seems to be unmatchable, anyways. Might be interesting to play around and see how hard it is to out-tech the Sophons as another faction in a galaxy where the Sophons are one of my opponents...

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MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 6:34:07 PM

Overpowered, no. But really usefull, yes. But it takes some time to build.

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gunnergoz

Old Timer

"Things are getting better! Well, maybe not as good as yesterday, but definitely better than tomorrow!" - old Soviet era humor

gunnergoz

Old Timer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 6:45:40 PM

In late game, if you have a good dust generation scheme going, you can just buy the improvement outright for a new system and push its development nicely...assuming you have the dust of course.

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STRONTJESBERG

Newcomer

STRONTJESBERG

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 7:01:11 PM

It's handy for early colonies. The bonusses are good early, but some systems get 500+production and 1000+science, so I don't think it is overpowered.

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HolyTerror

Newcomer

HolyTerror

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 7:28:34 PM

MaterialDefender wrote:
Mostly it's for helping new systems start out because of the food addition. THe production and dust boost is too small to make a god damn difference with late game stuff and the science boost is just hilarious compared to needing 12k to research stuff.

SO yeah, basically it's for fresh systems to get a leg up so it doesn't take them like a billion turns to get going.

I know what your saying and i agree with a slight caveat. It seems this was designed so that once you have your empire going, the new planet you colonize will have a little help improving so that they can become productive sooner.

If this was not the case, it might take alot longer for you to turn a new system into a productive member of the society. I don't think it is a deal breaker, specially since there are plenty of malus from other things.

Basically I think it will even out lol.

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madgiraf

Newcomer

madgiraf

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 7:56:36 PM

VieuxChat wrote:
Overpowered, no. But really usefull, yes. But it takes some time to build.

Would even say "necessary" rather than usefull.

smiley: biggrin

There are a few techs like this, you just can't or shouldn't ignore them.

Personally, after like 30 long games on all kind of settings and races (yeah I played quite a lot so far, but not as much as I want to) I think the economics are fairly done. Having played another 40-50 short or very short games (learning phase), I find it balanced and not too hard to learn for the newbie, not too easy to master for the veteran. Of course some adjustments could (and probably would) be done, but the planetary institute concept (maybe not values) should stay where it is.

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TheDarkside

Newcomer

TheDarkside

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 8:01:44 PM

It's a no-brainer type of building which I kind of feels shouldn't be. Why bother having it in the game then? It's not something for specializing your colony or characterizing it - it's just this somewhat silly +6 across the board with no penalty since it pays for itself and then some.

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madgiraf

Newcomer

madgiraf

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 8:08:00 PM

TheDarkside wrote:
It's a no-brainer type of building which I kind of feels shouldn't be. Why bother having it in the game then? It's not something for specializing your colony or characterizing it - it's just this somewhat silly +6 across the board with no penalty since it pays for itself and then some.

Well its a 6-6-3-6 then, but you still have to research it and build it (and even if you know you'll need it in everygame, you don't know if you're not gonna research it or build it a the wrong time, not as simple as it seems). It's very rewarding and it's actually a kind of "milestone" building that can solve many issues you may have in a system (i.e. overly struck with bad anomalies, overly bad planet types for your needs and no tech to terraform them) or give you some freedom of management you may need for other projects in other systems.

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Platescale

Drakken

Platescale

Drakken

13 years ago

May 7, 2012, 9:32:51 PM

Some of the buildings are overspecialized, as it is. (I think space elevators should be more expensive, but also more generally beneficial than they currently are.) A few 'no brainers' isn't always a terrible thing. It just tends to reinforce the strength of builder/researcher strategies. Whether that's desirable or not is a matter of balance.

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