Im a "fluff" man, i like some good lore to read and i love books. The Automatons are one of my favorites and by far have had the most attention to lore. I feel the other factions should be treated to the same wall of text they had, i want the attention to the detail leading up to the point they decided to branch out into space.

Off topic slightly; because i like drawing things ive been trying to find a skeleton Hissho, ie one without armour, helmet etc. so i know what their arms and legs look like and their *avian* traits. Hard to make up some custom faction, The Tohari, without this and i have a half mind to make my profile picture a Tohari Engineer... but i also have a half mind just to do something else... mind is now wandering.

But also, i want to know a few other things as well about who i am going to play as, what they eat and drink; their culture in more detail... but this is me, branching into things such as Warhammer Codex styles and Infinity Books where they go into detail to talk about the structure of who you picked to spend your time working with, painting and having fun with. But its a thing i am passionate about.

Javarino wrote:
Faction bonuses seem a little disgruntled to me, the idea of mixing and matching traits to make a unique faction is great and all but it tends to suck away the originality of the main factions. All you get are these one-off affinities. For example, the Horatio should be masters of agricultural and medicinal cloning, so some kind of population/food bonuses AS WELL AS their current affinity for cloning heroes. Many games, for example the civ series, use these greater affinities for each faction to kind of balance everything out in a way that feels like each one is special. The fact that any two races could have those same base modifiers in different combinations kind of irks me.



I could go on about the other factions, but then you'd probably get bored. Needless to say each one could get their own specific feel, instead of that blasted Amoeba thing that takes the fun out of exploring :l even if I like their bonuses.



The only other thing I could say is that their seems to be enough faction pictures available here on the forum, why aren't those faction pictures in game? They could really help flesh out each faction.

Oh please do go on about the other factions,that's kind of the point of the thread . The Horatio do have their faction specific tech for food I know what you meant but just pointing that out.

Digitalhawk96 wrote:
Im a "fluff" man, i like some good lore to read and i love books. The Automatons are one of my favorites and by far have had the most attention to lore. I feel the other factions should be treated to the same wall of text they had, i want the attention to the detail leading up to the point they decided to branch out into space.

Off topic slightly; because i like drawing things ive been trying to find a skeleton Hissho, ie one without armour, helmet etc. so i know what their arms and legs look like and their *avian* traits. Hard to make up some custom faction, The Tohari, without this and i have a half mind to make my profile picture a Tohari Engineer... but i also have a half mind just to do something else... mind is now wandering.

But also, i want to know a few other things as well about who i am going to play as, what they eat and drink; their culture in more detail... but this is me, branching into things such as Warhammer Codex styles and Infinity Books where they go into detail to talk about the structure of who you picked to spend your time working with, painting and having fun with. But its a thing i am passionate about.

You should start of up an art thread and is there a thread where people can ask about the game lore? I've heard talk of an art book maybe that will have some more lore?

One thing that I thought would add some spice to the different factions was to have them like and prioritize different planets. Why does everyone like terran ocean and jungle planets? Instead of having everyone have the same 3 planets with no minuses for colonizing and then two with a -5 and then another two at -10 etc. mix it up a bit. Have say each faction has one planet type that they receive a bonus for colonizing, Empire and Pilgrims get a +5 bonus for terran planets, while have the Hissho get like +5 for jungle and Amoeba like ocean. These are fairly simple changes, I'd like to see it taken a step further. Have the Sophons like arctic planets and get no penalty for tundra, but they have a -5 for jungle and -10 for arid. Have the Horatio have no penalty for arid and like desert planets, but have a -5 for terran and -10 for ocean.



The downside to this change however is the exploration and diplomacy trees would have to be reworked a bit (order of colonization and terraforming in the former and food production in the latter.) But now it won't be a made dash for those systems with two terran planets all the time.

One thing which would help with the "feel and experience" of the factions lies more in artwork than in programming. When a planet gets colonized show a small pop up image (these can be turned off in settings) which shows what it looks like for that faction to colonize that type of world. There would be different images for colonizing different types of world for each faction. These images can be the same for gas giants. Same for Desert, Tundra and Arid. Given the variety of imagery and the infrequency of colonization it would work well.

The faction traits work quite well, IMHO, so some effort should be put into visualization, audio and new species. Adding some short video clips, or at least pictures, at key events (first colonized planet, endless wonders, etc) could really add some "flavor" to the game, along with more text covering the different factions' histories. Distinct pieces of music playing every now and then in addition to the current (and excellent!!!) sound tracks could also really boost the "feel" of the factions. A slow and heavy tune for the Sowers? Epic violins for the Empire and Sheredyn? Some fast electronic tracks for the Sophon? In addition, I'd personally really like to see some more "exotic" factions in ES, maybe a crystalline species like the one in MoO2, or a Borg-like swarm of intelligent (and maybe sentient?) nano robots?

Mallec13 wrote:
One thing that I thought would add some spice to the different factions was to have them like and prioritize different planets. Why does everyone like terran ocean and jungle planets? Instead of having everyone have the same 3 planets with no minuses for colonizing and then two with a -5 and then another two at -10 etc. mix it up a bit. Have say each faction has one planet type that they receive a bonus for colonizing, Empire and Pilgrims get a +5 bonus for terran planets, while have the Hissho get like +5 for jungle and Amoeba like ocean. These are fairly simple changes, I'd like to see it taken a step further. Have the Sophons like arctic planets and get no penalty for tundra, but they have a -5 for jungle and -10 for arid. Have the Horatio have no penalty for arid and like desert planets, but have a -5 for terran and -10 for ocean.



The downside to this change however is the exploration and diplomacy trees would have to be reworked a bit (order of colonization and terraforming in the former and food production in the latter.) But now it won't be a made dash for those systems with two terran planets all the time.

This is a good idea, it would help create variety and that is the spice of life.

Mallec13 wrote:
One thing that I thought would add some spice to the different factions was to have them like and prioritize different planets. Why does everyone like terran ocean and jungle planets? Instead of having everyone have the same 3 planets with no minuses for colonizing and then two with a -5 and then another two at -10 etc. mix it up a bit. Have say each faction has one planet type that they receive a bonus for colonizing, Empire and Pilgrims get a +5 bonus for terran planets, while have the Hissho get like +5 for jungle and Amoeba like ocean. These are fairly simple changes, I'd like to see it taken a step further. Have the Sophons like arctic planets and get no penalty for tundra, but they have a -5 for jungle and -10 for arid. Have the Horatio have no penalty for arid and like desert planets, but have a -5 for terran and -10 for ocean.



The downside to this change however is the exploration and diplomacy trees would have to be reworked a bit (order of colonization and terraforming in the former and food production in the latter.) But now it won't be a made dash for those systems with two terran planets all the time.

I'm assuming you mean approval rating? I don't think having a -5 or -10 on certain planet types would have as much of an affect as you think. It might be interesting, and kinda cool, but the reason EVERYONE likes terran/jungle/ocean is food (and later pop cap). They make the most food per pop, but also are further improved by the exploit. Even if my race got a -10 approval on ocean, I would still much rather colonize an ocean than an arid or tundra.



It certainly would give a little flare to factions, but I doubt it would make much difference when choosing which planet to colonize.



If you wanted it to really have an impact i think you'd have to make much bigger changes, i.e. jungles FIDS and arid FIDS are swapped for a specific faction, or maybe just change the faction tech to have different planetary exploits. Actually, faction specific exploits is a really cool idea.



More faction specific tech all around! (although that would make it even harder to balance the factions)

Just going to point out that even if every one likes terran worlds, not every ones terran world will be the same.



its really more of a classification of habitability then an actual world type, description and certainty.

Igncom1 wrote:
Just going to point out that even if every one likes terran worlds, not every ones terran world will be the same.



its really more of a classification of habitability then an actual world type, description and certainty.

We are humans though we are arrogant enough to demand the rest of the universe classify things as we like.

For the terran empire!

Simokon wrote:
We are humans though we are arrogant enough to demand the rest of the universe classify things as we like.

Internetional st- .., eh intergalactic standarts, huh? lol

This isn't unique to ES though. Almost half of the codexes and lore in Warhammer 40K is about humans, and they have four dedicated human factions (Imperial Guard, Sisters of Battle, Space Marines, Chaos), to say nothing of all the little human sub factions. I would like to see more alien stuff from ES, sure, but I like the Sheredyn as they are. No need to trample lore.

I have an idea of how you can shake things up in the visual terms at least, One thing thats always seemed to be missing to me is the lack of Structures on the planetary view/system view. Sure, we have the stations in the sky to represent the best possible exploitation and the glowing formations of megacities with anomalies and wonders but these are the same for every single species if we could have differentiated versions for each species somehow? and a set of in system view structures for the System enhancements(these being space stations, merchant vessels flying in and out or however the devs could visualise this) and having each set also race specific that would enhance the immersion substantially

Work can always be done to improve anything. I think all the factions are unique as is, but, again, they can always be improved.



As for the Sowers penalty... I don't know. I've seen that mentioned many times, but the ability to colonize any planet type to fit your immediate need is quite powerful, particularly when you really need a specific resource or anomoly. And it's very easy to research most planet types in a short amount of time. Just don't colonize gas, lava, barren, or asteroid for a while. Everything else is fine, as you'll quickly unlock the tech to remove the -50%. That said, I wouldn't doubt the -50% isn't the perfect stat, but it's a nice round number and, again, doesn't seem to be overly negative, in my opinion.



I think the Amoeba trait is very interesting, but it doesn't really make sense to me. Because they're so emotionally connected they can see the entire galaxy? I'd prefer a more amoeba-y trait, whatever that may be.

Truth wrote:


I think the Amoeba trait is very interesting, but it doesn't really make sense to me. Because they're so emotionally connected they can see the entire galaxy? I'd prefer a more amoeba-y trait, whatever that may be.

Maybe something to do with assimilating a planet into a single organism or something? Like a FIDS or food bonus for happiness above 60%, so it feels like the amoeba are more connected to each other.

Cravers are cool, but you pretty much have to expand and conquer. If you get a bad start, you may fall behind too much to get back on feet (spiral maps for example). Their lack of trading makes all trade resources heroes half useless and same with the research / constructions - also they are only race who has to research on their own everything since they can't trade for it.



Sowers well, the ability to instantly colonize what you want is huge, especially on spiral maps as you can quickly lock out areas of interest and deny your neighbours access. The -50% impairment is not that huge since you start with outposts who need to develop into full colonies by which point you should have the tech to remove the penalty (at least in most scenarios).



I don't really get the pilgrims. If they had some bonus to number of turns it takes for an outpost to become a colony maybe exodus ship would be better, but as it is you simply can't write home about it (yeah you can colonize a system, get it to 3 pop with basic factory, science and maybe agriculture on it, then move it to colonize next system) but making colony ships is really not a problem even in the early stage of the game. I feel like something is missing with this faction, to make them unique, to give them something to stand out and be useful.



Amoeba - I simply hate to play with them for the simple reason of whole map uncovered. At least if it would show only stars in the gallaxy but not the actual systems and enemy players. A big part of the fun in the game is the exploration aspect, which is completely killed with the way Amoeba are right now. Fine let them see stars and strings / worm holes, but not the composition of the systems and enemy players, so it goes 50-50%: you know the layout of the gallaxy and how to move around it, but you don't know what is in the star systems, how many planets, what types etc, nor see the enemy players.



The automatons and sherydans need their own RPG intros, and sherydans need something different traits wise from the UE. Dunno make them more warmongerish type or something.



Sophons should be altered personality wise, since they are all about tech and - as the intro says - are never in the front of battles, they should be more conservative, more mysterious, add a penalty to relations to other factions so they are harder to make friends with, but they don't declare wars like a warmongering faction. They do defend themselves and their teritory / outposts of course, but they shouldn't initiate wars like a warring faction.

Truth wrote:
Work can always be done to improve anything. I think all the factions are unique as is, but, again, they can always be improved.



As for the Sowers penalty... I don't know. I've seen that mentioned many times, but the ability to colonize any planet type to fit your immediate need is quite powerful, particularly when you really need a specific resource or anomoly. And it's very easy to research most planet types in a short amount of time. Just don't colonize gas, lava, barren, or asteroid for a while. Everything else is fine, as you'll quickly unlock the tech to remove the -50%. That said, I wouldn't doubt the -50% isn't the perfect stat, but it's a nice round number and, again, doesn't seem to be overly negative, in my opinion.



I think the Amoeba trait is very interesting, but it doesn't really make sense to me. Because they're so emotionally connected they can see the entire galaxy? I'd prefer a more amoeba-y trait, whatever that may be.

If you have to research the tech in order to make good use of the ability it defeats the entire point of the ability. Lava and Barren are particularity bad about this. And happiness is important for growth and production in the early game,which is when you're going to get the most use out of the Sowers ability. By mid to late game you'll have enough science to pump out planet improvements in 2 to 4 turns.



The Amoeba trait is more of a gameplay thing than a lore thing ,at least for now, it allows them to instantly establish trade routes and control where they settle in order to get good spots fast and avoid conflict.

Anelyn wrote:
Cravers are cool, but you pretty much have to expand and conquer. If you get a bad start, you may fall behind too much to get back on feet (spiral maps for example). Their lack of trading makes all trade resources heroes half useless and same with the research / constructions - also they are only race who has to research on their own everything since they can't trade for it.



Sowers well, the ability to instantly colonize what you want is huge, especially on spiral maps as you can quickly lock out areas of interest and deny your neighbours access. The -50% impairment is not that huge since you start with outposts who need to develop into full colonies by which point you should have the tech to remove the penalty (at least in most scenarios).



I don't really get the pilgrims. If they had some bonus to number of turns it takes for an outpost to become a colony maybe exodus ship would be better, but as it is you simply can't write home about it (yeah you can colonize a system, get it to 3 pop with basic factory, science and maybe agriculture on it, then move it to colonize next system) but making colony ships is really not a problem even in the early stage of the game. I feel like something is missing with this faction, to make them unique, to give them something to stand out and be useful.



Amoeba - I simply hate to play with them for the simple reason of whole map uncovered. At least if it would show only stars in the gallaxy but not the actual systems and enemy players. A big part of the fun in the game is the exploration aspect, which is completely killed with the way Amoeba are right now. Fine let them see stars and strings / worm holes, but not the composition of the systems and enemy players, so it goes 50-50%: you know the layout of the gallaxy and how to move around it, but you don't know what is in the star systems, how many planets, what types etc, nor see the enemy players.



The automatons and sherydans need their own RPG intros, and sherydans need something different traits wise from the UE. Dunno make them more warmongerish type or something.



Sophons should be altered personality wise, since they are all about tech and - as the intro says - are never in the front of battles, they should be more conservative, more mysterious, add a penalty to relations to other factions so they are harder to make friends with, but they don't declare wars like a warmongering faction. They do defend themselves and their teritory / outposts of course, but they shouldn't initiate wars like a warring faction.

The Automatons need their owns ships as well which shouldn't be a problem because the guy who designed them made ship designs later. I feel like the Sherydans should be like an alien race the UE took over and they try to break free. (that's a bit cliche but ideas start that way most of the time). It's just we already have 3 human factions: The UE, The Pilgrims,and the Horatio. If there are need races added I'd like to stay away from Humans and robots themes (and please no space elves or orcs etc etc.)



The Pilgrim ability is all but worthless unless a system is getting captured and you want to rip off the person catching it. I'd be cool with the Sophons getting a diplo and combat penalty. They're already kind of mean though if you pay attention to the fluff when they do deals with you



On the topic of the Sherydans how would everyone differ them from the other factions?

KidKirbyUltra wrote:
The Automatons need their owns ships as well which shouldn't be a problem because the guy who designed them made ship designs later. I feel like the Sherydans should be like an alien race the UE took over and they try to break free. (that's a bit cliche but ideas start that way most of the time). It's just we already have 3 human factions: The UE, The Pilgrims,and the Horatio. If there are need races added I'd like to stay away from Humans and robots themes (and please no space elves or orcs etc etc.)



The Pilgrim ability is all but worthless unless a system is getting captured and you want to rip off the person catching it. I'd be cool with the Sophons getting a diplo and combat penalty. They're already kind of mean though if you pay attention to the fluff when they do deals with you



On the topic of the Sherydans how would everyone differ them from the other factions?

When I first saw the Sherydan I didn't actually know they were human. I thought they were more like androids or battle bots, the kind you see in Star Wars or Metroid. I was actually disappointed to find out that they were just humans in helmets. I have two ideas for making them more unique, one would be making them some kind of alien race that uses those suits like personal armor or as a home for a hive-mind. The other would be to make them machines (I know I know, calm down) that are really virtual and mobile programs, bodyless data, that use the suits as puppets to carry out their will. No more Endless creations, I would make them either autonomous or a race that killed off their creators long ago.

I see them more like sardaukar from dune.