Valazzar wrote:
You people are just like the people arguing for tactical combat, you want it, because you want it. Completely ignoring whatever consequences it may have for playstyles other than your own.



Consider it a design choice made to make multiplayer a better experience. We are some who appreciate this choice.

But by no means is it a design flaw, its a choice - that you dont like.

What are you even talking about? We are talking about the strategic part of the game, not the combat system.



And no, we are considering the implications of such a change, that the game will not have any mechanic that benefits a player with quicker reactions.

Hi, I registered here just to open a thread about this. And yet I'm not surprised to find it on the first page. I don't know how much programming work this would take. But this issue MUST be the highest priority to focus on. A TBS game shouldn't rely on reflexes. Maybe it seems a little fair between two human opponents (which I think not), but I could never outmaneuver an AI opponent in such a system, that's for sure.



However, I understand the concerns about player patience. So may I suggest this: Non-simultaneous (turn-based) gameplay should only happen when a combat is possible. And it would be such a way, that other non-relevant players are still playing simultaneously. I cannot sum up the details right now, but a practical intelligent turn changing system should do the trick (I believe Civilization 4 had a similar option only in MP). "Cold War" feature in this game makes it a little bit trickier though.

What about 2 movement phases.



Begining of turn - fleets set to intercept / patrol move and must attack next turn

Middle of turn - combat, invade, set intercept / patrol setting. Intercept / patrol disallows manual movement

End of turn - Queued movements we're used to making



This means you can block the enemy's fleet that moved last turn, force to attack it, then turn off intercept / patrol and move as normal next turn or this turn if the fleet wasn't automatically moved.

Igncom1 wrote:
It's ok for multiplayer, but there should be an option to switch off.

It’s not okay for MP at all, if anything it’s worse. Any game that has turn sequencing mechanics that are so egregiously exploitable has a problem to solve. If you think your game is unfair against the AI now then just try and play a game against a Human (in PvP not co-op) who understands the turn sequencing mechanics – it’s a whole new level of metagaming. (It’s not just the turn sequencing thing, the way combat with multiple fleets is resolved is also heavily exploitable.)



If a turn sequencing change is implemented, and recent comment from the devs gives me hope that something is being considered, I sincerely hope that it is a universal change, i.e., for SP and all forms of MP.

From another thread:

SpaceTroll wrote:
Guys,

message received loud and clear.

we'll do our best to improve that.



ST

Add a support module that allows for "interdiction". Thus all ships equipped with it can enable their fleet to intercept and engage any other fleet they come across while in-between star systems.

It's ok for multiplayer, but there should be an option to switch off.

gamingalife wrote:
Wrong, wrong, wrong..



This not a MP friendly feature has nothing to do with it being MP or SP, this it how the game works it is a unique system and it is something new and different from the traditional turn based and unless a developer gives an answer non of us will be right. I will be more than glad to admit being wrong once we get an official reply until then I will stand with a shield and protect the current turn system... :P



It is innovative and works, new does not mean bad and that how most of the people in this thread see it the general thought is "NEW? BURN THE WITCH!" you just do it do it tactful

I understand that this is just how the game works, and maybe the devs were trying to think outside the box and experiment a little...in that case it's a failed experiment. It seems to me that it was created to pander to the 'no patience, twitch reflex' gaming crowd that fills the MP halls these days, people who don't have the patience to wait their turn.



In SP it commits the worst crime in a game, it's not fun.

I haven't purchased this game yet. I generally like to view the forums for awhile before I purchase any game (to see if there are any hidden issues that would make the game less desirable to me). I think I would love so much of what this game has to offer, but I think the simultaneous moves combined with the battle timer issue would quickly ruin this game for me. As such, I will not purchase this game in its current state.



The simultaneous moves issue I believe is livable, but when you throw in the battle timer issue, it creates a situation that is completely unacceptable to me. That is battles will occur without me having any input. Intended or not, this is not a mechanic I would tolerate in any turned based 4x game.





I figure I would add my voice to the topic in hopes this gets addressed.

For the people that say this is an MP feature, it really isn't.



My friend played a game against me and naturally being competitive as we are this game devolved into exploiting the mechanics with how turns are executed when we found out how to. Not to mention the combat timers (that's another issue in itself)

I really want to think while playing this game, not focusing on one thing entirely for the duration of the game.



It would be much better if you could have the decision making phase that these games require, after all you have an empire to run, research to queue, blueprints to design, heroes to manage and alliances to maintain and much more but here you are, racing to click a button. Are you enjoying the things mentioned previously?



The timed turns helps mitigate this but it doesn't solve the problem, have the timed turns where players make their decisions and after the turn is ended then all moves are executed. This way you can't expect or see what moves your enemies are making in the same turn so it will then free you to think out your plans for galactic domination while being cautious as to what's happening in the next system...



The combat could be addressed also because having to pick one fight out of ten or so isn't really fun at all. Ship design has a part to play but being serious the combat mechanic also needs to be addressed, the first countdown can run and any after should be on standby and wait for the players attention before they force you to make a decision - give them their own grace period before they countdown too if someone wants to exploit this.

Only issue I have with it is in SP, MP it works out just fine to be honest

You people are just like the people arguing for tactical combat, you want it, because you want it. Completely ignoring whatever consequences it may have for playstyles other than your own.



Consider it a design choice made to make multiplayer a better experience. We are some who appreciate this choice.

But by no means is it a design flaw, its a choice - that you dont like.

Well wish you all the best in your effort but I have made my point here and will stand by it, have a nice discussion.



I will not lie, I sincerely hope that the system stays as it is; nevertheless good luck.

gamingalife wrote:
Wrong, wrong, wrong..



This not a MP friendly feature has nothing to do with it being MP or SP, this it how the game works it is a unique system and it is something new and different from the traditional turn based and unless a developer gives an answer non of us will be right. I will be more than glad to admit being wrong once we get an official reply until then I will stand with a shield and protect the current turn system... :P



It is innovative and works, new does not mean bad and that how most of the people in this thread see it the general thought is "NEW? BURN THE WITCH!" you just do it do it tactful

To you, it works. To many others, we see it as a heavily flawed mechanic that needs to be fixed.

Atlantis_Risen wrote:
Just because MP wasn't implemented doesn't mean that the game wasn't designed from the beginning with MP in mind. Looking at the poll on the main page tells me that a much larger percentage of ES customers are interested in SP. It would be a shame to alienate them just for this MP friendly feature.

Wrong, wrong, wrong..



This not a MP friendly feature has nothing to do with it being MP or SP, this it how the game works it is a unique system and it is something new and different from the traditional turn based and unless a developer gives an answer non of us will be right. I will be more than glad to admit being wrong once we get an official reply until then I will stand with a shield and protect the current turn system... :P



It is innovative and works, new does not mean bad and that how most of the people in this thread see it the general thought is "NEW? BURN THE WITCH!" you just do it do it tactful

gamingalife wrote:
Do not change the game change your play style and NO this has nothing to do with this being an MP feature, remember MP was not implemented till Beta so it is not something that was done for MP purposes...

Just because MP wasn't implemented doesn't mean that the game wasn't designed from the beginning with MP in mind. Looking at the poll on the main page tells me that a much larger percentage of ES customers are interested in SP. It would be a shame to alienate them just for this MP friendly feature.

Wall of text, interesting read but there is no need to fix the issue. I am glad about this and you can use this to you advantage vs AI. Impossible and Endless would be so much harder if I could not use the simultaneous moment to my own advantage. It is an unusual mechanic and does require learning but thats the beauty of it there are so many possibilities.



Do not change the game change your play style and NO this has nothing to do with this being an MP feature, remember MP was not implemented till Beta so it is not something that was done for MP purposes...

Getting this straightened out, IMO, should be a priority for the devs. This should be a real turn based game. If MP players have to wait patiently for all players to finish their turn, so be it. If they want fast, they can play Starcraft. Don't ruin SP because you try to grandfather in some MP feature.

moraruro wrote:
until now, seems like the people who play in MP enjoy it...

Er... no. If anything it is even worse in MP because humans are better placed to exploit it, i.e., deliberately waiting to initiate a crucial battle to improve your chances of fighting it against the AI (which doesn't play any cards, and even if it did it still doesn't play cards best suited to fleet composition). The MP time-saving argument is also invalid because it is often advantageous to be the last to move in a turn but if two players want to do that you end up with a Mexican stand-off which can cause the game to break down completely if one doesn’t do the honourable thing and give up the advantage for the sake of playing the game. If this mechanic solves one problem it creates two more.

They could just implement such option into settings and let everyone choose for himself. SP ofc.