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Tenet reorganization / tweaks and a few new ideas all in one post.

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4 years ago
Oct 19, 2021, 3:02:42 PM

Maybe this would be better posted in the Mod Section as I've been thinking about this in my mind for awhile.

Tier 1

  1. Sustain the Faith

  2. Observe Fasts - change to - adding 5 food in the City Center.

  3. Abstain intoxicants 

  4. Seek Wisdom (Possible change - bring down to 3 science? or make it scale based on game speed.)

  5. Shelter Oracles - change to - Holy sites gain 1 influence for every holy site held. 

  • Consider changing to ‘Raise Monuments’ for flavor.

  1. Reject Luxury (Possible change - bring down to 3 money? or make it scale based on game speed.)

  2. Smite unbelievers

  3. Seek the Horizon NEW TENET: (+1 Unit Vision & Bonus science making discoveries.)


Tier 2

  1. Protect the weak

  2. Yield to None 

  3. Sea’s Bounty

  4. Give Alms

  5. Hunt Infidels

  6. Bear not False Witness (Possible change - bring down to 3 science? or make it scale based on game speed.)

  7. Feats of the Faithful NEW TENET +35 experience on units and a small healing bonus while in a territory converted by your state religion. (Also adds a chance to add the statuses: Celebrating or Patriotic in cities if you disband a Unit with >0 exp. ~ 11% chance for every experience level.)


Tier 3 

  1. Virtuous as Water

  2. Show not Mercy

  3. Purge Idleness 

  4. Eschew Gluttony

  5. Develop the Intellect

  6. Mandate Patronage


Tier 4

  1. Proselytize Daily (Possible change - increase to 3 influence? or make it scale based on game speed.)

  2. Donate Generously

  3. Undertake Pilgrimage 

  4. Meditate Often (+2 str but no holy site - military buildings add +1 faith)

  5. Theocracy NEW TENET (refund gov civics & lock out irreligious) 0 religious conversion.


Removed - Raise monuments.

Updated 4 years ago.
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4 years ago
Oct 19, 2021, 5:17:48 PM
Ningauble wrote:
Seek the Horizon NEW TENET: (+1 Unit Vision & Bonus science making discoveries.)

Is the unit vision a permanent bonus, or is it a temporary one that trigger when making a discovery ?


Ningauble wrote:
Observe Fasts - change to - adding 5 food in the City Center.

If I remember correctly, that also include the territories, is it not ? But yes, it seem to be a good idea to move away from the ports for this early food boost, as the other bonuses are more or less instant. (It also make more narrative sense... BUT, when could be more daring and have pops cost less for maintenance, as one very late technology do, which would make even more sense. By how much ? -5% ? I dunno.)


Ningauble wrote:
Feats of the Faithful NEW TENET +35 experience on units and a small healing bonus while in a territory converted by your state religion. (Also adds a chance to add the statuses: Celebrating or Patriotic in cities if you disband a Unit with >0 exp. ~ 11% chance for every experience level.)

This is a great idea ! Altough, I have some doubts about the disbanding aspects. I know nothing about coding, but it might be complicated to do ? Just a thought though.


Ningauble wrote:
Theocracy NEW TENET (refund gov civics & lock out irreligious) 0 religious conversion.

I think you meant, "0 foreign religion conversion" ? I am a bit dubitative about making the theocracy part of the religion screen per say, as I would find it more logical to have on the civics screen. That would mean that once a religion is adopted officialy by more than one player, it's really hard locked : no going back, their will never be religious mixity and new changes.


I would suggest something a bit more "organic" : for each religion follower in a civilisation that follow this religion, you have a bonus in stability or money, or influence, but some kind of bonus. But, if said religion follower is in a civilisation that do not follow it's religion, their is a stability penalty. If a civilisation have such a tenet, it would also mean that the more "infidels" or "pagans" you have, the more unstability you might have.


Ningauble wrote:
Removed - Raise monuments.

I suppose the removal of the "raise monuments" is understandable. When it was available, it was always my choice, just because "science". I do wonder if it's not some kind of capitulation however, to not be able to find ideas as attractive as just "more science". That being said, I don't have better ones.

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4 years ago
Oct 20, 2021, 2:05:50 AM

Observe Fasts - I guess it'd be simpler if it was just '+5' food for each city. Admin centers are different than city centers. Although I think that's what I had in my notes. As a once time bonus 5 is small though. Maybe something like +3 food on Admin centers might help to curb the hump of increased food consumption in a city when adding outposts.


Seek the Horizon - Vision would be permanent. Like the civics. 

Theocracy - yes sorry you are correct, 0 foreign religious conversion. This was meant to be, effectively, a religion impacting the society/civic. I also don't know how the coding would work. Stability bonuses isn't a terrible idea, but I've already rearranged the tenets - in fact this started as notes specifically on reorganizing the stability tenets. 

Raise Monuments is just lopsided. I had a note here about it being better changed to - building holy buildings grants you an (based on game speed) influence bonus. Unfortunately according to most of the player's consensus influence in the late game isn't very satisfying. I liked it as an idea though - because if you can time it right Industrial cultures like Russian and Spain gain a tenet that could, on paper, support expansionist game play. Although the general consensus, again, is that money is the best way to handle late game expansion. But I liked the idea. To be clear - not adding influence to religious buildings but granting a small bonus. Although that doesn't sound too bad, even just +1 inf on religious buildings could make the mid game play out way differently and not always make the money civic 'mandatory' as it's touted to be.


Updated 4 years ago.
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4 years ago
Oct 20, 2021, 2:11:14 AM
Ningauble wrote:
Observe Fasts - change to - adding 5 food in the City Center.

For something a bit more powerful later in the game, how about +5 food in the City Center and -10-20% Population Food Consumption? 


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4 years ago
Oct 24, 2021, 2:10:01 PM

Maybe for scaling -2% food consumption per Holy Site in the city? Not like Machu Pichu needs to be any better though >.>

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4 years ago
Oct 24, 2021, 5:24:51 PM

Any overhaul of religion and beliefs should add both a leader belief and a founder belief. And then probably change one of the tiers (probably tier 3 or 4) into population based bonuses so you are incentivesed to spread your religion 

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4 years ago
Oct 24, 2021, 5:54:07 PM

Territory/Coreligious empire based bonuses are more balanced than population based ones (and encourage spread). Also leader v. Follower is probably best done as a Holy Site bonus v, a Capital bonus.

Updated 4 years ago.
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3 years ago
Oct 28, 2021, 6:55:04 PM

I don't want to over step any possible plans Amplitude has on this but I think with the way the game works a leader might be less optimal than, perhaps, having a "Holy City" declared after you choose the final tenet. That might lend itself to more events based on being the steward of the Holy City. Maybe you get events that represent internal pressure for various religious civics or actions? Anti-alliance fervor of the irreligious or non-faithful if you chose those civics perhaps. As a reflection of your ideology perhaps.

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