Gandhi didn't build many empires, nor has he conquered the earth.



I mean come on! They are bloody XENOS! you can't trust them!





But if by 'Peaceful' take overs you mean subverting the imperial control of a system via espionage, trading treaties, monopoly's, hostile corporation takeovers and terror attacks to force the system to become independent via a rebellion, spawning pirate ships to attack the imperial garrison and eventually taking the entire system, so you then can take it without having to start wars with a major power.



Then I would agree.

n18991c wrote:
There's no point trying to win an argument on history here, people, because this cannot be achieved in short posts which only scratch on the surface of such complex topics and, also, because this isn't the place for it.

Sadly, you're right.

n18991c wrote:
I admit to a certain appeal to discussing things with my fellows here but, ultimately, Artis is right, we ought to get back on topic

That is the problem. The topic was: "Is there any way to facilitate a cultural takeover in ES?" The answer was: "No."

Everything after was already offtopic. So I'll move this to the FAQ and close it as an answered question.



If anyone wants to support the suggestion of including cultural takeovers in ES, please do so in the original suggestions:

Contested systems

Cultural migration

Cultural takeover

There's no point trying to win an argument on history here, people, because this cannot be achieved in short posts which only scratch on the surface of such complex topics and, also, because this isn't the place for it. I admit to a certain appeal to discussing things with my fellows here but, ultimately, Artis is right, we ought to get back on topic

We were being constructive, this is really one of the best forums out there for this kinda thing.



But ok then

tank you mr troll and mr troll moderator for being such constructive about this topic. i ve understand there is no thread or post someone could be constructive if its against your opinion or beliefs. have read some other posts and understand there is no place for being constructive or mention some ideas if you re in it. i ll ask to delete my account in here.. its ridiculous.



i only wanted to write something about being disappointed about having no more diplomatic possibilities to take over other systems and mentioned some ideas. if that is to much for you.. well thx.. i ve understand.. and out..

Artis wrote:
i assure you it was peacefull symbol of this vote was build after the vote and is still in use by todays people. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsches_Haus_%28Flensburg%29

Originally, germany did not fulfill the treaty requirements after the german-denmark war of 1864. 1907 the borders were even acknowledged by both countries, so germany effectively annexed a part of denmark.

The point is that germany was forced to relinquish a part of the annexed territory by the contract of Versaille after the defeat of world war I. It didn't do so out of its own volition.



While I agree that the method was nice and worked well, I do not agree to count this as a peaceful takeover or even a peaceful revolution. It's never that easy in real life.

Nosferatiel wrote:
I agree that eastern german people revolted and that the outcome was peaceful, but western germany actually "bought" this peace from sowjet russia by economic help for Gorbatschow. I'd rather call it a trade, actually.

thx dear moderator for being so constructive and keeping off topic away..... -_-...

i have understand.



disappointed²



kind regards.

Kcyrion wrote:
Wasn't the reunion of germany in 1989 a 'peaceful takeover' of the people after years of cold war between both governments?

I agree that eastern german people revolted and that the outcome was peaceful, but western germany actually "bought" this peace from sowjet russia by economic help for Gorbatschow. I'd rather call it a trade, actually.

Nosferatiel wrote:
Well, that was rather not completely peaceful, since this happened after world war I.

i assure you it was peacefull symbol of this vote was build after the vote and is still in use by todays people. http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsches_Haus_%28Flensburg%29



and despite people trying to change the topic of this thread (even a moderator.. O.o) and destryoing every good idea other players ever mentionned about the missing chance to take over without being an ass-thing in the game.



plz dear developers, try to pull something out at this point. there are so much diplomatic traits in this game, you should reconsider peacfull take over and other diplomatic or peacefull solutions in this game. its not something bad to copy good things from other good games^^ making your game experience far more great^^ but without this possibilities this game is far more onesided.



kind regards

Wasn't that after the collapse of the soviet union?

Wasn't the reunion of germany in 1989 a 'peaceful takeover' of the people after years of cold war between both governments?

Artis wrote:
for example with denmark and north germany some80 years ago the people where asked do you want be part of denmark or germany in a democratic vote.

Well, that was rather not completely peaceful, since this happened after world war I.



I'm not aware of any occasion in human history, where two cultures peacefully merged. Even secession did never really happen peacefully. Just think of the declarations of independence of the USA or the Kosovo. You could also take the Prague Spring as an example of a completely peaceful attempt at secession that ended in a bloodbath.



Even in some civilisation titles, cultural takeover comes along diplomatic troubles (at least) or even an outright declaration of war, which is actually what happened most times in history.

I was just having a little fun.



But really the way that other games do it is just an abstracted version of what I said, or is just for gameplay purposes.





This is a game of empires, and empires don't function that way. And historically the examples you provided are very rare instances of this happening, because anywhere else in history the rulers of the land would never heed to the wishes and preferences of the people.



What you describe is so rare that it is doubtful that it would ever happen again, especially across the territory of interstellar space.

Gandhi didn't build many empires, nor has he conquered the earth.



I mean come on! They are bloody XENOS! you can't trust them!





But if by 'Peaceful' take overs you mean subverting the imperial control of a system via espionage, trading treaties, monopoly's, hostile corporation takeovers and terror attacks to force the system to become independent via a rebellion, spawning pirate ships to attack the imperial garrison and eventually taking the entire system, so you then can take it without having to start wars with a major power.



Then I would agree.

could you do me a favour and stop with this ridiculous mumbo jumbo^^

it inst rly constructive or either helpful. there are more ways of a diplomatic, cultural or influencial win. and i wanted to point them out for this game. in addition your more violent ideas should be mentioned for this game too.



maybe you havent experienced such games.



but these potenials are within endless space too.if a country has a far greater influence on the other, they could merge, or people init would be asked to split up or join the new country. roman empire didnt conquer every country only by war, people joined them freely too, because of the greater benefit for themselvesfor or example with denmark and north germany some 80 years ago the people where asked be part of denmark or germany in a democratic vote. or take canada for instance. influenced by two countriess. made up their own.



in other games the comforts of a culture, people, or race outhweigh the discomforts other races or people have, and they want to convert willingly to the ofther more advanced people, realized by having the far greater influence on them.

hi,

i dont get it, how its possible to take over a system being completely surrounded by my sphere of influence and far beyond.

have explored all diplomtaic posssibilities. and the other planet does not convert to my people no matter what.



- never attacked them, even if they wanted war.

- are in alliance now

- my people are more cultural advanced and are extatic all the way,

- all interaction is explored between races

- i have an alliance with all racess

- all are happy



or isnt it possible at all? because whats then the point of playing the amoeba, if every diplomatic strategies are thrown away, because the only solution to get a system or planet is war.. ? could someone answer?



kr

davea wrote:
If you refuse to play games that don't have culture flip, then you are right, this is not the game for you. I guess the number of games you can play is very limited then. On the other hand, if you want to win games without firing a single shot, you can do that in several ways in Endless Space. Try a diplomatic, or economic, or science victory.

well, there is no real diplomacy in your game. diplomatic win is only to sit some rounds in a big alliance. maybe you ll reconsider some ideas. well i hope for it. because influence means more than a threat. and could be easily changed ingame. worth of planet, system happines factors against how many percent are covered of the enemy planet with my influence. how happy they are, economical factors .. and tada.. peacefull take over..

This is more in the stage of gunboat diplomacy, just like the original SOTS.



Peace through power, not saying you ever have to use it.



Edit: That's a little sad but I understand your reasoning, hopefully the game might be more appealing in the future!

same post - something went wrong - plz delete

Artis wrote:
if its only possible to conquer planets with violence and threats... makes diplomacy and diplomatic trees somehow useless.. same thing goes for the diplomatic races

If you refuse to play games that don't have culture flip, then you are right, this is not the game for you. I guess the number of games you can play is very limited then. On the other hand, if you want to win games without firing a single shot, you can do that in several ways in Endless Space. Try a diplomatic, or economic, or science victory.

you should write it down into the wiki^^ but you seem not do understand, that cultural comes from civilization and people know this form of diplomacy from different games despite your understanding,



in my understanding there is more than bad influence wich makes me a raging killing machine. there are more ways to influence somebody in different ways even to convert peacefully.



and if the borders of a country, nation or race - wich means its influence - grows, other people being in there are automaticaally asked to be part of the new nation or move on, or go rioting.



never talked about culture, i mean it in a different way. in civilization its cultural, thats why i called it so.

only how dissapointing it is to realize that there is no real diplomacy in this game.