melkathi wrote:
Game has very little to do with AC, and based on some of the interviews I read, I don't see the people who worked on Beyond Earth to have truly understood what had made AC great in the first place. So I'm happy they distance themselves from it - at least they are being honest. Unlike that XCOM game which, while fun enough (and pretty), completly missed a lot of what made that genre what it is.

What made AC (Alpha Centauri for the un-initiated) great for you?

Kingsguard wrote:
You being are unfair DotBeta , look at the terrain and the units, they are so cool ! And the gameplay is very different : they are quest for each factions, tech tree is non-linear, units can be customized, factions too, this is not a simple Reskin ! I played hundreds of hours to Civ 5 and I could tell you if it was a reskin oO



I think you expected a galactic 4X but it is not and its refreshing. I enjoy it better not to be the kind of Space 4X ! (If you want a game of that kind, there is Galactic Civ 3 <3 !)

You're right I was being a bit shallow with that post, I'm positive digging deeper into the game would show lots of differences from Civ5. Also $30 would have been too cheap, I guess I was hoping for $40 bucks instead of $50. On the outside though it just really looks like a mod for Civ5, and it's gonna be hard for me to look past it. I watched an hour long Twitch stream the first time they ever streamed BE a week or 2 ago and the gameplay looked exactly like Civ 5.

acare84 wrote:
GMG250-FFSELE-CTED00 code for GreenManGaming is still working. Already pre-purchased the game, can't wait for it.

Thanks a bunch for that GMG code! Within my price point now, I might just have to jump on it and save some cash.

DotBeta wrote:
You're right I was being a bit shallow with that post, I'm positive digging deeper into the game would show lots of differences from Civ5. Also $30 would have been too cheap, I guess I was hoping for $40 bucks instead of $50. On the outside though it just really looks like a mod for Civ5, and it's gonna be hard for me to look past it. I watched an hour long Twitch stream the first time they ever streamed BE a week or 2 ago and the gameplay looked exactly like Civ 5.







Thanks a bunch for that GMG code! Within my price point now, I might just have to jump on it and save some cash.

To be completely honest here, all CIV-like games play alike.



The GMG deal is good if you're going to pre-order. Me? not so much. I agree with some of your sentiment, and this should have been a 3rd expansion for Civ5, instead of the "spiritual successor" for Alpha Centauri. It's one of the few games I'll be keeping my eye on in the near future.

Last I checked the GMG codes were account specific - You gotta sign up for their newsletter to get a code for yourself. But GMG practically throws them at you for all of the new and popular games every week.



I won't be pre-ordering it at all - I'll wait for reviews and opinions from people I know and respect. And GMG is bound to give me at least a handful of the discount codes in the meantime so I can just pick and choose the time.



They messed up Civ V - I'll never forgive them for ruining the Civ franchise by removing almost all of the modding API and unit stacking. The game runs like arse to boot even today on a high end machine.



Edit: Also - Reskinned Civ V expansion pack syndrome. Bad firaxis, bad!

Frankly, the Steam store page doesn't tell me anything that the media outlets didn't already hype, except that their trying to entice us into pre-ordering with a simple map-pack, and that the price point is higher than I'm willing to pay. Even if it looks like something a dedicated team of modders could have done in Civ 5 (there are some amazing mods that introduce completely new features, after all), being priced at $50 (or 50€ for us Europeans, as usual), the game is bound to see a lot of DLC and possibly an expansion, so I'll rather wait for the inevitable Game of the Year Edition that includes everything. Especially after my experience with Civ 5 and its expansions.

Speaking of modding: I fully expect this game to go all "Use a mod in Multiplayer? I'm afraid I can't do that, Dave." on us, just like Civ 5 did. And I honestly believe that the "no mods in multiplayer" situation severely hurt the enthusiasm of both players and modders.



I'm already rather tired of Beyond Earth, mostly due to the media hype.

I've seen so much rambling about how the orbital layer is such a great, new, innovative feature, yet I can never stop thinking how many times it's done before. Call to Power had an orbital layer, no matter how lukewarm its reception with the Civilization fans. Entire parallel maps are a common feature in fantasy settings and games, and Master of Magic back in 1194 already had it.

They keep going on about the quests, too, and while I can't think of any examples right now, I doubt this is as "new an innovative" as they claim.

However, I do like what little we have seen of the tech web, with multiple technologies to each node and its interaction with affinity. But that's not enough to get me so excited that I will preorder.



The release of Civilization: Beyond Earth for pre-order on Steam tells me something else, though:

Releasing Endless Legend any time soon will see it competing for media attention with this behemoth of a company.

Nasarog wrote:
What made AC (Alpha Centauri for the un-initiated) great for you?

What made alpha Centauri great? I think most players would agree that it was the immersion. Even though you were dealing with an alien world and fictional technologies, the interludes, the descriptions and leader quotes, and the personalities of the AI players would pull you right in, which is a hard to achieve for any 4x game. It's been years since I last played Alpha Centauri, and I still clearly remember some of those quotes. Gameplay wasn't perfect, but it was a nice mix of different ideas and mechanics that went well with the theme. I'll leave expounding on the pros and cons of AC's gameplay to somebody better at 4x games than I am.

Just saw Beyond the Earth on steam for Preorder !



Lets see what Steam can tell us about it



I dont know you but im a great fan of Sid Meier's and im waiting this impatience ^^

We need to examine this thread again several months after CIV:BE is released. I would love to compare the state of AC and CIV:BE then.

Nasarog wrote:
We need to examine this thread again several months after CIV:BE is released. I would love to compare the state of AC and CIV:BE then.

Indeed that could be very interresting !

Speaking of BE, this hour worth of gameplay from Firaxis popped up in my subscriptions.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMWFITPW3C8

Awesome video !



Im even more enthousiastic about the game now !



By the way, this man with an Horse mask is fantastic (32:42) xD



But what im hoping for are some Aliens neutral civilizations waiting to be discovered on the planets, with their own cities and units !



Thank you for the video Mansen



PS : Here is another useful link for the pessimistic guys here : http://www.pcgamer.com/2014/04/12/civilization-beyond-earth-interview-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-new-factions-aliens-technology-and-more/3/

^^^ @ Mansens post. That was the Twitch stream I mentioned watching in my second post. DevilDogFF got banned from that very twitch stream while we were watching it for asking a simple question about the games features he didn't like, without getting an answer or a warning they kicked and banned him, really lame move considering there were lots more people actually trolling the stream with nothing good to say.



And yes Kingsguard that horse was funny, also the mug on the table looks enormous for some reason lol.



Aliens = Barbarians

Alien nest = Barbarian Camp

Sea Dragon = Barbarian boats

Algae resource = Fishing Hole..



Do you see where I'm going with this?

Watching the gameplay certainly didn't make my any more excited about the game - Let's leave it at that.

Nasarog wrote:
What made AC (Alpha Centauri for the un-initiated) great for you?

A few things,which all basically come down to a dev team that was not affraid to do things.



So in no particular order:



The unit customization was fantastic, allowing you to truly adapt troops to your personal playstyle. Wanted to use seaformers to create a landbridge for your waiting rovers and infantry to cross into enemy territory? Go ahead. Or use the former to create an island next to an underwater city and use that as a landing site for your orbital drop marines. Drop fungus missiles anywhere, then race across with your ecowarriors, mindcontrolling the inevitable waves of mindworms on the way. Etc etc.

In Beyond Earth units will upgrade with a choice between two skills, based on your affinity. Apparently players designing their own untis is "tedious micromanagement"...



Social Engineering allowed players to experiment with their own visions of future societies, without having to grab some set in stone ideologies the way Civ 5 handled it.

Which leads directly to the writing: I know of no 4X game that managed to be as evolving. Mostly though because the writers were not affraid to be political. They did not just take names of ideologies and slap some numbers on them, trying to balance them. They created quite complex characters and used them to tell both history and evolving story. Being an ecologicaly minded faction did not mean that your units now do poison damage. It meant that you would not confront Planet as an enemy, but accept its mysteries as gifts to be cherished. Nor would you crudely seek to peel the layers away like the skin from an onion. Instead you would gather them together as the tree gathers the breeze. The wind would blow and you would bend. The sky would open and you would drink your fill.



And by having deep characters, it allowed for a diplomatic system that meant something. You no longer just had the red, the blue and the beige neighbouring empires. You had Sister Miriam, CEO Morgan and Colonel Santiago. And you would have a planetary council in which alliances would shift during crucial votes based on everyone's individual vision of the planet's future.



And yeah... terraforming. Mentioned it above already, but needs to be said by itself: terraforming





edit: and more I probably forgot to write. But I should consider lunch now.

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales wrote:
It's been years since I last played Alpha Centauri, and I still clearly remember some of those quotes.

And should you forget any, there are collections all over the net

http://www.generationterrorists.com/quotes/smac.html

DotBeta wrote:
^^^ @ Mansens post. That was the Twitch stream I mentioned watching in my second post. DevilDogFF got banned from that very twitch stream while we were watching it for asking a simple question about the games features he didn't like, without getting an answer or a warning they kicked and banned him, really lame move considering there were lots more people actually trolling the stream with nothing good to say.



Aliens = Barbarians

Alien nest = Barbarian Camp

Sea Dragon = Barbarian boats

Algae resource = Fishing Hole..



Do you see where I'm going with this?

Ye I also known abusive moderations it happens... Everywhere...



And no DotBeta, if you even watched the full video, you can see that Aliens are not only Barbarians but that they are the target of Quests, they react depending your hostility, you can be friend with them !



I particularly hate people who defame a game without reasons because they dont like it.

Just think to what are you saying and watch the video or read the articles, you will see you are wrong



@melkathi : As far as I read, the unit workshops from Alpha Centauri really inspired the Dev for BE developing, they even told they had improved it !



And everything you said is into BE in fact !

Kingsguard wrote:
@melkathi : As far as I read, the unit workshops from Alpha Centauri really inspired the Dev for BE developing, they even told they had improved it !

They might have been inspired by AC, but their version of improvement is to devolve modular unit design into linear unit evolution with binary choice of flavour.

I'm really missing my submersible aircraft- and rocket-carriers from AC.

Same goes for the politics system, where your sandbox-society became a trinary choice.

It's a lot more Civ and a lot less AC than what I and, so it seems, some other people here had hoped for.

Nosferatiel wrote:
They might have been inspired by AC, but their version of improvement is to devolve modular unit design into linear unit evolution with binary choice of flavour.

I'm really missing my submersible aircraft- and rocket-carriers from AC.

Same goes for the politics system, where your sandbox-society became a trinary choice.

It's a lot more Civ and a lot less AC than what I and, so it seems, some other people here had hoped for.

Well, what I read seems to talk about Flying-Battleships and some other fun things like what you are saying !



PS : By the way, Civ V Complete edition for 14 euros on steam, dont miss it !

melkathi wrote:
A few things,which all basically come down to a dev team that was not affraid to do things.



So in no particular order:



The unit customization was fantastic, allowing you to truly adapt troops to your personal playstyle. Wanted to use seaformers to create a landbridge for your waiting rovers and infantry to cross into enemy territory? Go ahead. Or use the former to create an island next to an underwater city and use that as a landing site for your orbital drop marines. Drop fungus missiles anywhere, then race across with your ecowarriors, mindcontrolling the inevitable waves of mindworms on the way. Etc etc.

In Beyond Earth units will upgrade with a choice between two skills, based on your affinity. Apparently players designing their own untis is "tedious micromanagement"...



Social Engineering allowed players to experiment with their own visions of future societies, without having to grab some set in stone ideologies the way Civ 5 handled it.

Which leads directly to the writing: I know of no 4X game that managed to be as evolving. Mostly though because the writers were not affraid to be political. They did not just take names of ideologies and slap some numbers on them, trying to balance them. They created quite complex characters and used them to tell both history and evolving story. Being an ecologicaly minded faction did not mean that your units now do poison damage. It meant that you would not confront Planet as an enemy, but accept its mysteries as gifts to be cherished. Nor would you crudely seek to peel the layers away like the skin from an onion. Instead you would gather them together as the tree gathers the breeze. The wind would blow and you would bend. The sky would open and you would drink your fill.



And by having deep characters, it allowed for a diplomatic system that meant something. You no longer just had the red, the blue and the beige neighbouring empires. You had Sister Miriam, CEO Morgan and Colonel Santiago. And you would have a planetary council in which alliances would shift during crucial votes based on everyone's individual vision of the planet's future.



And yeah... terraforming. Mentioned it above already, but needs to be said by itself: terraforming





edit: and more I probably forgot to write. But I should consider lunch now.

I suspect that if they hit the internal number they set for themselves, there will be an expansion and dlc for CIV:BE.

Nosferatiel wrote:
They might have been inspired by AC, but their version of improvement is to devolve modular unit design into linear unit evolution with binary choice of flavour.

I'm really missing my submersible aircraft- and rocket-carriers from AC.

Same goes for the politics system, where your sandbox-society became a trinary choice.

It's a lot more Civ and a lot less AC than what I and, so it seems, some other people here had hoped for.

Did you read the Gamestar article in the august edition?

Fairly good, going into detailed comparisson. Made certain I'll wait a year or so for it to have droppe dhalf price and then to be on summer/winter sale

melkathi wrote:
Did you read the Gamestar article in the august edition?

Fairly good, going into detailed comparisson. Made certain I'll wait a year or so for it to have droppe dhalf price and then to be on summer/winter sale

I read PC gamer interview with Devs and it looks pretty similar to AC, similar enough to make me preorder it !