Zabbo wrote:


1 - On colonies on which I have built all available improvements that I want, the best strategy now seems to be to build nothing rather than additional ships because the ship maintenance cost is too high. This would not be so troublesome if non-producing systems dropped cash into the bank, but as far as I can tell that does not happen. It just bugs me that the best strategy could be to have my most productive systems remain idle. But in two games now I've had to do that to keep solvent.

You should NEVER build nothing. On systems you would have otherwise been building nothing, build either the -> or the -> buildings. Both of these 'buildings' will repeat until you remove them from the queue. This can create an immense amount of cash (and/or science).

BlueTemplar wrote:
What is interesting is that you can use the Anarchists trait (-1/-2 command points) to reduce your early game maintenance!

Interesting thread, I didn't realize about the cmd point change. I must say I find it rather dreadful, unfortunately, and I think the quote above here provides an excellent example of why. I won't claim to have that deep knowledge of the game (I have no problem smacking 'Serious' around, though, so not entirely hopeless) but I can't help wondering if this change was really necessary. It seems... not very elegant.

I'm pretty certain the AI has changed bud. Same as SaintD, pre-update my interactions with the AI consisted of either having to fight the AI immediately, or desperately trying to ask for peace while waiting for the AI to turn on me. Post update, they'll not only allow for peaceful interaction, but other aspects of peace seem different now (An AI currently getting the crap kicked out of them may offer a system or two if you promise to stop attacking, for example).

SaintD wrote:
I'm late to this thread, but I'm personally finding things a little easier because the AI no longer seems to universally be a psychotic blood knight looking for the slightest opportunity to crush me. I can actually manage to make and keep friends even to the point of having no military forces of my own at all if I make the effort. For example, when I play on a map with spiral arms I can completely ignore the centre cluster, scoop up the unoccupied arms, and because I'm not 'in the way' of AI expansion into the middle I get to live in peace, harmony, and joy for the entire game. Before, they didn't really care in the slightest, in the grim darkness of Endless space there was only war.

It was entirely possible to do this previously. I had done it many, many times. I'm fairly sure nothing changed in terms of the AI aggressiveness. Perhaps you have just gotten better at keeping the AI happy? There is a skill to it like.

I'm late to this thread, but I'm personally finding things a little easier because the AI no longer seems to universally be a psychotic blood knight looking for the slightest opportunity to crush me. I can actually manage to make and keep friends even to the point of having no military forces of my own at all if I make the effort. For example, when I play on a map with spiral arms I can completely ignore the centre cluster, scoop up the unoccupied arms, and because I'm not 'in the way' of AI expansion into the middle I get to live in peace, harmony, and joy for the entire game. Before, they didn't really care in the slightest, in the grim darkness of Endless space there was only war.

What is interesting is that you can use the Anarchists trait (-1/-2 command points) to reduce your early game maintenance!

Just to let everyone know, it turned out that while it was a bit harder, I simply needed some time to get back into the grove.



I am now near the top of my "normal" game. Before long, I will have conquered the sophons.

The reason it is easier when not under attack is that the AI goes broke and into rebellion because of the burden of their maintainance.

When they are fighting, they can lose their ships, which actually helps them to recover their economy and delays or even prevent the issue.



@Strudo76: The order in which you research the techs makes no difference. The formula simply takes your fleets command-point-cap and doesn't care what techs or whatever else affected it.

Romeo wrote:
Admittedly, I'm dreadful at the game, but I actually find it somewhat easier after the update. I couldn't ever consider Medium difficulty before. Post-update I can do Medium no-problem, and sometimes even Hard if there's enough opponents taking eachother on. lol

Yep, it seems to be easier, when not under attack, but on the other hand, it seems to be more challenging, when under attack

BlueTemplar wrote:
So, if you research C3 systems, does that mean that each time you research a new ship class your ship maintenance will go up?

Ail wrote:
Yes, exactly.

Does the C3 tech increase cost on it's own as well as the ship class research?

Does it stack correctly?

i.e.

Research C3 first then each of the four ship classes increases cost 4 times? (or 5 times if C3 research also increases the cost itself)

Research all ship classes first then C3 increases cost 4 times or 0 times? (or 5 times and 1 time respectively if the C3 research also increases the cost itself)

Yes, exactly.

So, if you research C3 systems, does that mean that each time you research a new ship class your ship maintenance will go up?

Romeo wrote:
Post-update I can do Medium no-problem, and sometimes even Hard if there's enough opponents taking eachother on. lol

That's the way to do it: divide and conquer. You try to appear unimportant hoping that the AI will thus ignore you and concentrate on vanquishing the other factions and then, when they're all reeling from attrition-style mass fleet warfare, you charge in and claim the rest...

Admittedly, I'm dreadful at the game, but I actually find it somewhat easier after the update. I couldn't ever consider Medium difficulty before. Post-update I can do Medium no-problem, and sometimes even Hard if there's enough opponents taking eachother on. lol

@Zabbo: Yes, both the player as well as the AI suffer from the increase of fleet cost.



Before the patch every command-point cost 1 Dust.

Now the cost starts at 2 Dust per command-point, is 2.8 after the first fleet-size-upgrade and goes all the way up to 8.8 Dust per Command-Point in the lategame.



This drastically changes how you have to operate your empire, especially early on.

And, well, the AIs on normal, in a lot of cases just fail to adapt and end up in rebellion.



@Godmark2: I think he meant that when he said he builds nothing... But then again, you never know!

Admittedly, I am back from a break from the game, but when I started up my newest single-player game, I noticed that I was getting stomped by the AI. The difficulty was, as it was before, normal, but this seemed not at all like it used to be. Production, science, military; the Ai seemed harder.



Forgive my ignorance, but is this just me? Or is this part of the update? (For now, I have demoted myself to "easy")



Also, the enemy AI doesn't seem to value tech-trades anymore....

A kind of logistical upgrade then?

Zabbo wrote:
Yes, game definitely seems to have gotten harder - a good thing.



But I'm confused about something minor - since the update I have been having a significant issue keeping solvent. It seems my fleet cost is eating up my dust much quicker than before. Has something changed here? In two areas I have been forced to significantly change strategies.



1 - On colonies on which I have built all available improvements that I want, the best strategy now seems to be to build nothing rather than additional ships because the ship maintenance cost is too high. This would not be so troublesome if non-producing systems dropped cash into the bank, but as far as I can tell that does not happen. It just bugs me that the best strategy could be to have my most productive systems remain idle. But in two games now I've had to do that to keep solvent.



2 - I like to build and send lots of exploration ships out early to locate the richest systems. Previously, after exploring I would relocate those ships to keep track of pirates and keep an eye on enemy movements - intelligence gathering. That always worked very well for me. Now, with what seems like increased fleet maintenance costs I am being forced to scrap ships. That seems wasteful.



I hadn't previously paid a lot of attention to fleet maintenance costs and quite frankly don't know how it worked before. Has there been a change here or is something else going on here? Is there a place where fleet upkeep is fully explained, I seem to have missed it?



If there has been a change, it should would be nice if we were rewarded for being productive rather than being idle, and if destroying valuable resources where a last ditch effort rather than a standard strategy.

Fleet upkeep has changed from a flat 1 dust per CP to a value that scales with your max fleet size. So if you research the Cx technologies, your upkeep per CP increases, even if your fleet size remains constant.

Yes, game definitely seems to have gotten harder - a good thing.



But I'm confused about something minor - since the update I have been having a significant issue keeping solvent. It seems my fleet cost is eating up my dust much quicker than before. Has something changed here? In two areas I have been forced to significantly change strategies.



1 - On colonies on which I have built all available improvements that I want, the best strategy now seems to be to build nothing rather than additional ships because the ship maintenance cost is too high. This would not be so troublesome if non-producing systems dropped cash into the bank, but as far as I can tell that does not happen. It just bugs me that the best strategy could be to have my most productive systems remain idle. But in two games now I've had to do that to keep solvent.



2 - I like to build and send lots of exploration ships out early to locate the richest systems. Previously, after exploring I would relocate those ships to keep track of pirates and keep an eye on enemy movements - intelligence gathering. That always worked very well for me. Now, with what seems like increased fleet maintenance costs I am being forced to scrap ships. That seems wasteful.



I hadn't previously paid a lot of attention to fleet maintenance costs and quite frankly don't know how it worked before. Has there been a change here or is something else going on here? Is there a place where fleet upkeep is fully explained, I seem to have missed it?



If there has been a change, it should would be nice if we were rewarded for being productive rather than being idle, and if destroying valuable resources where a last ditch effort rather than a standard strategy.

I wasn't aware of the changes with the patch. Pulled up a game in progress to "finish it off" and got steamrolled. All but one of my frontline fleets got eaten within a few turns, and an offroad invasion of my homeworld arrived while my one remaining strong fleet was still a few systems away.



Rude awakening, getting crushed by a two-pronged offensive! lol

The problem I have now is that once my fleet makeup has been countered and I've lost a battle or two, I don't seem to have any hope of catching up. Doesn't matter whether I refit with new weapons or not, it just delays the inevitable. I'm far from awesome, though.