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Why does Capital Punishment need Empire's Stability lower than "Settled"?

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2 years ago
Jan 11, 2023, 6:16:44 PM

The first person who wrote against the actual usefulness of the death penalty and torture was Cesare Beccaria, an italian who is widely considered one of the greatest thinkers of the Age of Enlightenment because of his progressive ideas. Against the game's logic he actually wrote Dei delitti e delle pene, which is the book where he explained his ideas and its also his most famous one, during a stable time where culture and science were flourishing: I may understand the necessity for the game to make depend some civics unlockement on a low stability empire, but in this case 1) it's not realistic and 2) is almost useless (its already very rare to unlock the Punishment civic for a very similar reason).


Possible solutions:


1) Dedicate a whole update (or most of it) to update/rework the Stability and Revolution system (it may contain all of the other suggestions)

2) Change the prerequisites of Capital Punishment

3) Change the prerequisites of Punishment

4) Make disadvantageous building Garrisons/CQ (lowering their Stability yields/ making districts lower stability in proportion of the number of the ones already in the city) to increase the value of civics/infrastructures (ex: City Watch, Secret Police, Neighborhood Watch)

5) Lower the FIMS of the city when it's not stable for many turns (but give it a buff when it becames stable again); in my opinion making the city yields less static (but not too much) would make the player make feel the game less boring, especially when you are already familiar with the strategies/gameplay


If you have some preferencies over my suggested solutions you can vote them in the poll so to let the devs know of our perceptions

Updated 2 years ago.
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2 years ago
Jan 12, 2023, 7:08:41 PM
A1y0sh4 wrote:
2) Change the prerequisites of Capital Punishment

As prerequisite it may have: Enact the choice "Forfeiture" in the "Punishments" Civic, discover Encyclopedia. At this point we should even balance Punishment's prerequisite, what about something like: experience a revolt (when an unstable city spawn IP; anyway, under every circumstance, in my opinion, Stability needs to be more dynamic, and low stability shouldn't always be a malus to the gameplay)

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a year ago
May 27, 2023, 11:44:48 AM
A1y0sh4 wrote:

The first person who wrote against the actual usefulness of the death penalty and torture was Cesare Beccaria, an italian who is widely considered one of the greatest thinkers of the Age of Enlightenment because of his progressive ideas. Against the game's logic he actually wrote Dei delitti e delle pene, which is the book where he explained his ideas and its also his most famous one, during a stable time where culture and science were flourishing: I may understand the necessity for the game to make depend some civics unlockement on a low stability empire, but in this case 1) it's not realistic and 2) is almost useless (its already very rare to unlock the Punishment civic for a very similar reason).


Possible solutions:


1) Dedicate a whole update (or most of it) to update/rework the Stability and Revolution system (it may contain all of the other suggestions)

2) Change the prerequisites of Capital Punishment

3) Change the prerequisites of Punishment

4) Make disadvantageous building Garrisons/CQ (lowering their Stability yields/ making districts lower stability in proportion of the number of the ones already in the city) to increase the value of civics/infrastructures (ex: City Watch, Secret Police, Neighborhood Watch)

5) Lower the FIMS of the city when it's not stable for many turns (but give it a buff when it becames stable again); in my opinion making the city yields less static (but not too much) would make the player make feel the game less boring, especially when you are already familiar with the strategies/gameplay


If you have some preferencies over my suggested solutions you can vote them in the poll so to let the devs know of our perceptions

I would say this total should be rethought. Because I find this thinking a bit outdated. Besides there are already plenty of sources like https://papersowl.com/examples/death-penalty/ that have analyzed the death penalty and come to a result, this one actually isn't human and shouldn't exist.


Updated a year ago.
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a year ago
May 27, 2023, 11:49:27 AM
ainsleylee wrote:
A1y0sh4 wrote:

The first person who wrote against the actual usefulness of the death penalty and torture was Cesare Beccaria, an italian who is widely considered one of the greatest thinkers of the Age of Enlightenment because of his progressive ideas. Against the game's logic he actually wrote Dei delitti e delle pene, which is the book where he explained his ideas and its also his most famous one, during a stable time where culture and science were flourishing: I may understand the necessity for the game to make depend some civics unlockement on a low stability empire, but in this case 1) it's not realistic and 2) is almost useless (its already very rare to unlock the Punishment civic for a very similar reason).


Possible solutions:


1) Dedicate a whole update (or most of it) to update/rework the Stability and Revolution system (it may contain all of the other suggestions)

2) Change the prerequisites of Capital Punishment

3) Change the prerequisites of Punishment

4) Make disadvantageous building Garrisons/CQ (lowering their Stability yields/ making districts lower stability in proportion of the number of the ones already in the city) to increase the value of civics/infrastructures (ex: City Watch, Secret Police, Neighborhood Watch)

5) Lower the FIMS of the city when it's not stable for many turns (but give it a buff when it becames stable again); in my opinion making the city yields less static (but not too much) would make the player make feel the game less boring, especially when you are already familiar with the strategies/gameplay


If you have some preferencies over my suggested solutions you can vote them in the poll so to let the devs know of our perceptions

I would say this total should be rethought. Because I find this thinking a bit outdated


What would you suggest?

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a year ago
May 27, 2023, 12:22:57 PM

The fifth solution is my least favourite, because it is already quite exhausting to keep track on your cities stability each turn. Imagine your plans being disrupted just because your FIMS output suffers frequent shifts, and frequent they would be, because a lot of stability pool draws from your trade links with access to luxury resources.


I'd like some rework on the Rebels and Revolutions, because as of now Rebels are only suitable for branching into the minor civs by giving them outposts in barren territories, so that they can be later made city-states.


2 and 3 I am totally fine with, 4 doesn't seem connected to the original issue that much to be effective.

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