[Research] Population Growth Rate

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 4:01:19 PM

I haven't numbers, but you can try to increase your food surplus in a star system, and you'll see his happiness growing.

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 16, 2012, 4:22:50 PM

liq3 wrote:
@OP: Your data is consistent with how I thought pop growth worked. It's actually very simple. There's 2 parts to it. 1. The surplus food you can see (and you listed). 2. A hidden value of "accumulated" food. The way it works, is every turn the surplus is added to the total food, and when the total is over "currentSystemPop * 20 + 10" you gain a pop. Really quite simple. So growth is simply "food / (pop * 20 + 10)" rounded off.

Thanks, that's a good clear picture. Will have to do another pass as soon as Alpha 2 hits Steam.

liq3

Newcomer

liq3

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 14, 2012, 1:37:48 AM

@OP: Your data is consistent with how I thought pop growth worked. It's actually very simple. There's 2 parts to it. 1. The surplus food you can see (and you listed). 2. A hidden value of "accumulated" food. The way it works, is every turn the surplus is added to the total food, and when the total is over "currentSystemPop * 20 + 10" you gain a pop. Really quite simple. So growth is simply "food / (pop * 20 + 10)" rounded off.

Happiness also has nothing to do with it.

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 14, 2012, 1:26:08 AM

4x_Fan wrote:
There's currently absolutely no penalty for min/maxing tax [thinkCivilisationrioting/anarchywhilechanginggovernment].

I've noticed that maxing out tax can make the population growth number goes negative; so negative that I will lose population points next turn. That's a pretty big penalty.

4x_Fan

Newcomer

4x_Fan

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 14, 2012, 1:13:26 AM

There's currently absolutely no penalty for min/maxing tax [thinkCivilisationrioting/anarchywhilechanginggovernment].

i.e.

You can put the tax rate to 1000% for a turn, grab the loot while your builds pause for 1 turn, then return your empire to a blissful state of ecstatic non-tax paying gluttons. Or, in modern terms, you print $5 trillion and no-one seems to care. On a moderate sized empire, you can get 3k+ in a single turn like this, further adding to the ability to :cheese: the hell out of the instant hull renovation.

The dev team have been taking a page out of the US tax code, it seems

Oh, and this needs fixing for release btw ~ it's hella broken atm.

HolyTerror

Newcomer

HolyTerror

Newcomer

10 100g2g pts

13 years ago

May 14, 2012, 1:07:26 AM

food does increase happiness

StK wrote:
I formulated my question wrong.. I know that happyness influences production.. but i didn't know that food influences happyness.. i have to try that out

StK

Newcomer

StK

Newcomer

300g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 10:28:46 PM

I formulated my question wrong.. I know that happyness influences production.. but i didn't know that food influences happyness.. i have to try that out

Igncom1

Craver

Infantry win firefights. Tanks win battles. Artillery win wars.

Igncom1

Craver

11 400g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 7:23:25 PM

Happyness affects science industry and food, witch is why its important to constantly ajust your taxes between massive boosts to growth and research and a healthy supply of dust.

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 7:20:50 PM

davea wrote:
Is the food number you show a "surplus" or the production rate?

"Food Surplus", as listed in the Empire Management screen, and the System screens. Which is the sum of what is grown on the planet, Hero modifiers, empire modifiers, installed improvements, system approval rating, and food consumed by population.

davea wrote:
So if the system overview screen shows 100 food and 100 industry, that means my industrial *production* is 100 and my food *surplus* is 100? Then how do I find my food *production*?

They are both sums, the net output or profit. You can get details by mousing over the food surplus icon in empire management or system view. It will list all the things producing and consuming food that results in the displayed total.

StK wrote:
Food is tied to happyness? really? I didn't spot that.

Do you have numbers?

(like: how much surplus divided by that many pops = +X happyness)

Happiness (Approval) creates additional food. mousing over a Food icon shows additional food production or consumption based on happiness. If the approval is green it's additional production, but if approval is red there's a subtraction instead.

Approval does the same thing to Production, Research and Dust, either adding or subtracting from the total. Sliding the tax bar from one extreme to the other is an easy way to see how much happiness contributes to FIDS production.

Except in the case of Dust, extra tax income is more than the amount lost to empire-wide unhappiness, and it seems to be true across all my planets at all tax rates. So increasing tax produces more Dust. Not sure if that's automatically the case with the other resources.

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

AngleWyrm

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 12:41:51 PM

I've been wondering if population growth rate is at all effected by how much excess food you have on hand, or if it's all because of approval rating. It seems like a high food matches with a high growth. But then, it also seems like a high approval does the same thing.

System	Size	Approval	Food	Growth
Home	13/17	86%	156	58%
Yard	13/17	86%	151	56%
Cygnus	17/19	68%	79	23%
T-70 Mine	13/22	61%	61	23%
Serte	15/20	36%	61	20%

What about planets with high approval and low food, or with low approval and high food? What do they look like for growth?

System	Size	Approval	Food	Growth
Primus	4/7	100%	8	9%
Gano	16/29	24%	51	16%

So it's looking like a huge cache of excess food will boost population growth. As a guestimate, something on the order of about 4 excess food gives 1% growth bonus.

StK

Newcomer

StK

Newcomer

300g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 3:52:08 PM

Food is tied to happyness? really? I didn't spot that.

Do you have numbers?

(like: how much surplus divided by that many pops = +X happyness)

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 3:15:16 PM

It's not a production, the production is the surplus AND the consumption.

That's why it's the only number which can be negative, because your consumption is higher than your production.

grasspuddle

Newcomer

grasspuddle

Newcomer

6 000g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 3:07:07 PM

davea wrote:
Really? So if the system overview screen shows 100 food and 100 industry, that means my industrial *production* is 100 and my food *surplus* is 100? Then how do I find my food *production*?

Your food 'surplus' is your production. If you hold your mouse over it shows the production/consumption or malus that will lower your number.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

700g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 3:01:49 PM

Really? So if the system overview screen shows 100 food and 100 industry, that means my industrial *production* is 100 and my food *surplus* is 100? Then how do I find my food *production*?

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 2:59:07 PM

Your food isn't like other ressources, because the value you can see, it's what it's left after population conumption.

So, the number you can see isn't your production, it's your surplus, so the more you have food surplus, the more the system is happy, increasing pop growth and production.

davea

Newcomer

davea

Newcomer

700g2g pts

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 2:48:11 PM

I am confused. Is the food number you show a "surplus" or the production rate? It makes sense to me that the food production rate, times the happiness, should give the growth rate (plus or minus some constants). That seems consistent with your data. But I don't know how to find a food "surplus", and I am not sure why there would be food lying around on systems that haven't reached the pop cap yet.

Randeng

Newcomer

Randeng

Newcomer

13 years ago

May 13, 2012, 12:49:42 PM

I think that the population growth is affected by your surplus, because it rises your happiness (even if you're at maximum).

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