Add enough defenses that their weapons cannot pierce them per round.

Sorry to necro an old thread, but I just wanted to add that you can build ships with Bomber modules and still get the "Way of Harmony" achievement. Apparently the only modules that are forbidden are Kinetic, Beam and Missile weapons.



You could make the argument that it is kind of cheating to use bombers, but if you want to play with pirates enabled and still get "Way of Harmony", this is one way to go about it. In my game I refrained from attacking other factions and just used the bombers to clear out pirates who were blockading my key systems.



For some reason having a hero with Blockade Bypass governing the system didn't seem to help with the pirate blockade.



I was trying for a diplomatic victory, but despite my best efforts I ended up winning an economic victory with only 41% on the diplomacy counter.

Profound wrote:
Are you allowed to upgrade your original scout with different weapons? (I would assume not)

Unlikely.



Not sure what you mean by maximise. My fleet was full regen focused, research to armour that gives %hp, repair with %regen fleet, load mostly those, with some armour. 40k hp ships that regen half their health

Xanoth wrote:
It doesn't, you're just not allowed to build ships with weapons. You're allowed to have them.

Are you allowed to upgrade your original scout with different weapons? (I would assume not) How did you maximize like.... your advanced defense ships, etc?

Shame you can't bribe pirate fleet then.....he he.

Profound wrote:
So, what about the first scout ship you get that has like.... weapons? How does that affect you getting this achievement?

It doesn't, you're just not allowed to build ships with weapons. You're allowed to have them.

So, what about the first scout ship you get that has like.... weapons? How does that affect you getting this achievement?

eBusiness wrote:
@sirwhiskers I'd say Non-Baryonic Particles is too far down your research list. You should grab it when you are producing around 80 research points per turn. Sure you could have gotten 3 or 4 other nice technologies for the same research points, but once those Magnetic Field Generators kick in you'll catch up in no time.

That's a very good point. NB Particles is only 680 RP, the same as Baryonic Shielding, which gives access to cruisers. In most of my games, by the time I have the choice, I need some defensive units. As I mentioned, I prefer cruisers to destroyers and corvettes, so I generally grab those first. A player who is willing to use smaller hulls should prioritize NB Particles - the +40 RP structure and the luxury resources are extremely useful. I've edited my previous post to highlight the two options.



One of the things I love about this game is that there are so many different strategies to use.

@sirwhiskers I'd say Non-Baryonic Particles is too far down your research list. You should grab it when you are producing around 80 research points per turn. Sure you could have gotten 3 or 4 other nice technologies for the same research points, but once those Magnetic Field Generators kick in you'll catch up in no time.

Elegant Caveman has great info above, especially the focus on managing approval. I’ll add a few research specifics that have worked for me so far.



Concerning research priorities, I generally start with the following:



N-Way Systems (heavy isotope refineries)

Soil Xenobiology (alien grafting)

Xenology (luxury resources)

Xenobotany / Arid Epigenetics (Arid, Tundra)

Isotope Fabrication / Advanced Machining (missiles, flak, better kinetic defenses)

Efficient Shielding (destroyer)

Applied Casimir Effect (wormhole travel)

------------military option ---------------

Alternative Armors (+6 xp on ships structure)

Unstable Isotope Manipulation (first beam weapon)

Baryonic Shielding (cruiser, Lava)

-----------science option ----------------

Neural Robotics (% repair module)

Non-Baryonic Particles (+40 RP structure, luxury resources)



Reasoning: Production and population growth are critical in the early game, hence Heavy Isotope Refineries and Alien Grafting. As Amoeba, opening wormholes helps to grab more exploration freebies before the AI. I prefer cruisers for my early fleets, and lava planets are good for production. Cruisers have the potential to survive into the late game, so long as I upgrade them periodically, which allows me to keep all the XP they earn from the beginning. I hate throwing away ships, as any XP they earn is lost.



As eBusiness notes in the next post, Non-Baryonic Particles is a very, very good advance to get early. If one doesn't need the military techs right away, a good option is to go for NB Particles first. And once you do start building larger ships, you'll like the improved repair module that you pick up on the way.



Adjustments: If I’m lucky enough to have Redsang, Bluecap Mold, Dustwater, or Hydromiel on my starting planet, I’ll grab Xenology first to unlock it right away, then N-Way, etc. If I have early problems with pirates, I move the military choices further up the list.



After these, I just research what seems most important at the time, working my way around the wheel. I rarely go more than a couple research levels deep in any area before grabbing advances on the other axes. If I can grab four lower-level advances in the same time it takes to gain one mid-level advance, I find the four advances are generally more useful.



Here are some mid-level advances that I tend to reach for at some point:



Core Mining (Hyperium)

High Energy Magnetics (Antimatter)

Extreme Metallurgy (Hexaferrum)

Advanced Simulations (Advanced Containers – more tonnage on ships, Barrier action)

Non-Baryonic Particles (+40 science structure, luxury resources)

Radiation Proofing (+25% hp on ships structure)

Advanced Countermeasures (module adding +15% to defense efficiency)

Quantum Communications (+2 CP per ship class researched, max +8 CP)

Non-Baryonic Shielding (dreadnought, bonus pop on planets)

Botanical Scanning (approval)

Optimized Logistics (approval, dust production)

Any of the advances that reveal hidden resources

Any of the advances that unlock luxury resources



Reasoning: Revealing and unlocking resources makes a huge difference, especially the luxury ones. Many systems that seem pathetic become much more useful once those extra resources are available. When it comes to ships, I’m a firm believer in quality over quantity, so adding tonnage, XP, and hit points is a priority. Similar to my reasoning about cruisers, I like dreadnoughts as they tend to survive battles that would destroy smaller ships, so they keep the XP they earn, becoming even more formidable. Anything that boosts approval is worthwhile. Structures that produce extra dust are not useful in the early game, when systems tend to have small populations, but by the mid-game they can make a real difference in dust income.

illywhacker wrote:
How could I have built on this opening strategy and avoided this unproductive conflict. Pumped out easier to build defensive destroyers instead? Developed slower in early game to avoid upsetting neighbours. Built defensive fleets earlier in anticipation of jealous neighbours? Something else?

Early-game balance can be tricky. Expand too fast and you cripple yourself, expand too slowly and you lag too far behind. I've written a bit about this in this thread, feel free to take a look. Just some general tips on starting out (post in the link, and the two following it; I apologize in advance for the wall of text).



As for your specific situation...



It does sound like you expanded a bit too fast. Not necessarily a bad thing, but it does complicate things. As sirwhiskers said, it can be good to "cordon off" a portion of the galaxy, and pick n' choose where you colonize. Early on, especially, is terribly important. I would argue that early-game, it's possibly the most important resource to manage.



Spread out too much, too fast, and all your worlds will go on strike. That's bad. Very bad.



Also be wary of building too many ships early on, as the upkeep for big fleets can kill your economy.



While you're in that early growth phase, your upkeep on all your systems keeps growing higher and higher as you build improvements everywhere. Personally, at least, I much prefer spending upkeep on improvements than on ships.



Defensive ships as mentioned in my original post can be good for this, actually, as you don't need that many.



In terms of hulls (using UE names), Battleships are best (for their -20% defense module costs), but cruisers can be decent (for their -25% armor module costs) and, in a pinch, maybe even corvettes (for their -25% repair module costs).



Trying to keep the AI happy can be hard, though. I find that a pacifist approach is hardest, because of this. Be too weak, and you look like a juicy target. Be too strong, and you piss them off. It seems that the AI likes you best when you're just a bit less strong than they are; not too much of a threat, but not too much of a target.



Distance is also important. The more borders you share, the less they like you. Try to get some treaties up and going as soon as you're able, as these grow with time: the longer you're at peace, have open borders, a cooperation agreement, or an alliance, the more "value" (in terms of positive relationship points) you get from them. Most of these treaties come later (and I'm generally not a fan of alliances), but "peace" can be teched early, and is very nice to have with as many people as possible.



Pumped out easier to build defensive destroyers instead?



I would use scout hulls over destroyer hulls, for defenses. But both have too few HP/tonnage, so I would stick with cruisers or battleships.



One bonus to defensive destroyers over defensive corvettes is that they're easier to retrofit into attack ships later.



Developed slower in early game to avoid upsetting neighbours?



Maybe a bit, but you don't want to lag behind. In terms of expansion, I would say focus more on keeping a decent approval rating (internal focus) instead of worrying about what your neighbors think of you (external focus).



Early on, the key to growth is speed. Focus on planets/systems that 1) will grow quickly, with good food/industry, 2) have immediately-useful strategic or luxury resources and 3) have strategic value, such as choke points.



Systems with crappy planets can be skipped, as long as they're within "your" area and you're fairly certain the AI won't come and colonize them. Set up solid choke points, and you should be fine.



Don't forget that though colonizing a crappy system early might be tempting to give it "time to grow", while that system remains crappy, it'll drag down your overall empire . So one system with crappy approval can make all your other systems suffer as well.



Built defensive fleets earlier in anticipation of jealous neighbours?



Ships cost upkeep, and even if you had a big scary fleet, then they wouldn't like you because you're too scary. I would say a few good defensive ships blockading choke points would be better than trying to "impress" them with sheer number/strength.

illywhacker wrote:
Also, the enemy AI seemed to be able to creep through my systems and even invade while on cold war status, which didn't help. I'm pretty sure this is a bug, unless I've really misunderstood travel mechanics.

Two things about this:



1) Area of influence will only keep people out if they can see it. Anybody can go to an unexplored system, even if the area of influence would otherwise stop them. Once it's been explored, though, the influence limitations kick in.



2) A newly-colonized system is an outpost, not a colony. Outposts can be invaded while under "cold war" status, and a formal war declaration is not necessary (I don't know if they can be invaded when you're at Peace... maybe not?). It takes a while for an outpost to become a colony; only colonies have areas of influence.

illywhacker wrote:
Out of interest, roughly which branch of the tech tree was your early research focused? I was 1st in research but suspect I neglected military research for too long, thinking I'd have a diplomatic approach, and possibly that's why I had trouble defending adequately. I'll try a new game using your methods and report back.

Generally speaking, it's good to be relatively balanced when teching, since all branches are at least somewhat interconnected. Don't focus too much on a single branch of the tree, but do feel free to go and get specific techs that might be considered "advanced" if they offer a clear and present upgrade which you can put to good use right away.



It's a mix of balance, guess-work and experience. I often neglect military tech too long as well, then I find myself having to rush and hope for the best.



Try to anticipate the enemy, though. At the very least, don't lag -too- far behind. Even when not on a military focus, try to keep your military tech somewhat up to date. If you're a tier below the enemy, it's not the end of the world. But if you're a couple of tiers behind, you're in trouble.



I find that early on, rushing the first beam tech will keep me going for a while. Especially if I have a lot of hyperium. Early-game, destroyers with lots of cheap beams and a couple of armor modules (no defense modules) can dominate fairly well.



Especially if you have a bonus to HP. Get some 1k HP destroyers with a bunch of beams, hope for 4+ Hyperium, and you have some very strong, very cheap ships early on.



Given how weak early weapon systems are, I prefer extra HP and the Nano-Repair Systems battle-card (+20% repair) to using defensive modules. Even with only 600hp, you're repairing 120hp with the battle-card, which is enough to soak up the damage done by early weapon systems.

Anelyn wrote:
@ElegantCaveman: am very curious what do you mean by adding more armor to your ships makes you immune to their damage? As far as I am aware, the shield module adds only more HP to the ship but doesn't reduce the damage taken, and you actually need defense modules to reduce damage taken from a particular weapon type (otherwise defense modules would make no sense if armor would simply reduce all damage taken on top of adding more hp?).

You're absolutely right! Thank you for bringing this to my attention.



I did mean "defensive modules", and not "armor modules", I have the terrible habit of calling defensive modules "armor". I've edited the original post so that it's clearer.



That said, depending on the foe you're facing, defensive modules alone might not be enough to mitigate -all- damage. I find that a mix of defensive modules + armor modules + repair modules (+10%) works quite well; lower damage, soak up/repair the rest.



The "Nano-Systems Repair" (+20% HP Repair) battle-card is also extremely useful with this.

I hadn't played ES since Alpha, and I've finally come back to it. Being rusty and unsure of what's changed since I last played, I wanted to ease into it. Couple of simple games on normal to "test drive" the factions I didn't know.



Started with Sowers. Good fun. Oh look... there are achievements now? Alright. Next game, Amoeba. Hmm... there's an achievement for winning without using weapons...? Interesting!

The Way of Harmony

As Amoeba, win a game without building any ships containing weapons.

So I wondered: is it possible to achieve this through a military victory? After all, invasion modules aren't weapons, are they?



Turns out it is possible! On low difficulty, at least. About half my systems were acquired through "peaceful" invasion.



Throw enough defensive modules onto a ship, and enemies will do little to no damage. You can protect yourself by doing this, when at war. Just defend your systems with your defensive ships, and the enemy won't be able to actually attack your planets.



Why be passive when you can be active, though? Go forth and conquer!



Either throw on a couple of invasion modules on your defensive ships, or make some "invader ships" loaded with them that you send as a second wave!



It's slow, but it works.



With a solid enough tech advantage, the enemy won't even be able to scratch your paint job.



On higher difficulties, though, I could see this easily posing a problem. But as long as you have decent tech and focus on defense, it should be doable.



What makes this a particular pain is the way ships behave when a system is guarded. You can't move, they can't move. Since you can't kill ships, you're stuck there forever, unless they kill you, or you retreat.



If you move your ships onto an unguarded system, go ahead and invade; even if your enemy sends ships after you've begun your invasion, you can continue!



But be careful: using both defensive ships and dedicated invasion ships, I set the defensive ships to guard, but not the invasion ships. The enemy would usually only target the armored ships, but it happened now and again that they also attacked the invasion ships, which were easy to kill.



I'm unsure if this is a bug or a feature, but it's something to keep in mind. For this reason, having some hybrid defensive/invasion ships can be useful.



Any system on which there are already enemy ships are off limits, though. It can be a good idea to send some defenbsive ships to them anyway, to make sure the enemy ships don't move away, but you can't invade.



But when you retreat, they'll sometimes either come after you, or move to another of their systems, leaving the one they were on empty, and free for the taking!



This is not a fast way to win a game. But it can be fun. It's a mix of patience and cat n' mouse.



Free Travel/Warp is your friend! It lets you attack systems behind enemy lines, where they may not have as many ships.



And though an expansion victory done this way can be a fair bit of trouble, depending on enemy strength and galaxy size, the general strategy's still useful for grabbing a couple of extra systems you otherwise wouldn't be able to get!



So let's recap:



* Not using weapons means you have extra room for defense modules and armor; throw on defenses, and the enemy won't be able to touch you.



* Use heavily-defensive ships to control the movement of your enemy. They can also hold off invading forces.



* Invasion modules don't count as weapons!!



* It can be useful to have some defensive/invasion ship hybrids.



* Free Travel/Warp is your friend; it allows you to get to systems the path to which might otherwise be guarded. Control + Right Click to force Free Travel/Warp.



* You don't need to go for an Expansion Victory, of course. This can be useful for snatching a couple of extra systems you'd otherwise miss out on.



Well, that's that in a nutshell. I've probably forgotten to mention some key element, so feel free to ask questions, though I don't promise I'll have answers.



Bottom line is, yes, it's theoretically possible... but good luck on Endless. Probably. I don't know. Anybody have experience with something like this on higher difficulty/harder settings?

@ElegantCaveman: am very curious what do you mean by adding more armor to your ships makes you immune to their damage? As far as I am aware, the shield module adds only more HP to the ship but doesn't reduce the damage taken, and you actually need defense modules to reduce damage taken from a particular weapon type (otherwise defense modules would make no sense if armor would simply reduce all damage taken on top of adding more hp?).

sirwhiskers wrote:
My personal strategy with Amoeba affinity (custom faction) is to immediately identify which choke point systems I want to hold to limit the AI factions and race for those. I pick up whatever freebies I can along the way, and if I get advanced or elite defenders, I let them block the choke points. But one way or the other, I want to cordon off an area roughly twice the size of the area available to any other single faction. Then I cherry pick the systems within that area. By the time the other factions get irritated with me, I've had time to research some decent military tech (hopefully cruisers, then dreadnoughts) so I can hold them off and even pick off systems from the weakest.



Usually I select choke points on my side of a wormhole. I've never had a fleet successfully retreat back thru a wormhole, which means if my blocking force is on their side, it will retreat further into their space, no longer blocking them from using the wormhole. I will go into their territory if there's a system I really want - if I can build it up before they notice, such a system can make a great staging area for an eventual assault. But that means stationing forces on that system and in the blocking system. If I have to choose, the blocking system is always more important than a single system in the AI's sphere. I can retake a system, but once the AI fleets are loose in my area, it's a pain to track them down and kill them.



Try to keep a large enough blocking force to kill their scouts, or at least force them to retreat. I've noticed that if I let a scout sit in a blocking system too long, the AI tends to send significant reinforcements. If I kill it or force it out, they're less likely to do so. This is one problem with using strictly defensive ships - unless you're willing to commit a significant force, the AI will eventually come at you with their largest fleet and may overwhelm you thru sheer numbers.



If you can hem in the AI factions, you'll eventually gain enough of a tech lead that you won't care if they like you or not. Especially if you design your faction with Blockade Breakers. I use a lot of Ind to Sci to conversion so as to get that lead and keep it. No surprise, it's much easier to hold off the AI factions if you have better tech than they do.



I'm on my sixth game with Amoeba affinity and haven't lost yet. Of course, that's on Normal - I expect things will be a lot different when I try the higher difficulty levels. We'll see if I have to adjust my strategy then.

Good info whiskers.

I'd tried a pretty similar approach but was perhaps less disciplined with guarding the choke points. Also, the enemy AI seemed to be able to creep through my systems and even invade while on cold war status, which didn't help. I'm pretty sure this is a bug, unless I've really misunderstood travel mechanics.



Out of interest, roughly which branch of the tech tree was your early research focused? I was 1st in research but suspect I neglected military research for too long, thinking I'd have a diplomatic approach, and possibly that's why I had trouble defending adequately. I'll try a new game using your methods and report back.

illywhacker wrote:


How could I have built on this opening strategy and avoided this unproductive conflict. Pumped out easier to build defensive destroyers instead? Developed slower in early game to avoid upsetting neighbours. Built defensive fleets earlier in anticipation of jealous neighbours? Something else?



Cool game though!

My personal strategy with Amoeba affinity (custom faction) is to immediately identify which choke point systems I want to hold to limit the AI factions and race for those. I pick up whatever freebies I can along the way, and if I get advanced or elite defenders, I let them block the choke points. But one way or the other, I want to cordon off an area roughly twice the size of the area available to any other single faction. Then I cherry pick the systems within that area. By the time the other factions get irritated with me, I've had time to research some decent military tech (hopefully cruisers, then dreadnoughts) so I can hold them off and even pick off systems from the weakest.



Usually I select choke points on my side of a wormhole. I've never had a fleet successfully retreat back thru a wormhole, which means if my blocking force is on their side, it will retreat further into their space, no longer blocking them from using the wormhole. I will go into their territory if there's a system I really want - if I can build it up before they notice, such a system can make a great staging area for an eventual assault. But that means stationing forces on that system and in the blocking system. If I have to choose, the blocking system is always more important than a single system in the AI's sphere. I can retake a system, but once the AI fleets are loose in my area, it's a pain to track them down and kill them.



Try to keep a large enough blocking force to kill their scouts, or at least force them to retreat. I've noticed that if I let a scout sit in a blocking system too long, the AI tends to send significant reinforcements. If I kill it or force it out, they're less likely to do so. This is one problem with using strictly defensive ships - unless you're willing to commit a significant force, the AI will eventually come at you with their largest fleet and may overwhelm you thru sheer numbers.



If you can hem in the AI factions, you'll eventually gain enough of a tech lead that you won't care if they like you or not. Especially if you design your faction with Blockade Breakers. I use a lot of Ind to Sci to conversion so as to get that lead and keep it. No surprise, it's much easier to hold off the AI factions if you have better tech than they do.



I'm on my sixth game with Amoeba affinity and haven't lost yet. Of course, that's on Normal - I expect things will be a lot different when I try the higher difficulty levels. We'll see if I have to adjust my strategy then.

Nice guide Caveman!



Actually it touches on a few issues I'm experiencing at the moment.



Having finally working out how to play the game, I played a successful Amoeba opening, using their trait to nab the best and most stragegically placed systems, expanded profitably, ending up FIDS leader. Only a little too successful - while I had planned on trade in the mid-game, my neighbours grew suspicious of my success and started invading systems. With this guide in mind I built defense-only cruisers. But this was such a hit on my industry that it kind of levelled the FIDS field, my opening advantage gone, fleets playing boring cat-and-mouse battles.



How could I have built on this opening strategy and avoided this unproductive conflict. Pumped out easier to build defensive destroyers instead? Developed slower in early game to avoid upsetting neighbours. Built defensive fleets earlier in anticipation of jealous neighbours? Something else?



Cool game though!

Once you get to %HP armour, stick with that when using a lot, it gives better returns than the next armour up. And generally %repair modules are better for larger hulls/armoured ships. So be careful with auto upgrade or it will downgrade your ships and you'll lose hp and repair. Same goes with power modules which are upgraded arbitrarily to the highest one regardless of function (so if you equip the defensive one, the researched the crit one, auto upgrade will change it to crit even though your ships are designed for defence and have no weapons... nothing's perfect just be careful and double check.

Thanks for the answers.

I already tried the "full def" / high hp version now for about 30 turns and it seems to be a good way.

Xunrel wrote:
Hi,



first of all: sorry for my bad english, it's not my native language.



I'm just trying to play the amoeba and have a question, 'cause I'm quite new to the game.

If you're trying to play without weapons, how do you defend yourself against pirates?

It depends how annoying the pirates want to be, but if your ships are well designed and with good enough defence/regen; the pirates won't be able to destroy your ships and will often retreat, or if you're not blocking that system, they will move on and become someone else's problem.

Xunrel wrote:
Hi,



first of all: sorry for my bad english, it's not my native language.



I'm just trying to play the amoeba and have a question, 'cause I'm quite new to the game.

If you're trying to play without weapons, how do you defend yourself against pirates?

The easy way will be to select 'no-pirate' option.