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Does the Bantu LT need a boost?

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2 years ago
Jan 27, 2023, 4:08:17 PM

Just like the Caralan Ceremonial Plaza's uniqueness was hurt by the Harbour becoming a new anchor point, the Bantu's Legacy trait, "+2 Influence per Number of Adjacent Empires on Territory", has become comparatively less strong with significant buff that the Olmecs received (and other new sources of early influence too, like the Embassy).


The Bantu LT was never really great to begin with — +2 Influence was higher than the Olmecs' +1 on paper, but the number of territories actually affected by the LT was super small.  With the Olmec boost from +1 to +3, the Bantu LT is inferior in every way.


I'm not sure what I'd propose as an improvement, but now that the Olmecs have had a sizeable buff on territory influence, maybe it's time to revisit the Bantu LT?

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2 years ago
Jan 27, 2023, 5:45:27 PM

What about "+1 Influence per Number of Friendly Empires on Territory" ?

this should be something like: you have 8 empires on the map, you know 5 of them and you are at peace with 3 of them: every territory shall have +3 Influence (but this should work just when you are not at war/ have grievances with them)

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2 years ago
Feb 6, 2023, 11:43:44 PM

Honestly, I have not played the Bantu enough to know the answer to something: Do Independent People(s) count as Empires as far as the legacy trait is concerned?


*If* they did, I could easily see this as having a similar, but slightly less, power level to the Olmec's LT in the late Ancient, Classical, and early Medieval eras.

It would gain in power as you come into contact with the other major powers and the IP that tend fill in any gaps between. Territories on your periphery would have a mix of +2 and +4 bonuses, with the rare +6 or even rarer +8. Meanwhile your inner/central territories would have nil unless you managed to Vatican-ize (surround) an opponent's or IP's territory. I'm guesstimating the average would be slightly worse than the Olmec's. There would probably also be some variance depending on the map type (better on Pangea, worse on Archipelago/Waterworld maps).

As you (or others) assimilate and conquer your neighbors, the Bantu's LT bonus generally declines. I suppose the Bantu ability is more resilient if you're losing territories in a war, but that's pretty poor consolation. In later eras, both LTs become less significant as you start earning influence from other sources.


So yes, I think the Bantu's LT is generally less powerful than the Olmec's - but maybe not considerably so(?). I'd have to play them more to say with much conviction.


But maybe it *should* be less powerful?

Earning Expansion Stars (which earn more fame for the Bantu) is relatively easy in the Ancient Era. Even more so for the Bantu who can use their Under One Banner ability as well as their Pioneers.

Aesthete Stars are generally harder. The lump sums from the recently (and appropriately, IMO) retweaked Cultural Blitz ability don't contribute towards Era Stars as far as I'm aware.


I guess after typing all that out, my real questions (as far as whether the Bantu LT needs to be tweaked) are: 1) Are the Bantu competitive enough to be a viable choice? 2) If not, is adjusting the LT's culture output the best way to go about changing that?



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2 years ago
Feb 8, 2023, 7:15:54 PM

Devs should look into the "hk overhaul" mod and get ideas from there. I only play with that mod now. This bantu issue is addressed there and many more balancing issues.

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