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Steam frigates

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3 years ago
Feb 18, 2022, 11:49:23 PM

Are completely outperformed by ironclads, even though both are unlocked by the same technology. Currently the only advantage of steam frigate is that it can be upgraded from a caravel. Can we get a slight buff  for the frigate maybe?

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Feb 19, 2022, 1:33:01 AM

They have higher range so technically better when not fighting on coastal. Also resource requirements are different so I don't mind having both.

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3 years ago
Feb 19, 2022, 2:33:19 AM
Diegoyya wrote:

They have higher range so technically better when not fighting on coastal. Also resource requirements are different so I don't mind having both.

They have a lower range. Ironclad has a range of 5 tiles, while frigate has a range of 4. Good point about resources though.

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3 years ago
Sep 28, 2022, 1:35:57 PM
otis123 wrote:
The frigate is currently the weakest ship in the game, but it's also one of the most versatile. It can go from a basic scout to a heavy-hitting assault ship in a matter of minutes. It can take on almost any role well, and it's one of the most popular ships in the game

Its popularity probably comes from the fact that it's what most pre-existing ships can be upgraded into: If you've been building a navy since the Ancient era, your Pentekonters will eventually upgrade into steam frigates.  The ironclad is strictly superior in every way except for requiring one additional iron and coal, and by the time the Industrial Era rolls around, access to a third iron should be easy and access to a third coal shouldn't be a serious challenge.


It's odd that ironclads have a stronger base combat strength than steam frigates do, as well as having Inner Sea Mastodonte.  This means their CS is 54 or 65(!!!) compared to the Steam Frigate's 51.

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3 years ago
Sep 28, 2022, 1:50:48 PM

Proposal: I'm not a fan of debuffs, but consider the following for the Ironclad (not all at once, of course):

  • Lower its CS to the mid/high 40s.  The Ironclad's Inner Sea Mastodonte trait grants it +11 in coastal waters, so a hypothetical CS 45 Ironclad would be weaker than a Steam Frigate (51) in the open seas, but stronger (56) in coastal waters.
  • Lower the benefit of Inner Sea Mastodonte: Drop the bonus from +11 to something smaller.
  • Lower its movement speed to 5 or even 4.  Steam Frigates can be your "cavalry of the sea", while Ironclads would be more for defending friendly shores.
  • Lower its attack range to 4 or even 3.  The ironclad's best-in-class range adds insult to injury when compared to the Steam Frigate.  Lowering its range to 3, so that it's strictly less than the Frigate's, is an interesting tactical balance:  They benefit from Inner Sea Mastodonte in coastal waters, but if Frigates can engage from one-tile-out-of-range, the fight becomes more tactical and requires careful placement and a mix of forces.
  • Increase its production cost: Simply making ironclads cost 2-4 times the production of a Steam Frigate, and maybe even requiring 2 pop, could help.
  • Make them rust: Ironclad coastal ships were far higher maintenance than their wooden-hulled oceangoing counterparts.  Why not modify the Inner Sea Mastodonte trait to also include "Damaged (-35 health per turn) by consecutive turns spent in deep water."  They'll be strong coastal vessels, but crossing the ocean with them is a riskier venture and you might need a safe port across the sea before you engage a foreign enemy.
Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Oct 3, 2022, 2:37:05 PM

Maybe the Steam Frigate could obtain a totally new role and become the industrial era transport ship ? (no transport ship right now in industrial, we are still with caravela)

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3 years ago
Oct 3, 2022, 3:12:17 PM

Oh yes, an industrial transport ship would be welcome, if only for the facelift alone.  I still think there's a role for oceangoing combat "cavalry" (in contrast to coastal "defenders"), and that could be the Steam Frigate or it could be another ship, but you're absolutely right that the road from the Caravel to the Landing Craft is a long one.

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