Many users have expressed their discontent with the current combat system and proposed to extend ship customization and add a tactical turn-based combat system like in Master of Orion.

I doubt this will convince the developers as the game is already quite developed and their approach to combat clearly goes in a different direction.



With this post I want to channel suggestions to extend the current combat mechanics to keep the spirit of fast and high-level combat but still add more tactical depth and more user interaction to make it more fun to play! All suggestions can be directly implemented in the current game design without major changes.



If you think something like this should be added to the game please post a reply! Also please feel free to propose more ideas, but keep in mind that they should not require fundamental changes. The more people are behind this the more likely we will be heard and the more likely more tactical depth will be added to the combat system!



[LIST=1]

Special tactical modules which can be be researched, built into ships and used in combat with a special card:

• Fighters: e.g. good vs. small ships and shields
• Bombers: e.g. good vs. large ships and armor
• Heavy Anti-Ship Cannon: needs 1 turn to charge and deals heavy damage to ships
• Tractor beam: slows down enemy ships and increases chance to hit for own ships
• Marine pods: can be shoot out and will try to conquer an enemy ship
• Supercomputer: finds weaknesses and decreases enemy armor ratings
  
  

Special strategic modules which can be researched, built into ships and have an effect on the strategic map:

• Invasion pods: faster invasion of enemy planets, instead of the general +x to invasion bonus
• Planetary bombs: kills some population and destroys some improvements
• Planet-Destroyer: decreases planet size and kills population - for the late game
• Warp inhibitor: decreases movement speed of enemy ships to and from the system
• Construction module: provides +construction to star system where the ship currently is
• Farm module: provides +food to the star system where the ship currently is
• Science lab: provides +science and gets bonus when orbiting uncolonized systems.
• Black market: provides +dust and get bonus when orbiting foreign colonies
• Spionage module: Makes a ship invisible for the enemy, does not allow any weapons on the ship, spies on construction, fleets etc. and reveals enemy ships with spionage modules. (this would of course be optional if real spies would be added)
  
  

Chain effects for combat cards. Chaining cards allows for a more interesting gameplay in combat as choices from the previous rounds have an effect.

• Basic cards get stronger when used several times in a row. An example: The first use of overload does +35% damage, if used again in the next round it does +50% damage and if used a third time it does +100% damage. If countered with e.g. defense than the chain is finished.
• Cards which may only be used if another card has been played before. An example: "Laser weapon hacking" disables a percentage of the enemy ship lasers and may only be used if "Sabotage" has been played before.
• There are endless more interesting possibilites here!
  
  

More cards per turn would allow more choices and thus more involvement of the player. The number of cards which can be playes could be linked to the fleet size. For example: 1-3 ships = 1 card per turn, 4-7 ships = 2 cards per turn, and so on. Heros could also get a special ability which enables them to play an additional card per round.

Initiative: One side or the other would get initiative in the battle and would get to place a card second. This way one side would get the chance to see what the other side plays and be able to counter tactics. This initiative could be per battle or per phase. This could mean more strategy involved in playing cards and disadvantages for having slower, less maneuverable ships.

More hero cards are perhaps already under development. The heroes should really have more special abilities. For example special chaining effects or general boosts to effects. For example heroes with a high offense rating could give bonuses to all offense cards. Currently one does not really notice how a hero affects the outcome of a battle.

Tactical cards which affects ship targeting, fleet formation and maneuvers. Theses card would probably also require a compace overview about the health, weaponary and armor of own and enemy ships.

• Focus fire on weakest: all fire will be focused on the weakest ship
• Precise fire: Less shots but more damage, good to breach armor
• Barrage: More shots but less damage, good vs weakly armored ships
• "Armor to the front": heavily armored ships are moved to the front and suck in most of the damage to protected weaker/special ships in the back.
• "Attack the flanks": weaker ships are attacked, but own ships are more exposed to enemy fire.
• There are endless more for possibilities here! There are probably also much more creative/envolving names for formations
  
  

[/list]



If you feel that combat needs more tactical depth please post below and add your suggestions! But keep in mind that all theses suggestions can be implemented easily into the current system and do not require a complete rewrite of combat.

Nice synthesis! I recognize several of the great ideas already propose in some threads around.

>Robust Fleet formations systems(see: tim in the revamp thread)

>Diverse weapon/defense/accessories(subsystems) choices

>Targeting priority commands(stolen from GSB or star ruler, pre-set before combat would work best with the RPS system, and even with a "Diverse choice" system) Alternatively, allow targeting in-battle, slow battle down a notch but give options to change battle speed

>Battle animations need to be refined but I think that one is naturally on the to-do list.

>More diverse heroes, the talent point system from civ can be expanded upon, and they need more baseline benefits, other than "pilot" "commander" "governor" I am drawing a blank on as to what to add to heroes though.

>I know it was answered by a dev, and if you fix Interdiction they are not needed but Star Bases/Battlestations(customizable) would make for solid additions at some point.

>Only pseudo related to combat: an option to turn on Space creatures &/or an "Ancient Homeworld" would be cool, I really like the suggestion of a "Guardian" that actively drains "nearby" planets or even space itself, so he can't be zerged down, or he should have some sort of anti-zerg mechanic O_o.

>More cards. which has been suggested above can be used to remedy a part of the combat system.

there is more in the other thread which should be compiled, the above post does a good starting job though.

What about some type of initiative mechanism. One side or the other would get initiative in the battle and would get to place a card second. This way one side would get the chance to see what the other side plays and be able to counter tactics, etc. This initiative could be based on ship speed, maneuverability, or just random. This initiative could be per battle or per phase. This could mean more strategy involved in playing cards and disadvantages for having slower, less maneuverable ships.



Just thought of something else; how about having a random selection, out of all the cards you have, available for each battle. That would lessen the chances of just using the same cards all the time.

These are great ideas, I'll add them to the main post!

More depth would be greatly appreciated indeed. I agree with most the ideas presented. One point I partially disagree with is "More cards per turn". I feel like - yes - there should be more actions per turn but not more plays of the cards we have now. Instead we could perhaps get one of the current ones, one fleet formation card and so on, with possibly different choices at different phases.



A few more things I would like to contribute :

- Battle plans : The ability to pick what the general idea for this battle is. This would apply to all phases. Example : Ordering the fleet to escort one ship(for example : a colonizer) would make it much harder to hit for the enemy at the cost of making the rest of the fleet take more damage.

- Range preference : If my ships are faster and/or more maneuverable, I am able to lengthen the duration of the battle phase that suits me best. Example : I have weapons suited to close range fighting so my ships would attempt to close the gap as fast as they can - meaning shorter long range and medium range phases.

- Doctrines : While not directly combat related, these would apply to all my forces and thus provide a global bonus. They would take time to change as they represent the whole philosophy of warfare one faction adheres to. Doctrines could unlock new options and boost certain cards while excluding others. Example : Hit-and-run tactics would favour smaller ship classes and shorter engagements with high damage but slow reloading weapons.

- Variable phase lengths and counts : these would depend on the ships' speeds, the gravity of the environment where the battle takes place and possibly the size of the fleets involved.

- Card play speed bonus : If you play your cards earlier you get a bonus but the enemy has a longer window to detect your choice. It might be that he narrows down your choice to two or three possibilities and then has to act according to his guess as to which one you chose. This would lead to having electronic warfare(and counter modules) and sensor modules(and counter modules) giving you an advantage either way : case 1 : you force your opponent to play his cards late and thus with less effect or, case 2 : he plays early and you get good intel on his choices and have a good chance at countering them.

the ideas i see here are awesome but i like to see more with battle plans for example if i see my fleets are failing in a direct assualt then i would have some of my fleet go in first then in the next phase the rest of them go in behind them and attack from a different direction then if i was the commander of that fleet have some sort of counter measures to that.

one thing i dont understand is how come i can stack fleets but they cant enter combat together like i said before they can come in for a ambush or just as reinforcements to help the fleet already in place.

what else id like to see is a retreat option i dont like to sit here and just watch my fleet get wiped out because im out match by 3 dreadnaughts.

oh and speaking of dreadnaughts it seems that as soon as a race gets that class of ship thats all they make sure i might see other class types but once i wipe them out with my dreads, the battleship and corvette class just vanish entirely from the opposing fleets and have no more use. the idea that one ship class can wipe out an entire fleet of corvettes is to be frank horrible especially when its just 1 dreadnaught.

now onto the next idea invasion battle would be great to see i dont really like the system in place since it takes to long to invade a planet and then all the work i put into it seemed to vanish (or that could be a glitch i experienced could be worth looking into). i have an idea on how the fights could work the fleets could come in and the object is to capture the main city while the city has its own defences a battleplan thing could come into play and the ships in hanger could come into play taking off to stop the invasion in atmosphere while the citys defences help. just an idea it is your game but i would like to have more control over the battle even if the system stays in give us more options before battle.

i would give more input but it looks like the other ideas i had have already been said.

seriously fix the dreadnaughts they frustrate me greatly

All that sounds fun, but so many changes really sounds like a new system. All those modules and cards would lead to a tactical-RPG style of combat. In particular, I don't see how to make it work when you're giving orders to an entire fleet, all at once.



I guess I'm looking for options that encourage player engagement. Not a Swiss army knife with a tool for every occasion, but a way of linking small simple pieces into a more interesting/strategic whole.

I like the extra modules proposed especially as I think that it would add more depth without changing all of the systems that they already have in place. And you could have cards that tell your ships to either all focus on certain ships or to spread their fire out to damage more of the enemy fleet faster

I'm in favor of these ideas. They compliment the current battle system rather than trying to scrap it and create a new one. Great ideas here!

i'd give it all up for a camera control

Have any of you played "Gratuitous Space Battles"?

It has a similar combat system (sit back and watch it happen...)



Before you enter combat, you are given the ability to give your specific units their own 'personality'.



ie, you can tell them to target weaker enemy ships (not just corvette vs dreadnaught, but a corvette with 10% hp over one on 60%), retreat behind your own lines when HP is low, escort other ships, engage from long range (and not allow the enemy to come close).



while, something that granular can take time to do (I assume the arrival timer is to help multiplayer games flow) some degree of this would be nice.

GSB is great. love the running space chatter log, ship names and burning hulks floating around.



though it's more of a 1X I'd say?

GSB doesn't have "strategy" elements beyond designing your own ship, the ships there have slightly more diversity, but it is still a rather shallow system. the targeting commands are very well done though.

I didn't finished a entire game yet, but there are my ideas with the initial impression I have (would be interesting if I change my mind after some time )



First impressions (oriented to the complains :P)



Cinematics are cool, I'm sure camera control would be very nice, but current cinematics are ok. Maybe some tweaks here and there and adding some random to don't make it very similar each time.

Cards seem repetitive, I unlocked few new cards, and I'm not sure of the real effect they provide. Maybe rework the whole card system is asking too much, the core mechanic seems fine, and maybe some tweaks can make it better.

I'd prefer to see changes in mechanics that in cosmetics, so more playable things before more cinematics.

It doesn't seems that building and modifying new ships affects too much to the combat. Just create the more overpower ship you can and sent it to act as the Battlestar Galactica, no role for smaller ships

Adding heroes to fleets is very interesting, I already expressed in other suggestions about heroes that I'd like to see non-hero officers, pilots and other minor commanders in order to add personality, variety and the overall impression of being an entire alien race.



Suggestions.



As the initial post here, add complexity and layers to the cards system: chained cards, cards unlocked by using other cards first, etc...



Some kind of targeting or formation control. Maybe Gratuitous Space Battles is too too much, but formations could be nice, and make the whole building ship system more interesting. For example (just quick brainstorming here):



In the fleet control screen, add a formations option. This option could allow up to x formations (I think 3 should be the limit).



Here you could build a new formation, positioning the ships to modify offensive/defensive parameters; for example the rear line doesn't act in the first phase, closer ships can concentrate firepower (as a card?) but being more easy to be targeted, etc...



You should assign one formation to the fleet, so you begin combat already in formation. In the initial phase of the combat animations, you can see the rival's formation (maybe as a diagram/radar)



If the fleet has more than one formation, maybe add a "change formation" card.



And be able to put a name on the formation



Oh, and a "launch fighters" card, I'd dislike to live in any space world where Starbuck cannot live :P

SomeGuy wrote:
I'm in favor of these ideas. They compliment the current battle system rather than trying to scrap it and create a new one. Great ideas here!

I totally agree with that, and totally like the ideas mentioned in this thread. Amplitude wanted feedback, I think they've got far more than expected and of huge quality (it's gonna be funny for them to sort all the topics and suggestions).