Actual Vassalisation

To buff it up a bit 

1. For expansionist their attached territories could for you too , as Britain gained power from their colony it could clearly buff up their LT 
2. For better economic retribution the 25% tax could be buffed with adding to the tax gold based on the number of district your vassal has
3. It would be interesting when vassalising to get an osmosis happens on all cities
4. Have the grief like the allies asking them to go to war with you ( tho they are forced now ) 
5. Get deeds from getting multiple vassals to freeing yourself out 

I like the idea of vassilization, but I think that Humankind allows for too few opponents in its games to make it work. I think a game would need 20+ opponents for vassals to be interesting, otherwise vassalizing  an opponent would be too impactful. For reference EU4 which is a modern game with vassalization mechanics has 500 nations in it's games.

Fullscreen_Lurker wrote:

I like the idea of vassilization, but I think that Humankind allows for too few opponents in its games to make it work. I think a game would need 20+ opponents for vassals to be interesting, otherwise vassalizing  an opponent would be too impactful. For reference EU4 which is a modern game with vassalization mechanics has 500 nations in it's games.

Yes but quite ressource needed , a dream game would be Civ X HK X Vic3

Fullscreen_Lurker wrote:
I like the idea of vassilization, but I think that Humankind allows for too few opponents in its games to make it work. I think a game would need 20+ opponents for vassals to be interesting, otherwise vassalizing  an opponent would be too impactful.

I really like the idea of improving vassalization, but I do hear your concern about it being too powerful.  Maybe it's a matter of striking the right balance.  Vassalization currently isn't strong enough to make a difference in any of my games.

To buff the amount of vassals, I think we could have vassalization as alternative to assimilation for Independent People. Maybe it could open doors for addition/return of some IP-dependent Legacy Traits and Emblematic Quarters, maybe even some EUs like Zouaves, Routiers and Condottieri.

An idea too about vassalisation as it is easier to vassalise less advanced culture you could be able to build extractors in their territories thus would be more interesting than just conquer their lands 

Arphenix wrote:

An idea too about vassalisation as it is easier to vassalise less advanced culture you could be able to build extractors in their territories thus would be more interesting than just conquer their lands 

This, it would be nice to upgrade their extractors. As some vassals are too far behind to build coal oll, uranium and aluminum.

I like an idea for Vassals to potentially become money sink. Buying out extractors in their territory and I'd add to it ability to arm them, i.e. paying quite a hefty sum for them to spawn an army/navy of your tech level (probably only if they have enough population available, which will be used up for this).

I'd actually love to do that for your allies as well, possibly causing grievances if they're at war with someone.

Elphealer wrote:

Since we can't like a post, let me repeat some I liked. The idea about being able to build extractor in vassal territory, and the other one about vassal Independant People ^^
It could be a step between independant and fully absorb territory.

You can upvote tho

Arphenix wrote:

Elphealer wrote:

Since we can't like a post, let me repeat some I liked. The idea about being able to build extractor in vassal territory, and the other one about vassal Independant People ^^
It could be a step between independant and fully absorb territory.

You can upvote tho

I can also tell you that we (the devs) have definitly seen your post, and have taken some notes ;)

There are definitly some good ideas here! 

Cheers

Ben

Btw here is one of my old suggestions 

Liege - Vassals treaties :

Each levels of treaties would raise / decrease War support of their people wanting to get their freedom , war support in/de-crease would depends their ideology . Exemple : Liberty axis more war support when treaties get relatives to Influence , Tradition axis same but for religion . You could also for big quantity of gold counter treaties .

Based of war score in surrender terms you could decide witch tier of treaties you will access when your will be his liege .

As Vassals in diplomatic relations if a lower tier treaty is refused he could go to war forcing the treaty they have asked to be signed or if war support difference is enough get freedom but further more treaties are from higher the more war support it will cost for freedom .

But if they lose , the liege would have two choices : upgrading vassalises treaties tier or give a badge ( idk for the name ) to the vassal that will decrease his war support or would restrain him to a max level ( like alliances ) .

Economic :
" Cheap trade " : same as alliance -X war support.

" Shared profits " : gains money based on trade license and commercial roads. +/- 0 war support

" Free access " : get all resources for free , vassals can still trade. +X war support

" Total control " : all ressources are liege's property . ++X war support

Military :
" Shared vision " : Military intelligence is freely shared between the Empires -X war support

" Shared logistics " : same as alliance 0 war support .

" Upkeep share " : vassals pays function of their revenues a part of liege's army upkeep .+ X war support

" Army integration " : with cost of influence / money liege can control like mercenary vassals army for Xturns. ++ X war support

Beliefs :
" Free beliefs " : Vassals can still exerce their influence and religion . -X war support

" Confined beliefs " : Vassals keep their beliefs but can't expand it and if one of liege's territory is converted it would immediately bring it back in his original state ) 0 war support

" Controlled beliefs " The liege empire defines the state religion of their vassals . +X war support

" Cultural control " The vassals influence contributes to extending their Liege' sphere of influence rather than their own. ++X war support

Diplomacy :
" Diplomatic freedom " : The vassals still control their diplomacy , if the two empires were received war declaration they are in war with the attacker . -X war support

" Restrained diplomacy " : The grievances and demands are still handled by vassal , the treaties signed need to be both agreed . 0 war support

" Diplomatic control " : Treaties negotiated with a Liege will be applied to its Vassals as well, and declaring war on a Liege will also drag its Vassals into the same war. On the other hand, grievances and demands caused or received the Vassal must be handled by the Liege. +X war support .

" Assimilated " : Vassals cannot ask for freedom if in a war with his liege , can't receive support of any other empire ( developed later ) . If liege lost his war , Winner empire cannot ask the transfer of the liege or can't grant freedom to vassal unless they declared war with a grievance they have obtained when this treaty is signed , but it will disappear in 10 turns and will be not triggered unless the treaty broke and re-signed .

Liege-Vassal events .

If the stability of your vassal is two low and in function of their war support independents rebels might cause trouble in your empire .

Or if you're Liege gain fame you could get 5% of his fame ( Interesting to develop it for alliance too )

For technologies a liege could " borrow " some of tech advances boosting the liege for this research , slowing down vassal but he would gain war support .

Vassals-Foreign empires relations .

Official diplomacy would be mostly handle by the liege but other nations could in secret help vassals , as it could be war support creating a scandal if both liege and vassals are in you're sphere of influence , simply gold help or even troops . An empire could also declare war and then grant freedom to vassals and if you don't had sign a new alliance get a grievance if the old liege vassalise again the one you've released . But it would create grievances between you and the liege empire .