lo_fabre wrote:

solrac137 wrote:

Having all races in ES2 would be great not neccesarily as major factions but maybe as minor faction,heroes or any other cameos i mean having them as major factions would be great too but it would be extremely difficult to design the history,quests,ships, designs and all of that for dozens of races. 

 Well, factions in ES1 and EL have been already designed on history and quests. factions in ES1 has also ship designs.

What I don't know is how costly will be to adapt it to ES2 coding and graphics.

Dude, you cant just take ES1 and EL factions and slap them into ES2, you would have to rework them entirely to fit into the new game, not to mention rebalance them and rewrite their quests.

I think people aren't considering that factions could be given quite different abilities to those they had in ES1. Just because the ability might not fit well with the mechanics of ES2 it doesn't mean the faction could be included as playable this time round.

I'm of the opinion that the factions of ES1 (and their lore) are a big part of what made the game really stand out, so I hope that the vast majority will become playable eventually (through expansions/DLC/etc). The only one that I think doesn't necessarily need to be more than a minor faction is the Sheredyn. All the others have their own merits that could qualify them for inclusion (and playable status). Seeing as the Deuyivans have been revealed as a minor faction though (which is awesome imo) I am feeling hopeful for the prospects of the major ES1 races.

I am also quite happy with the new factions too - even though there aren't any that stand out to me like the Amoeba or Sowers did in ES1 I think they're great designs and fit well with the universe.

I think the Pilgrims are out with their affinity from ES1, the evacuation of colonies. The Vodyani allready have giant space ships as some kind of colony. I guess they want different play styles and flavor, so Pilgrims with a whole system evacuation feels a little bit to similiar.

Not sure I understand what you mean.  So far the 4 races shown are full of flavor and unique mechanics.  The ES 1 crowd was a beat weak across the board on both, with a few exceptions (1 of which is already in the game and 1 of which was remade to be a lot more interesting).

Personally I'd be fine if the rest of the cast was just new ideas since flavor wise the old races were a little boring.  Still I guess you can remake anything, but it's a chance to sorta show off new toys, and if you have to make all new models anyways I see a lot of room for improvement over the base cast (which wasn't awful by any means).

Seems like a waste?

I would rather it be a waste than completely the same in a cut and paste fashion.

I think the valuters are boring as sin and feel very mary sue.  Their main mechanic is a portal which is kinda interesting but everything after that feels mixed together.  It does however seem that they're the favorites among the dev team, so I wouldn't be surprised if they're in the game.

I never found the Vaulters to be interesting in ES1 when compared to the UE, Pilgrims or the very unique Horatio.

Sherydin are even worse... like really really copy paste bland.

But I do have a serious bias against 'science' civs, and how everyone seems to love them for seemly no other reason then science.

The Deuyivans are also returning from the first game as a Minor Faction.

As for the Human factions, I only ever found the Pilgrims to be interesting. Their design, backstory and traits were really cool.

Seems like a waste?

Currently Returning:

Cravers

Sophons

Hissho (minor faction)

Maybe returning:

Vaulters.

Not returning/don't know:

UE

Amoeba

Horatio

Sowers

Pilgrims

Sherdyn

Automatons

harmony

Of the above I could see sowers and maybe even amoeba being minor races, if needed.  Neither had a super playstyle defining affinity (sowers is one of those things that just makes doing good stuff easier, and amoeba's is always just good), so it might be easier to just make them minor races (and in a way the sophons have something similar to what amoeba had...sorta).

Pilgrims/UE/Sherdyn all fall under the "human" category and I think it's more interesting if we have as few human races as possible (hell i wish we could have few bipedal races as well, but that's another argument), and I suspect we're getting vaulters.   Further of those races only the Pilgrims had an affinity that was really interesing.  Granted I don't recall it ever actually being useful, but I wasn't very good with them, and it wouldn't be hard even if it wasn't to make it more playstyle defining.  They could make playstyle defining abilities for the EU/Sherdyn, but why do so when you've got so many other options.  Further from what I understand of lore if you include one you should really include the other, which is sorta two slots going to more humanoid races that also have to have affinities built for them.

Horatio was an odd concept, but also didn't really have an affinity that defined a playstyle, so much as just being a nice bonus.  They might be neat to bring back just because the concept is creative enough that you could make some really interesting playstyle stuff for them, but at the same time i'm not sure it plays well with the new population mechanics (the horatio faction holds majority again!).

This leaves Automatons and Harmony, who I think could both be potentially interesting.  Automatons affinity did change your playstyle a little, but it was basically a unique bonus that was nice to have as you stacked industry buildings like any other industry focus race.  Still it wouldn't be hard to tweak it to be gameplay defining.  Harmony....well I don't think I ever got them to really work until later, but the concept is obviously flavorful and changes how you play a lot (up there with cravers).

TL;DR-

Think we're getting vaulters anyways.

Sowers/Amoeba back as minors

Maybe Horatio if they can think of something clever

Automatons and Harmony the top of my personal list as returns because I think they're interesting.

UE/Sherdyn are meh, pilgrims maybe since the evacuation concept could be cool if they tweaked it to be more central to their style.

Gwydden wrote:

Sinnaj63 wrote:

On the hand having all the ES1 factions back(I do think the final non early-access release version will have most ones given that there now are both major and minor factions) would be pretty nice, however I'd also fear that having faction DLC stuff would make Mulitplayer more difficult since some people would and others wouldn't have certain factions and their traits.

I'm not sure whether you're familiar with Endless Legend multiplayer, but I expect ES2 will be similar in that the host's expansions will be available to everyone.

I am not but if that is gonna be the case I would also like for the missing ES1 faction to be added as DLC.

Sinnaj63 wrote:

On the hand having all the ES1 factions back(I do think the final non early-access release version will have most ones given that there now are both major and minor factions) would be pretty nice, however I'd also fear that having faction DLC stuff would make Mulitplayer more difficult since some people would and others wouldn't have certain factions and their traits.

I'm not sure whether you're familiar with Endless Legend multiplayer, but I expect ES2 will be similar in that the host's expansions will be available to everyone.

On the hand having all the ES1 factions back(I do think the final non early-access release version will have most ones given that there now are both major and minor factions) would be pretty nice, however I'd also fear that having faction DLC stuff would make Mulitplayer more difficult since some people would and others wouldn't have certain factions and their traits.

Well yes, that's a lot of work.

lo_fabre wrote:

solrac137 wrote:

Having all races in ES2 would be great not neccesarily as major factions but maybe as minor faction,heroes or any other cameos i mean having them as major factions would be great too but it would be extremely difficult to design the history,quests,ships, designs and all of that for dozens of races. 

 Well, factions in ES1 and EL have been already designed on history and quests. factions in ES1 has also ship designs.

What I don't know is how costly will be to adapt it to ES2 coding and graphics.

Talfos wrote:

lo_fabre wrote:

solrac137 wrote:

Having all races in ES2 would be great not neccesarily as major factions but maybe as minor faction,heroes or any other cameos i mean having them as major factions would be great too but it would be extremely difficult to design the history,quests,ships, designs and all of that for dozens of races. 

 Well, factions in ES1 and EL have been already designed on history and quests. factions in ES1 has also ship designs.

What I don't know is how costly will be to adapt it to ES2 coding and graphics.

Dude, you cant just take ES1 and EL factions and slap them into ES2, you would have to rework them entirely to fit into the new game, not to mention rebalance them and rewrite their quests.

Going on from what Talfos said, in what way did ES1 factions have quests? Sure there were some narrative elements but definitely no overarching plot or campaign-like goals that had to be met. Similarly, I'm not sure how quests from EL are applicable to ES2. I mean, there's a world of difference between each faction trying to get off a planet and each faction trying to take over the universe.

Also, it looks like previous faction are being incorporated into ES2. The Hissho and Deuyivans certainly are at least and I'd expect a few more.

solrac137 wrote:

Having all races in ES2 would be great not neccesarily as major factions but maybe as minor faction,heroes or any other cameos i mean having them as major factions would be great too but it would be extremely difficult to design the history,quests,ships, designs and all of that for dozens of races. 

 Well, factions in ES1 and EL have been already designed on history and quests. factions in ES1 has also ship designs.

What I don't know is how costly will be to adapt it to ES2 coding and graphics.

Having all races in ES2 would be great not neccesarily as major factions but maybe as minor faction,heroes or any other cameos i mean having them as major factions would be great too but it would be extremely difficult to design the history,quests,ships, designs and all of that for dozens of races. 

BG123 wrote:

Romeo wrote:

kratt81 wrote:
I would really rather hope this would be free dlc, I mean its the same factions from ES1, new factions should cost money but not old ones like wth

You can have them for free, just do the coding and artwork yourself, and you won't be out a penny.



I'm with the others in this thread. I actually quite like the lore in this series (And its offshoots). I would love to see it ALL brought in, and I'm always happy to give Amplitude more support. Worst-case scenario, hopefully we have a super-SDK this time around, and we can fill any holes in the faction list.

My thoughts exactly, there's no way it wouldn't be dlc. I love the idea of re-introducing factions from previous games but as Romeo said, that'd require a massive amount of effort from Amplitude. To expect it to be free sounds a little entitled, no offence intended.

Aside from the sheer visuals and coding alone, you also have to consider how to make each faction feel unique and play differently, in addition to the fact that you have to come up with a new quest line for each and every faction. 

There's also the possibility that a significant amount of the Major Factions from previous games have been made into Minor Factions, like the Hissho for example.

Only to clarify: I never proposed or expected to be for free. What I said is that I'll pay for it if Amplitude goes this way.

Maybe I'll though different if I was able to mod every faction from ES1 and EL, but I'm not and also have enough time to learn or do it.

So, trying to motivate Amplitude if community likes this idea and there's enough people interested...

Romeo wrote:

kratt81 wrote:
I would really rather hope this would be free dlc, I mean its the same factions from ES1, new factions should cost money but not old ones like wth

You can have them for free, just do the coding and artwork yourself, and you won't be out a penny.



I'm with the others in this thread. I actually quite like the lore in this series (And its offshoots). I would love to see it ALL brought in, and I'm always happy to give Amplitude more support. Worst-case scenario, hopefully we have a super-SDK this time around, and we can fill any holes in the faction list.

My thoughts exactly, there's no way it wouldn't be dlc. I love the idea of re-introducing factions from previous games but as Romeo said, that'd require a massive amount of effort from Amplitude. To expect it to be free sounds a little entitled, no offence intended.

Aside from the sheer visuals and coding alone, you also have to consider how to make each faction feel unique and play differently, in addition to the fact that you have to come up with a new quest line for each and every faction. 

There's also the possibility that a significant amount of the Major Factions from previous games have been made into Minor Factions, like the Hissho for example.

Romeo wrote:

kratt81 wrote:
I would really rather hope this would be free dlc, I mean its the same factions from ES1, new factions should cost money but not old ones like wth

You can have them for free, just do the coding and artwork yourself, and you won't be out a penny.



I'm with the others in this thread. I actually quite like the lore in this series (And its offshoots). I would love to see it ALL brought in, and I'm always happy to give Amplitude more support. Worst-case scenario, hopefully we have a super-SDK this time around, and we can fill any holes in the faction list.

To revive this thread.

And in response to Romeo, I haven't enough knowledge to mod it. My only try in modding was with XCOM2 SDK and an utterly failure.

It's up to Amplitude, but I think I'm not the only one who will buy this DLC.