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Internal CD on post-war grievances

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2 years ago
Feb 27, 2023, 3:14:03 AM

It seems as though the AI does not have any restriction on their "internal" cooldown for grievance checks on wars they've lost.


This makes for situations where territory taken in wars gets immediately re-grievanced by losing AIs (no doubt in a gambit to gain more war support immediately); this creates an unwinnable situation for players who just had their own war support turned to 0. If they decline the demands (which seemingly never go away, even on territory actively converting to the player's culture) - they end up at war with maybe 1 or 2 support total, which the AI just bumped their own by 10-20.  Without an army, which will often not exist at all since the AI just lost a war the turn or two prior, the player mathematically loses after only a few turns - as they can't pick a battle with an AI who has no troops to fight.


This is extremely unintuitive and calls up a blatant mechanic that can't be interacted with sensibly by the player. They've just won a war, often annihilating an AI and permitting them to continue existence, only to be at war within two turns to that same AI - who has nothing to fight them with - and the player will lose that war. Infuriating and absurd.


This can be combatted with a hard cooldown on the AI side, not being able to make demands on a power they just lost to (otherwise known as a truce in every other strategy game) - or just not setting war support to 0 for both sides after a war, and instead turning it down gradually to a middle value (more in line with reality in all but crushing defeats).







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2 years ago
Feb 27, 2023, 9:04:42 AM

mm I think is legit to do those grievances, if you loose your territories. Other thing is that if they just, idk, declare a war against you without having anything.

In any case, when you see a behaviour on the AI that shouldn't happening we would ask you for the save files, so the team can take a look at it.

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2 years ago
Feb 27, 2023, 11:19:03 AM

Hello,


That's a frustrating situation indeed... But I don't think that's an AI issue as it can happen in a multiplayer game as well. I've sent your post to the design team, they will look closely at this problem eventually.


Thank you for your feedbacks,

Alex.

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2 years ago
Feb 27, 2023, 7:46:12 PM

I like the idea of empires being able to immediately make grievances and demands for lost territory, but I think we need a cooldown between wars, especially forced wars through the new Embassy commands.  As it stands, an empire can lose a war, lose a ton of territories, immediately demand all of its lost territories back, have a >0 war support because of influence over lost territories, and then Force an Ultimatum to give them back, resulting in either getting them back, or forcing the victor into a war they automatically lose.


Revanchism (a war to regain lost territory) makes sense as a political force in Humankind.  We just need a bit of cooldown between those wars — or resetting both parties' War Support to a non-zero value like 30 after the war — so that a victor can't auto-lose the next war by a quick of the game mechanics.

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2 years ago
Mar 13, 2023, 9:12:10 AM

I might be getting this wrong but is there not an option to just ignore the demand for 10 turns and rebuild some war support during that time? Though maybe I'm confusing it with grievances and you are forced to make a choice on the turn the demand is pressed.

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