I have just played a game as Sophons which went for about 280 turns and I lost. I was going for a Science victory but the Sheredyn beat me via an Economic victory. Where's the question? Here is it:



I was the biggest faction at the start of the game with 8 systems. I managed my approval rating by manipulating my tax rate and not colonising planets unless I had the tech to balance out any approval penalty. Most of my planets had the technology exploit. For the first 100 turns the game told me I was #3 in the science race (How is that even possible given I had the most planets and wasn't wasting resources/turns on waging war?). A while later I somehow managed to be #1 for science... but around turn 200 I slipped back to #2 again.



Somewhere along the line between turns 100 - 200 the Sheredyn overtook me in the Science rate even though they had fewer planets than me and I was diverting my industry to science (unless I was building appropriate science improvements for a given system). When the Sheredyn beat with their Economic victory, the science tab indicated they researched over double the science I had!



How's that possible? Virtually every planet had a tech exploit... my tax rate was 15% - 20% (I couldn't lower it any further to get more science bonus because my cash flow wasn't good enough). I made sure that each system had a positive food surplus (even then still, there were a lot of empty spaces in some systems. My approval rating was good too)



The only thing I can think of is that the Sheredyn maxed out all the terraforming technologies and customised their planets to beat me in the science output? Or otherwise cheated?



What's the best planet for science? It's hard to tell because the planet exploit favours Arctic/Tundra... but there are other techs that reward Barren. Also Ocean seems to have a high research score. Do you factor in Xenotourism tech when terraforming your research planets?



What am I doing wrong? I was the biggest faction and the Sheredyn were far too busy waging war to have the 100% focus that I had on science (I didn't even have a fleet because I was trying to save every dollar to minimise my tax rate). It just doesn't make sense!!



Help please! How do you optimise your planets for science output? (Assuming that's the factor at play here, of course and it's not something else)



PS. Here's my colonisation routine when I take over a new system:

1) Colonise planet with the lowest approval penality. Exploit = Food

2) Colonise other planets if my system approval rating can handle it (e.g. I won't colonise a Arctic with a ICE 10 anomaly unless my system already has approving boosting tech which can handle the reduction in approval)

3) Any time approval looks borderline, halt any new colonisation and increase approval with tech.

4) Set planet exploits = tech for all planets except the first one. If there is an Arid or Desert planet, I'll set the exploit = money

5) When I have build enough food generating system improvements, change the exploit of first planet from Food to Technology. Then all planets in system have a Tech exploit

6) Build system improvements that either: increase approval (if needed), increase manufacturing capacity (because I'm hoping when I divert industry to science I'll get a bonus?), increase trade/income, increase pop cap.



I don't do much terraforming because I find it way too confusing to work out the best option for Science because so many of the system improvements contradict one another. e.g. one rewards Barren, another rewards Tundra/Arctic. Plus I take a hit to my income if I change any Tundra planets to Arctic due to Xenotourism. etc



See my dilemma?

It looks to me that you wen too far into tech exploits and neglected food and industry. It doesn't matter if you have the most planets, if your population is lower, your FIDS will usually be lower too.



Class 1 planets are usually the best in their respective fields, because even if they don't have the best IDS per pop, they can have the most pop, and have the food to grow that pop.

http://endlessspace.wikia.com/wiki/Planet#Planet_types

But better don't trust me on my word, and do the math yourself. For instance the improvement from Tundra to Ocean might not be worth the cost of terraforming.



Otherwise there are other reasons you might have been beaten in the tech score :

- AI gets a bonus at higher difficulty levels

- Tech trade. You would be hard pressed to beat an alliance of 7 empires that would pool their research and trade techs between themselves (not to mention research from trade).

- Depends how the Knowledge statistic is calculated. You might have more total research in tech points, but a lower Knowledge under certain conditions.

You are focusing way to much on tech. Its all about the food and population. They are key. Set all your exploits to food. Build food buildings if you need them. I wont change from food until my planets are full. I rarely terraform, its very expensive. You can win fine without actually terraforming anything.



Dont worry about what other factions are researching, just focus on the things you need. You will need to go for expensive long research items to get the best population growth and science. This means that other empires can have researched many more techs than you. You can win a science victory while being nearly last in the science scores.



Never build any dust exploits or improvements. A total waste cause you are going for low taxes. Make a big industry system. Once its population is maxed out set all the planets to industry. Use this system for ind-dust to keep the other systems running. You will need a couple of them as the game progresses. You can usually use the admin hero with the industry bonuses in a good system to keep things going early on.



Dont over colonise systems. I usually just take around 10 systems. This helps keep neighbours happy. Keep your borders and influence areas small. Trade techs to keep them happy. Accept the crappy deals they give where you give nothing in return. Do whatever you have to. War is a serious waste of resources so try avoid it at all costs. I can make it through a whole game without any military ships. Use empty placeholder ships with sensors to keep pirates away early.



Make a custom race with extra happiness, food:



Scientists +++

Deep Roots --

Sloppy Sawbones --

Dust Impaired --

The price of Beauty ---

Dust Archaeology +

Legendary Heroes ++

Optimistic ++

Cloning ++

Metallic Waters +

chromodynamics wrote:


Make a custom race with extra happiness, food:



Scientists +++

Deep Roots --

Sloppy Sawbones --

Dust Impaired --

The price of Beauty ---

Dust Archaeology +

Legendary Heroes ++

Optimistic ++

Cloning ++

Metallic Waters +

Nice, I'll give them a try!

Previous discussion here, with old save games that are useful:

/#/endless-space/forum/27-general/thread/9465-n-turn-challenge-fastest-science-win

You can easily win a science victory by turn 150, regardless of what race you play. Amoeba on an 8-player map have it easier than Sophon, actually, because you can get huge science through trade. In that thread one of the fastest times was from hissho via +80% FIDS on bushido, but that was nerfed in the automatons update. (That thread is one huge reason *why* hissho were nerfed in the update.)

davea wrote:
Previous discussion here, with old save games that are useful:

/#/endless-space/forum/27-general/thread/9465-n-turn-challenge-fastest-science-win

You can easily win a science victory by turn 150, regardless of what race you play. Amoeba on an 8-player map have it easier than Sophon, actually, because you can get huge science through trade. In that thread one of the fastest times was from hissho via +80% FIDS on bushido, but that was nerfed in the automatons update. (That thread is one huge reason *why* hissho were nerfed in the update.)

Thanks everyone for your help. I downloaded the saved game on the link you specified (it's a .bin file), however I can't find my saved game folder. I've looked everywhere in my Steam folder but there is nothing. I even did a search for other .bin files and did not come up with anything relevant. When I google this problem it says go to "Steam Apps" but when I go there, I can't find anything that resembles a saved game.



Can someone please tell me how I can load the saved game file into ES so I can play it?

hugowasp wrote:
Thanks everyone for your help. I downloaded the saved game on the link you specified (it's a .bin file), however I can't find my saved game folder. I've looked everywhere in my Steam folder but there is nothing. I even did a search for other .bin files and did not come up with anything relevant. When I google this problem it says go to "Steam Apps" but when I go there, I can't find anything that resembles a saved game.



Can someone please tell me how I can load the saved game file into ES so I can play it?

The saves are actually in your documents folders, under endless space, saves