Heroes

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

25 400g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 6:41:01 PM

You have a limit on the number of heroes. And governors aren't leading a fleet. And they can greatly enhance them. So you have to make choices.

salvo

Newcomer

salvo

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 5, 2012, 6:21:16 AM

I think the number of employable heroes scaling with the size of the galaxy and/or the empire would be better, maybe by making them more unique less powerful and so more frequent. Late game on a huge galaxy, having dozens of systems colonized and dozens of fleets in service, being able to recruit only so few heroes seems too constraining. If this design decision has been motivated by the idea that heroes availability should be limited due to them being 'heores', then why not designated them as 'leaders'. In fact I'd like to be able to appoint such a leader to each system and to any bigger fleet

Calvin

Newcomer

Calvin

Newcomer

200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 11:58:30 PM

To get extra space in your academy you need to research some technology in the trade research department, if memory serves correct one adds 2 the other adds 3 extra spots. I can not remember the names of what needs researching though.

whthawke66

Newcomer

whthawke66

Newcomer

11 700g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 11:45:28 PM

I have a hero-related question - am playing a medium sized 4 player game, am at turn 100, and hero academy is still at only 3 available....I can see no good reason to drop any of the current heros (which have made it to lvl's 10, 9 and 8) but am wondering why new heros keep appearing every 50 turns if I cannot add them without dropping one of the current heros.

As it is now in the game, it makes the most sence to hire your first 3 heros, irrespective of their starting talents, because you can easily level them into competant 'whatever you wanted them to be' within the (relatively) early part of the game. Is there a tech to add more slots to the academy? (I have 20 systems and would LOVE to have more than 2 with governors and only 1 fleet commander....)

Anyway, there it is along with my $.02, hope to get an answer soon!

Sm31415

Newcomer

Sm31415

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 10:08:53 PM

I think they should also not be allowed to move around with such ease

currently i can move them from a system to another one at the other end of my empire instantly whereas a fleet would take like 10 turns/years

if i can zip them around that fast why am i waiting years for colony ships to reach destinations, i just need to size increase this galactic teleportation tech

so essentially youd have to have a fleet pick them up and deliver them to a different planet, or to a combat fleet, instead of them moving at infinity speed

Calvin

Newcomer

Calvin

Newcomer

200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 9:24:03 PM

I'm pretty sure from the lore i've read Horatio are the only ones who can clone also the only ones i have not played as yet and i have not being able to clone as the races i have tried (this thread being the first i heard about it being possible in game), But from the races I have tried all of their research trees have had slight difference's so i guess this is where they are trying to bring the balance from the Horatio being able to clone.

I have not looked in depth enough at the trees to see how benificial the race specific research is to see if it can match the power of cloning high level heroes though.

Ramireus

Newcomer

Ramireus

Newcomer

19 200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 9:20:15 PM

Aimzy wrote:
Perhaps another idea would be to break their exp into two catagories, Governing, and Military. That way when they are in combat they get EXP for fighting and can then buy the talnets for such (offense, defense, tactics) and while they govern systems they get Governing exp to spend on the wit and labor what nots. it maybe more coding involved, but it makes more sense to me at least. For the cloning process, i believe setting it with the 100/lvl is a good idea but also have it to where when cloned they lose a level and the ability they got at that level and perhaps come back with a disadvantage (At random since cloning could cause a psycological problem) plus if they are killed to often and cloned, maybe they will just say "Cya i'm out you suck at keeping me alive!" and just quit altogether so perhaps a loyalty bar for him like they have in Total war series?

I like idea that cloning would mean loosing level for cloned hero combined with new hero would start at lower level (probably something like lvl/2 rounded down?).

On the other hand even more I would like to see mortal heroes, where "cloning" means saving hero in case of death-restoring him at level he was cloned.

Jakey

Newcomer

Jakey

Newcomer

300g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 9:16:18 PM

Aimzy wrote:
Perhaps another idea would be to break their exp into two catagories, Governing, and Military. That way when they are in combat they get EXP for fighting and can then buy the talnets for such (offense, defense, tactics) and while they govern systems they get Governing exp to spend on the wit and labor what nots.

I support this. And I also support hero death in some way or another.

VieuxChat wrote:
After some more turns, it turns out that the limit on the number of heroes is quite harsh. And the techs that adds some more heroes are far away in the tech tree.

There is also the increased upkeep of higher level heroes. But still, It's kind of boring to be stuck with the same heroes that you had from the beginning. Not only should there be a chance for heroes to die in battle, they should definitely die of old age.

Maybe their average lifespan could be determined by their race!

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

Truth is a chameleon. Herbert

MODVieuxChat

Chameleon

25 400g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 8:30:28 PM

After some more turns, it turns out that the limit on the number of heroes is quite harsh. And the techs that adds some more heroes are far away in the tech tree.

Aimzy

Newcomer

Aimzy

Newcomer

19 200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 7:46:42 PM

Perhaps another idea would be to break their exp into two catagories, Governing, and Military. That way when they are in combat they get EXP for fighting and can then buy the talnets for such (offense, defense, tactics) and while they govern systems they get Governing exp to spend on the wit and labor what nots. it maybe more coding involved, but it makes more sense to me at least. For the cloning process, i believe setting it with the 100/lvl is a good idea but also have it to where when cloned they lose a level and the ability they got at that level and perhaps come back with a disadvantage (At random since cloning could cause a psycological problem) plus if they are killed to often and cloned, maybe they will just say "Cya i'm out you suck at keeping me alive!" and just quit altogether so perhaps a loyalty bar for him like they have in Total war series?

CogDissident

Newcomer

CogDissident

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 7:26:08 PM

Yeah, you have a good point about the administrator battle-farming XP... I can't think of any better way to make them not just be a bonus for large empires to help them get larger. I personally like how right now the heroes tend to balance things between empires (making the smaller ones still viable threats)

And at the moment, the only thing I see different is that some of the heroes can access the +25 base production special quality (which is amazing, as it can jumpstart new development systems really quickly), and some can never get that trait.

shugyosha

Newcomer

shugyosha

Newcomer

6 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 6:48:17 PM

Sending a pure administrator into battles for XP farming seems wrong.

Anyways, less Xp gain nad permanent death would make them earn their hero status. Now they are not only insanely powerful but are quite meaningless in a storytelling way. They survive with ease and can be leveled up with ease, there is nothing special about them. Even a pilot commander can be skilled to a good administrator with ease. That shouldn't be the case. It makes sense to be able to pick small bonuses for peacetime administration but their initial class should characterize them well.

tgb

Newcomer

tgb

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 1:05:38 PM

Does anyone else find them to be overpowered? Seems to me they level way too quickly, and it is too easy/inexpensive to clone them. Once you have a couple of good administrators and admirals, you never have to hire and build up anyone new again.

Perhaps if cloning was more expensive and took place over several turns?????

SirFlipsALot

Mithrite

SirFlipsALot

Mithrite

21 500g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 5:57:57 PM

Maybe the clones could start off at level one, but level faster until they reach the level they were cloned on.

Afterwards, they level as normally.

I also agree on the heros being overpowered.

CogDissident

Newcomer

CogDissident

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 5:48:48 PM

I think the current state of the heroes actually "level the playing field" quite a bit between bigger and smaller empires. Sure, you may have 20 systems, but only 3 are hugely powerful because you only have 3 heroes. A smaller empire can take their heroes off of production and put them into combat if they need the extra short-term boost to combat capability.

Giving bigger empires the ability to field lots of heroes would effectively let you steamroll any empire that was even slightly smaller than yourself.

My suggestion is that heroes need more risk-reward. Lower the XP-gain-speed on them to 1 xp per turn when managing systems or fleets, but let them gain a lot of xp when fighting (maybe 2-3xp per command-point value killed). So you're forced to send even your good administrators into dangerous situations in order to make them gain enough xp to be good back home. That way small empires can still compete (and encourages them to be more risky with commanders).

Additionally, cloning should give you the base-level-1 version of a hero, not be a way to get their exact same experience levels, otherwise the above method won't work at all.

tgb

Newcomer

tgb

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 5:05:29 PM

I like your suggestions. 150xlev might be a bit much. Perhaps 100 dustxlevel?

Vukudlak2

Newcomer

Vukudlak2

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 4:54:22 PM

Not sure about the overpower aspect. They could level slower thats for sure. Death should also be permanent or you could choose to clone then before they die. It could be an action that you could do in your turn, it could cost some dust to make sure you feel the cost of cloning a hero... Also when the hero dies if you had clonned him 50 turns before hand you would get him back but the way he was at that moment. Therefore loosing some abilities.

So then you just need to find the right ratio for the cost in dust VS the level they are at. Exemple : base cost 150 dust X level of hero.

Any ideas on that guys?

MoonMonster

Newcomer

MoonMonster

Newcomer

6 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 4:47:43 PM

Yeah, I agree. They're an awesome idea and I love them but right now they're too powerful.

Ramireus

Newcomer

Ramireus

Newcomer

19 200g2g pts

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 2:53:17 PM

well, some reduction in bonuses would be nice.

Or disabling cloning for good and possibility of death on lost battle (maybe already imlemented?)/assasination, when espionage imlemented?

adsteel

Newcomer

adsteel

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 4, 2012, 2:43:46 PM

Or perhaps could be possible to hire "admirals" and "governors" instead of heroes. These should give small bonuses, respectively, to fleets and systems, instead of the huge 50% bonus in industry and 60% in food, for instance, that one of my level 10 hero provides.

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