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Feedback: First Impressions

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3 years ago
Apr 23, 2021, 10:15:18 PM
Mausklickmoerder wrote:
AOM wrote:

My very first impression was that it's odd that a game named Humankind has only military units on the screen. Where are all the other humans? Are other character types going to be added later or is this basically a war game with window dressing?

Well, its still a 4x after all...

I get that. The name Humankind doesn't match the gameplay though. If you don't have military units you wouldn't be doing anything but clicking boxes in various popups, your city construction queue, and the civics/tech screens - there would be no characters on the map. There are only soldier humans in the game. That isn't representative of humankind. Further, this game seems in many ways to be attempting to take the CIV VI concept to a higher level. But, it isn't really a civilization game in its current form. It's a military game and the only moveable characters are military units. That's my first impression, and the type of game it is doesn't have anything to do with my subjective opinion.

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3 years ago
Apr 23, 2021, 10:27:01 PM

Finished a game on humankind difficulty, I managed to reach industrial era at turn 145 or so by the point the game ended. The pacing, especially technology progress seemed slower, I did not manage to get all early modern techs by the end of the game. The influence cost to found cities ment it was hard to get many cities, except if you use war to capture them, less cities slowed down things like population growth and district development. The ai seemed more competetive, atleast on humankind difficulty, one ai was always close to me in terms of fame and several ai was able to progress in eras faster than me, however as the game progressed it got easier and easier. One ai was also completely destroyed by other ais. Many of the balance issues in Lucy is still a thing and I dislike the 1 harbour per territory limit, i liked the Lucy with multiple harbours to exploit the whole sea. Emblematic district limit seems to be a good thing.

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 23, 2021, 11:03:05 PM

Just finished my first play-through and overall I really enjoyed the experience and wanted to play more. The things I enjoyed most are the pacing, tech tree and city management systems. The things I liked in general but felt needed work were the combat, diplomacy and economy aspects of the game. In all I am glad you had another open dev and I am looking forward to the final product later this year.


I really enjoyed the pacing of the game with each age feeling distinct and not too short or too long. I did find myself wanting to stay at each age longer, but I feel that this was a case of me not building my special district right away and not wanting to lose it. Maybe allowing 1 culture specific district per city from past ages could mitigate that sense of loss on advancing. Otherwise I felt that each age was long enough that I could enjoy using the units of each age which makes it feel worthwhile to build units. Combat pacing was also well done I love the idea of large battles being fought over multiple turns with possibilities of reinforcement on both sides, but I felt like I was given enough turns to accomplish something meaningful during the 3 rounds per turn.


The tech tree seemed well balanced with each technology granting what feels like a meaningful upgrade. It is fairly simple but I don't really see a need for the tech screen to be complex. I was able to find every upgrade I wanted easily and none of the tech I researched felt wasted. Tech also seemed to be paced well as I felt that even though I did not go out of my way to get a lot of tech in my empire I still managed to be at the tech level of the age I was in.


I love building cities in this game. Probably some of the most fun I have is building the large cities across multiple territories and my favorite tech upgrade is the hamlet because it feel so rewarding to place. However, city management does have some problems. Stability is a pain in the ass to track as the bar doesn't really give you the information you need to determine whether or not you can pay for a district. In the very early game I found it difficult to place districts as I couldn't afford them but later in the game when I had all of those luxury goods bonuses I had less than half of the districts I could have supported because I didn't know how far into the green I was. Furthermore, while having the game block out buildings that would do literally nothing was a nice change, what exactly you get from a building is still a complicated math problem. I would really like it if in the tooltip the game would tell me exactly how many resources a building will give me the moment it is built much like a district. That way I can make informed decisions without having to look for and count all of the river/forest tiles in my 4 territory city. Also I found myself losing population without any warning that my people were starving, this should probably be an end turn button priority message. Overall I enjoyed city building but the UI needs to be more clear on when to build districts versus when to build buildings.


Combat feels overly simplified and feels like a lot of wasted potential. Spearmen, for example, have a generic passive bonus against cavalry. This is boring. Instead why not give them an active ability like spear wall where instead of attacking they get a charge and ranged attack defense bonus on the 3 sides they are facing. For cavalry instead of the ridiculous 6 movement give them a charge ability so they can move 3 hexes in a line and attack anything in the way. What I am saying is giving every unit a single active ability instead of these passive bonuses would go a long way towards spicing up combat and make it less of a stat fest where the best tech wins.


I also want more diplomatic options. Demands have so much potential to be amazing and yet are incredibly boring. Demands should be weighted similarly to the way they are in a peace deal. There should also be more options in resolving demands. For example, I have a demand for my opponent to cede a territory. He is afraid of me but won't give up land. I should be able to offer him to pay up in equivalent gold or resources or maybe even vassalage if I have enough aggregate demands and military power. Similarly rather than the stupid clean slate deal demands should cancel other demands on equivalent basis. Finally I think offering vassalage should be in the alliance negotiation screen as a powerful empire should be able to peacefully vassalize a weak state that they are on friendly terms with.


The gold economy felt generally non-existent in the game. I never went out of my way to acquire gold and I still seemed to have a lot of it. I also rarely seemed to spend gold as the only things that seemed to use it were trade routes and rushing buildings. Food seems to be the most powerful resource as pops are everything in this game from production to military power. I didn't dislike the economy it just seemed like gold should have more value as a resource. Perhaps introducing mercenaries or adding upkeep to buildings and units would make it more viable to collect as compared to any of the other options. Culture is very frustrating to deal with early game. I had the AI Olemecs slam me with so much culture he would get claims on my territory 5 turns after I founded it. There does not seem to be an option in the second age that counters this.


In all I love this game and even if it launched in this state (with all the bugs fixed) I'd be happy with the product, but I feel it can be so much more and I'm glad you guys feel that way too. Thank you for this opportunity to participate in this development and I hope my feedback has helped.

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3 years ago
Apr 24, 2021, 10:38:51 AM

I finished my first play-through yesterday and I really enjoyed playing the game.


The developed steps form Lucy to Victor i noticed most are the pacing of the game which i enjoyed very much and the thech tree and its pacing there it takes cleary longer to go through it which i liked very much too.


I noticed the tooltips for the Civic changes in the event choices and in the civic tree but I think due to a bug not all tooltips working well in this category. But I liked the change and how it looks. But the efects of the Civics were not so powerfull beacuse i didnt noticed their impact on my playstyle. But i noticed aswell that my choices lead to shared techs with the ai which I liked very much.


I loved the battles overall (and maybe it was a bug too because somehow i cant produce archers which are usefull against anti-cavilary untis like hopelites and due to that i lost some big battles against the AI) But i take this not into account because I know it will fixed... I think the AI is doing well in this category because when you bother them too much they declare wars and making allinaces with other AIs to attack yourself. And when they attack you they dont do it once and stop it. They try to do it constantly. So this behavior i like very much and its more competitive than I expected.


The Diplmoacy actions and features i like and understand too except the War Resolution and how to change an occupied city to your own city for develpoing it. That thing could be explained better I think.


So yes I love to play this game and try to get better and better and I am looking forward to feel the next develops and  to play the final version one day before my birthday and a lot times more!


Thanks for the great opportunity to play this OpenDevs and I like to help you to make the most beautilul enjoyable and addictive game I ever played :)


Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 24, 2021, 10:46:09 PM

So im with the crowd that's dissapointed with the VictorOpenDev, I started the game 3 times and could only manage to finish the game once and I haven't touched it since, I can't believe im going to say this but i felt bored. I had to go back to Civilization VI to scratch the itch, and comparing both games; even though granted Humankind hasn't come out yet  and Civ VI has been updated constantly. I had the thought that Humankind was not going to be the "civ killer" after all. 


Where do I start? 

Pace
I guess, the most apparent thing is that the pacing is all over the place, even though OpenDev Lucy had pacing issues, it felt way more solid and fun and okay maybe I got used to the pacing of OpenDev lucy you might asume but I play a ton of 4X games and the pacing on this OpenDev was very awkward for me. I barely had any time to build any districts and before I could even reach the tech for my unique unit the era was already gone, POOF just passed by. I wanted to try some of the naval warfare out but no-chance the playtime was over before I could set up something. I did play on "Empire" difficulty so maybe the pace of the era picks up quite a bit because of the AI, but dang like let me atleast enjoy the game; I can handle difficulty. (I play on Deity constantly in Civilization V and VI).  One of the glaring issues is that the science cost for tech has been increased based on the feedback of the Lucy opendev to compensate for the rapid pace, however the pace of the game is dictated by the era stars and fame system, Im not sure if those systems were tweaked as well but I think the pace is still off. The more i think about it the more i realize how the fame system might have been a bit detrimental to the game. 

City Building
The next thing i suppose is that the districts feel so... weak? I don't know but I barely feel like im making a decision that has any weight when i place a district, It's like Im building for the sake of building. Where building units feels so much more gratifying I almost would rather build units exclusively and conquer everyone. Okay, the districts help you get units better and faster but they don't feel like such a priority espcially when you can just buy units with gold early game and make a push. Sorry to compare it to civilization so much but it's only natural; but in Civilization VI the placement of districts is one of the most fun aspects of the game, the puzzle and interaction between what you want to achieve, multiplied by the terrain that you have and hitting certain timings with the policies etc.. etc... 
I hope you get the idea, in civ the decision making combined with the puzzle of city building is so much more engaging than in humankind. 

Graphics/UI/Performance

In general I would say that the game looks quite beautiful, paticularly the 2D artwork, however when it comes to the UI I really dislike some parts of it. The design decision to have this white opaque layer that covers things up is one that I wish would get completely scrapped; It bothers me the most when engaging in battles. It's so hard to look at not to mention difficult to determine what the actual area of combat is. Ive seen comments saying that it's so much better now but I could not tell you what's changed. I disliked it before and I dislike it now. Please just remove the milky layer and just add some sort of border graphics when you are in combat, i would suggest maybe inverting the idea, put the overlay layer on the outside of the battlefield and let the nice beautiful terrain shine through. Other than that, I think the game runs a bit choppy when it comes to the UI, sort of unresponsive and clunky. I would like to blame Unity for that though. So many games made with unity suffer from that or perhaps it's my resolution 3840×2160.
Oh yeah.. the Ideology UI seems to half-work because it doesn't easily display the information. It would be nice to also have a ideology display information when deciding upon event choices. 

Civics/Religion
The civics system is a bit bland I wish it was more impactful and consequencial. For example taking actions could bring you deeper into individualism for example every time you buyout a unit or a district you move a tiny to individualism and you get bonuses for money etc, however if you take actions that would be considered not individualistic for example using population to finish construction you get a penatly such as stability loss or a rebel unit spawns. That way it influences the player choices and the events also get enhanced because the events are free ways to change your civics without suffering penalties. The religion is pretty straight forward, you get bonuses from your followers and its a good way to patch out areas where your empire/civilization is lacking. It works fine but its not very fun? It feels like a very un-engaging part of humankind, it's just sort of there and it does it's thing. It might help you generate greviances but it's kinda meh, particularly because I think the diplomacy is kind of confusing and not too interesting. 

Diplomacy
I couldn't understand diplomacy very well since I first encountered it on the Lucy OpenDev and I still don't get what's going on there. 
It's confusing and feels sort of unimportant. Maybe im playing the game wrong but I could not tell you how to play the diplomacy game properly. I just kept betraying people because I found it more convienient to simply go for my goal and do a surprise war power grab than trying to figure out what the hell is going on with diplomacy. Trading is too weak, I don't see much value from it except for a tiny bit of urgent stability that can be gained from purchasing some resource or if you need iron. Also a small improvement would be to very easily let you know how many traderoutes you have instead of trying to figure it out by clicking a ton of times on the different players and counting yourself. 

I hope criticism is useful and not taken too harshly, I imagine it might sound a bit harsh but I have the best of intentions. I suppose I only mentioned negative feedback but if there's stuff I didn't mention it's because solid or fun like the combat. When I first saw the trailer for Humankind I was overwhealmed with hype and after the Lucy OpenDev I got a tiny bit dissappointed; however now im fully worried that the game is not going to be good, even a refund crossed my mind but I have some hope the game could be very good at release.





Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 25, 2021, 7:08:52 AM

I have to open with I didn't play the Lucy Opendev, so all my opinions are from me going in mostly blind. 

Also, this is mostly based off of my first full run, where I went for Mercantile/Gold cultures in every era. My main rules were: Prioritize money, try to be peaceful and play tall, trade/ and sail the seas. The main lessons from that were that gold is op beyond belief, the AI takes forever to attempt religion, Fame and Science having "eras" that get completely disconnected was bizarre, warfare could be interesting as long as nobody brought elephants, and the AI never built a boat.


Pace/General Mechanics:

This seems to be pretty all over the place. At first, the turn-by-turn felt nice, exploring, setting up an outpost, hunting animals and spotting a few wild AI scouts. Then building a city, researching, unlocking stuff, pretty good. Then the 7 star eras kicked in. I was late to the first, tied into 2nd, and then was almost a full era ahead for the rest of the game fame-wise. As each new mechanic was introduced, it seemed like the AI needed the tutorials more than me. Religion was just an on-switch, that you poke at occasionally to demand someone accept your religion that's already eaten 80% of their territory. I got an alert once about an influence takeover, but took one religious tenet that completely overpowered all neighboring influence from then on. I still don't understand what the influence takeover does other than causing events if your city (and seemingly the city itself, not attached territories) neighbors someone else's city. My "sphere of influence" was basically the same as the known world by the end, and it didn't seem to have done anything. Making religion more involved, and the influence spheres actually do something visible, or if they do explain somewhere when and what it's doing would go a long way.

The way large battles can take multiple turns is fantastic, and lets a very fun and challenging set of ebb-and-flow happen in battles. I had multiple fights start out as a small skirmish, that drew in outside armies on both sides, with one side taking the advantage one turn, then a shift the next as new reinforcements arrived. The only problem is you can start a fight with one tile touching your fort, and buyout instant armies right into a fight and reinforce with them. Once I figured that out, any fight near home-turf was just a matter of putting gold and pops to the slaughter.

The biggest pacing issue, and my main gripe about the game other than stacking buff balance issues, is that the Era pace is completely broken. I ended the game in the early modern era fame-wise, a little ahead of the rest of the AI, but AI and myself were barely inventing the crossbow, and neglecting chunks of the tech tree to get that far. Being told that my empire is reaching world war 1 culturally, but it's been 125 turns and I'm fighting with unique units from 2 eras ago (Specifically the broken as hell Carthaginian Elephants that can 2-shot a persian immortal anti-cav unit, which was still the leading military tech units I had when I ended the game as Venitians. Not sure if you're supposed to still have access to units from multiple eras back.) All the facets of the game had this gap. I have no clue what half the civics are, because other than religion, I only unlocked 3 or 4 per category, but had 3 spare civic points stocked. Religion just kinda happened in it's own realm. I could buyout an entire city of districts, infrastructure, and repeated festivals in a single turn because I was making thousands of gold a turn at war. I had maxed stability, seemingly infinite money and influence, maxed out religion before anyone else had a 2nd tenet, had civic points and tech to spare, but the game ended what seemed like 100 turns too early, congratulating me for progress I didn't feel I'd been able to make.


Cities/Territory

Outposts and the attaching system work alright. It seems to help for playing tall by being able to build off outposts in other zones, but at the same time it took a while before I wanted to build anything outside my capital. Cities felt kind of hollow. My capital, (due to op money) had every building/wonder/religious temple available, but nothing was specialized. My capital could do everything in every category perfectly, and founding other cities felt more like a way to launder money by insta-buying them to max with 0 population. Building Rome in a day is super disappointing when it works like a wal-mart; every one is the same as the next, just depends how many people happen to be there. Having some sort of trade off, terrain being a bigger influence on what each city is capable of doing well, something to make it so my artic camp and tropical island aren't carbon copies of eachother. 


Ui

Ui felt like an abusive relationship. Mostly due to bugs. Sometimes it was super readable and helpful, like city screens. Sometimes I felt like I had been cursed, like the first civic pop-up locking my screen up so I couldn't clock on the map or scroll using the mouse, could only select one unit, and couldn't issue any orders to anything. I'm still not sure what exactly happened there, but it only fixed on a full game restart. Some tooltips are broken, like many of the sliders on civic options having a mouse-over text that seemed to be placeholder Put_something_useful_here type things in a pretty purple color. The Irreligionist civic is outright lying, and doesn't accurately explain that it's a "turn off religion" button, even more proof religion is a light switch. Putting that off the edge of the tree entirely would be nice. With the rest of the civic options, putting something more than "wonder what could unlock this??" as a tooltip on locked civics would be nice. Some hint as to what eldritch demons I have to summon to unlock more options would be nice. A lot of the time spent wrestling with UI was just baffling. Why do region names and city names not showup on zoom out? The only method I had for discerning what was what was to click a city, and I could see the names of attached zones only. Trying to guess what I would get in a war was mindboggling, and sometimes region names and city names were not even close to the same, so that I'd ask for a region I was convinced didn't exist, only to be handed the capital city that had a completely different name. Please, either put the region names on zoom out like endless legend, give us a map mode, or instead of labeling everything with the empire it belongs to, but the name in the nice pleasant box where every other 4x game puts the city/outpost names. I know by the Crest who owns a city, I want to know what city it IS. 

Also, a breakdown on what is happening with certain mechanics, like religious spread or sphere's of influence would be wonderful. It's impossible to know what is happening, or why it's happening under the current system. I'm aware sphere's of influence are changing, and influence in that region is causing it. I don't know what that means, why I care, how I can use it, or what is even affecting the influence in a region specifically. Same with religion. 


Diplomancy and Trade

I am in love with Diplomacy, for the most part. The treaties are kinda barebones, but solid. The war and alliance options are clear-cut. The trade tab is pretty straightforward, though traderoutes being semi-permanent after a one-time cost is strange, and abused instantly for endless gold if you're a merchant civ. The traits system, and the showing of personality quirks, strengths, and current stance towards the player were all really nice once I figured out what they all mean. It let me effectively manage and plan my relationships with AI, but also surprised me when my rash traitor neighbor never actually attacked me, instead betraying more opportune targets because his economy was reliant on our trades. The demands system is odd at first, but I love how you can press minor or major issues, and the AI will either submit, or leave you hanging, generating war support or creating a balance of grievances to cancel out. I wish the AI would outright refuse grievances like players can, but maybe they never had a situation that justified it in my game. Figuring out I needed an international incident to justify a war was very intuitive and I loved it.


The bad of this is that trade itself, like most gold related issues, is easily broken, and I owned a copy of every resource in the game by the end, and was exporting everything in existence. There should be some balance between outright losing a resource when you sell it like Civ, to the current have-your-cake-and-eat-it-too system, thought it's more like buy a cake that someone else is still eating, eat it yourself, and then sell it off while still eating. Nobody is losing in these trades, so why would you ever not sell everything not nailed down?


Overall, there are parts of this game I love to death. There are parts that are just unpolished, and need some tuning. And then some parts (poor poor religion, actually seeing an AI use a boat) that feel unfinished. The game is at it's best when it's pushing and pulling on you, when your losing fight turns into a comeback because you rushed some scouts in to reinforce from over a lake, or when a rival is demanding reparations or land, so you make counter demands to diffuse things. Managing war support so you don't lost a war you have to upper hand in due to public outcry. More incentive to switch culture types as your easy-trading days turn into warring expansionist, or scientific studies in the new world. 


Right now, playing a static, mindless, boost your numbers and spam method wins easily. Why change culture types when money always wins? Why worry about systems when every war is ended by instantly buying an army right into any fight that starts. Why explore the world or mess with independent civs, the AI won't, they don't care about boats and only interact with most mechanics passively, so any active intervention just shuts them down. 


I completely forgot independent tribes were a thing. They either assimilated instantly despite having just spawned, or existed somewhere out of reach and out of mind. I don't even know how to hire mercenaries from them. 

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3 years ago
Apr 25, 2021, 11:04:17 AM

It's fun to just be playing the game again. I like a lot of the balance changes made since Lucy, although I think some stuff can be rolled back. I'm also going to miss the "realistic" pop gen based off of population but the system right now is definitely cleaner and easier to understand. So far I'm attempting a full militarist run without any FIMS bonuses and it's oddly fun, especially once you notice how cheap military units are to produce. The combat definitely still feels good and I'm having an enjoyable time.

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3 years ago
Apr 25, 2021, 4:28:50 PM

In my last playthrough I was simply building holy sites that gave me huge yields (if you take the right tenant). I probably had like nine stone rings that gave me more than 60 gold per turn each and tons other benefits). In the end you don't even build any districts anymore, which makes city development strange. I just pop the stone rings out to where I think I need a road for my next attack on an opponent. And the somewhat unexplainable thing for me is, sometimes you can build multiple holy sites and sometimes it is not available (maybe the AI build them?). Would be nice to make this entire city building a bit more organic than that.

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3 years ago
Apr 25, 2021, 6:37:33 PM

I found this to be a huge improvement over the lucy open dev and will play through it at least one more time. I ended with about 9k fame points at around turn 140ish. Before I give too much of my feedback I'll point out that the biggest complaint I'm seeing from other people is that the eras progress too quickly. I think people are missing the point that you really want to hang out in an era and get at least 15+ stars before progressing to the next era, It's a HUGE increase in fame point generation to get the 3rd star in several areas. You might really want to consider upping the fame star requirement to 10-15 (7 is too few) but then add in a 1 star per turn (0 points) catch-up mechanic once anyone researches a tech in the next era as well as the extra stars as soon as someone advances. 


So for those of you saying the eras go by too quickly focus on getting 15-20 stars, for those of you saying your getting steamrolled by the AI early on hang out in the neolithic until you have 10+ units, advancing too soon is a noob trap.


Now then for my experience, I played on the difficulty one up from default and the game was still too easy, the second play player had 2k fame compared to my 9k and I was constantly a full era and about 10+ stars ahead of everyone. I think the AI is too easily intimidated and maybe needs to take into account the strength of their allies when deciding to go to war or concede to deals. If it's already doing that then the AI needs to be more open to allies. I did not find the ai to be too zerg like, quite the opposite I found them to be way too passive and easily intimidated.


I still think the pacing of the game is too fast (but MUCH improved over lucy) my main problem was that influence is too scarce early on and then too abundant by turn 60 onward. I went from not having enough to settle cities to having so much that I bought and built all but 3 wonders (yes I had like 15+ wonders and was building them about every other turn from turn 100-130). A large fraction of that was the influence per population per holly site, those tenants are broken.


Along with influence and expansion imbalances, the settler comes way too late in the tech tree to really be useful, by the time you get them the map is painted. Now having said that I intentionally didn't focus on tech until towards the very end and only discovered the new world on the last few turns of the game but it feels weird to be practically in the modern era before colonialism kicks in.


I'd really like it if your culture-specific buildings carried over through all the ages, it's a huge loss to capture or settle a new city in the 3rd or 4th age and not be able to build your 2nd or 3rd age buildings.


Last random thoughts:


-Like everyone else religion feel uninvolved, I just accumulate points until I can buy a bonus, meh. Not sure how to fix it, civ's way of using missionaries to fight it out doesn't feel like the right answer, and just spending other fism to build buildings also doesn't feel right. Maybe something more story-oriented using the events system? I think the biggest problem is that you just kinda earn religious points passively side by side with the rest of your resources, you're not really needing to sacrifice or make an interesting choice to get religious points.


-Certain combinations still feel overpowered, my next playthrough I'm going to test out going double econ out the gate, combining -20% buyout costs with -50% buyout costs I'm going to guess will be game-breaking we'll see. Like I mentioned above stacking the influence per pop onto holy sites was also broken. but the flip side of that is that some improvements are practically worthless with no synergies at all. 2-3 turns just to get +2 influence on the main plaza, or just +3 gold on the main plaza... meh those feel like noob traps they are so bad.


-Diplomacy isn't bad but I don't feel like I'm in control of the situation, I can't make choices to try and influence friendship or try to manufacture grievances, generating fabricated causus belli's or sending diplomats to attempt to bring your nations together is needed. Like many things in the game, there needs to be more active agency on the part of the player and less passive accumulation of numbers.


-I didn't get into any naval warfare at all will report back after my next play-through.


All in all buying the preorder was money well spent and its great to see the huge improvements keep it up.

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3 years ago
Apr 25, 2021, 8:16:52 PM
(Apologies ahead of time for the length of this post. I am a rather verbose individual. Shakespeare would say, I'm sure, I have no wit.)

Hello everyone!


I hope everyone is managing to have some good times with the game during this open dev period. I always enjoy being able to discuss games I'm excited about with other people who share in that excitement and I find it an exciting time for the community, even if a lot of the discussion is about constructive criticism. I want to preface my first impressions feedback by saying I understand the game is not feature complete, so I hope the developers will forgive my ignorance in some part because there may be things I point out that simply are not included in this open dev intentionally and may make their way into the game at a later date and/or are being actively worked on. I would also add, I've been a supporter and lover of Amplitude's games since the first Endless Space, so I come to this open dev having a certain way of engaging with Amplitude games that I'm accustomed to. 

Having said the above, I feel like Humankind is the most non-Amplitude game that Amplitude has made, and I absolutely mean that as a compliment.

Here is bulleted list of first impressions of some main aspects/systems/mechanics of the game:
  1. Economy - For me, this is the least engaging part of the open dev. Trade that is centered around luxuries and strategic resources just seems to kind of "happen" without much effort from the player, as the relative buying and selling of said resources is tied to diplomacy and the trade agreement you've signed with other players. Money can be spent on exactly the sort of things you'd expect it to be able to be spent on, but it would be nice if I had more options outside of upgrading units, buying out construction costs, and obtaining techs through osmosis events. At the moment, there doesn't seem to be much incentive to actually pursue trade as interesting playstyle. It's very one dimensional at the moment, I feel.

  2. Diplomacy - I both like and dislike the diplomacy in the game. It feels dynamic, but at times perhaps a bit too dynamic. I like the fact that empires are reacting to things I am doing on the map, and choices I'm making. But I feel like I don't always understand why, and that's important to me. If I am expected to engage in a system that is, at the end of the day, going to be the driving force behind emergent gameplay, I need to be able to understand the dynamics that exist and how new ones emerge as reactions to my choices. Right now, I don't. I am also not sure about the demand/renounce system. I'm on the fence about it. I never feel like, when I make a demand, I'm doing so with enough information to have made a judgement call in my head as to whether the AI is likely to accept of refuse my demands. Because demands affect the relative war desire of other empires, it's something I need to be able to get a read on before I really commit to demanding something, and at the moment, I feel like I have no real way of determining how likely or unlikely another empire is of accepting or refusing my demands. Now, one thing I really like is the trait and personality system. This is a very useful way to contextualize what players can expect the AI to do at a strategic level; however, not always as useful in reactions to human player choices.

  3. Fame/Culture - Personally, I love the fame/culture system present in Humankind, especially the fame system. In games like Civ 6 (or any of the Civs), engagement with the various systems and yields was not encouraged, and this is reflected in the design of those game's various cultures and civilizations. You are meant to pick a yield, specialize in it and by around turn 150 to 200 you have a pretty good idea of whether or not you're going to be able to "moar science" your way to victory. The fame system encourages player engagement in the various yields and systems present in Humankind because it presents a victory condition spread across multiple yields. You can't win a game on higher difficulty JUST going for scient fame or JUST going for districts. You really have to engage the development of your empires across multiple areas and yields and I really, really enjoy that about the game. The cultures themselves I have no particular comments about. I like 'em all! 

  4. Pacing - I haven't played enough games yet to get a good feel for this, but I'm suspecting the goal here is to get players to engage in interesting choices around WHEN to advance to the next era: when it is time to stop collecting fame in one era and move on to the next. So far, it seems relatively fine, but the transition from Medieval to Early Modern was... fast... too fast, I think. It felt like I got a good amount of time in previous eras to really soak in the uniqueness of my chosen culture, but I didn't necessarily feel that was the case in later eras. Again, I need to play through the game more times to really see how pacing plays out, so I think my first few times may not necessarily be indicative of how I will experience the pacing every time I sit down to play a game of Humankind. All of that to say, if you end up lengthening game end from 300 turns to 400 or 500 turns, I would highly, highly advise you to flesh out the tech tree and civics panel with more things to research. 

  5. Combat - As I've said, I have played all of Amplitude's games, so I know what I'm buying into when it comes to their games' combat. I feel sometimes, the randomness in the information presented to the player about the possible damage outcomes is not specific enough. A relative max damage of 30 and a minimum of 5 (as is so often the case), is too large a gap for me to be able to make tactical decisions effectively. It always feels like a gamble and it's a gamble you're forced to take. When you lose because the dice roll wasn't in your favor, it feels bad. And I'm saying this understanding how terrain and fortifications work. I'd like to see more done to narrow the gap between those maximum and minimum outcomes. 

  6. UI/Map Readability/Zoom - For the most part, I like the UI. It's not quite as stylized as something like Endless Space 2 but it feels appropriate for what Humankind is. I do think more could be done to help direct players' attention toward where to find specific things in the interface. I think you have a lot of "buttons" that you've eliminated because you've made the decision to put the information those buttons would have given into another button. You've consolidated the display of information instead of opting for detailed representation of the game's various systems/mechanical information. That's fine, but you could do a better job of explaining, for instance, exactly all the information that exists within the button to bring up your civics. As for map readability and zoom (because I see these as related), I do not think it is very good at the moment. The scale of things seems way off. The units are way too big, the geographic features like clay or marsh are way too small and difficult to see. And when you layer FIDSI icons on top of that, it's even more of a mess. I am constantly having to zoom in and out and in and out again because the zoom level I need to be at to be able to distinguish between various things is all over the place. I think this needs some major work. Perhaps consider spreading those geographic features over two or three hexes instead of just one, carry the yield bonuses over but tweak the relative values so players can't exploit the clay industry across three tiles but get the same value the old one tile used to give spread across three tiles and then make the clay visually larger on the map. 

  7. Science/Civics - Pretty cool! I think the tech tree could do with a few more technologies, honestly. Cost seems to be scaling and based off of number of techs previously researched. That is, every time you research one, the relative cost goes up for your next tech. I might be wrong about this, but the cost scaling royally screwed me in my second game in the medieval era. The civics are also cool but I would like to know how/when they show up. I actually am not a big fan of them just happening organically. For people who like to roleplay and who like engage in min/max (and I'm not one of those people) the random element of the civics is going to feel bad.

  8. Faith - This was a really underwhelming thing for me. Faith isn't interesting, it isn't dynamic. It is simply a way to supplement your yields. I didn't get to the fourth tenet in either of my games, so maybe there is some cool and new interesting things at that tenet level, but tenet levels 1 through 3 were just +5 to gold or +5 to influence. Not interesting. I also have no understanding of how it is spread or propagates to other cities and empires. I think more can and should be done to make this a more interesting system that aren't just +Number to This Yield.

  9. Influence on Territory - I have no idea how this works. I can see the numbers, I can see what other empires are influencing my territory, but I have no idea where those numbers come from, what all is determining their value, and what I can do, if anything, to counteract another empire's influence on my territory. It needs to be explained and presented better. 
                                                                                  
  10. Performance - As soon as I hit around turn 100 in both of my games, the frame rate absolutely tanked. There is no reason the hardware in my computer, both a powerful CPU and GPU and 32 GBs of RAM, should not be able to handle this game past turn 100 at 60 fps or above. I hit turn 100, it drops from 60+ to -30. I hope further optimizations are planned, because if the game were to be released now as it is, it would be a disappointment in the realm of performance.

    That's it for now! Now... on to my next game! :)
Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 12:37:46 PM

Here are some thoughts that don't fit neatly in other threads:


1. EUs could use another balance pass. There is a lot to consider here, but the general idea is that the "perfect" unit has high combat strength, fills a gap in the roster, comes early in the tech tree, and has low resource cost. EUs in practice probably shouldn't do all of these though or they will be too strong. Some units do this better than others. The rarer the resource that you need, and the further in the tech tree the unit is, the stronger they need to be. This is a problem for units like Paretorians, because Iron is actually quite difficult to get. Further, they only replace a unit that everyone gets in the classical era rather than filling a gap (warriors), and ends up facing off against medieval tech units. Compare to the Saṃnāhya, which requires no resource, fills a gap between archers and crossbows, and comes at the mounted warfare tech. Your available resources should be something you consider if you intend to produce EUs, but I found that, in both Lucy and Victor, Iron in particular was very difficult to get, which really lessens the value of iron-based EUs. Likewise, EUs near the end of the tree in any given era are lower value because not only do they come later, but they are balanced against same-era units when they will largely be fighting next-era units.


2. Expansionist cultures are still bad. Too hard to generate expansionist stars relative to other stars, and their ability is still the worst by far. I'm not sure what the devs envision as the use case for this. Beyond the early game, it is rare to find outposts that aren't immediately integrated into cities, the 5 turns takes a long time, expansionist cultures don't typically have a lot of gold, and no one in their right mind will give open borders to an expansionist. I feel like expansionists  should get bonuses to war willingness (or w/e it is called) and their ability should let them generate claims on neighboring territory, perhaps at the cost of influence. Expansionists are also a bit all over the place in terms of focus. Not to pick on Rome too much, but I would never spend the time building their EQ. And then I look at the EQ of Spain, Teutons, Russia, Assyria... and they all just seem too situational (though perhaps some of these would be better if the AI had a better religion game.)  


3. Mid-game Expansionists have a heavy focus on... faith? This ties into my point above. In general I think there is too much focus on religion with expansionists, I'd like to see expansionists that do other things. Ottomans are probably the worst culture in the game. Please give them a trait that is actually useful. In the early game you have the Assyrians, Achamenids, and Romans. While you can debate the relative strength of these cultures, it is obvious how their abilities tie into expansionist gameplay. Then you start getting Teutons, Ottomans, Spanish, and Russians, all of which have EQs that provide faith. I understand how this fits in with the history of these given cultures, but it doesn't play at all into expansionist gameplay, and the religion game seems to be pretty much over by the time these EQs become available. (The exception here I would argue is the teutons, who have a more obvious case: conquer territories to spread your state religion, which increases your science and money yields)


3. Money is too good in Victor. It was good in Lucy too, but overlooked I think because of how production was. With changes from Lucy, money is now much better than production. Money is always good in these games because it is effectively production that can be used anywhere at any time. I found that even compared to a city that was almost entirely production focused in good production terrain, gold focus outperforms it pretty significantly. I could purchase a few constructibles every turn, whereas producing later game infrastructure would take 3-5 turns. Anyone who picked Carthage in particular is going to snowball if they've focused gold. Please nerf Carthage to like 30% (or less) reduction lol


4. Influence scaling is weird. I feel like I desperately need influence for maybe the first 20 turns or so after my first city comes up, and then some stuff happens, and I basically ignore it the rest of the game except for wonders. I don't really have any insight into this. Maybe increase influence costs significantly for outposts further away from your capital? One of my criticisms of Lucy was that it felt like territories were claimed very early. While this is much harder to do now, it does feel like pretty much everything has been claimed by the start of the classical era, which is pretty much where Lucy was at as well. I've also managed to 3-star influence in pretty much every era of every game without picking an Aesthete. It basically eliminates the need to ever pick a whole subset of cultures, including non-aesthete cultures that have an influence focus like the Venetians.


5. Can't eliminate other players. I'm not sure why this was put in, but part of the genre is the ability to eliminate other players. They lose all their territory? Too bad, so sad, that's part of the game. No reason to stop the player from annexing an enemy's final city. The way war works in this game means you really have to mess up to get completely eliminated, it's not like anyone gets steamrolled in a single war. Let me take the AI's last territory.


5.5: Abuse case with wars. Whittle down an opponent to one city with a lot of attached territory. Declare war. End war demanding reparations and leaving city and territory intact. Get lots of money and expansionist stars (cause you get progress when you conquer the city and attached territory, even if you don't hold it). Repeat.


6. Ending Wars and Territory Labels. Same complaint as Lucy. I can't tell what territory I'm demanding when trying to take it after a war. This is a basic QOL feature.


7. Fame. Loved it before, still love. I think it just needs some tweaking with how fast you can generate score, and when the AI chooses to advance eras.


8. Cultural influence. I can see that sometimes my culture has influenced another territory (or someone else's culture my territory). It doesn't really seem to have any effect beyond generating grievances. I'd like to see more interactions with this, like ways to peacefully flip cities, perhaps if you are an aesthete.


9. Alliances with AI. Maybe it was the difficulty, but it felt like the AI never wanted an alliance. Could just be me or my playstyle though.


10. AI seems quite aggressive. Higher difficulty may be related, but they really like to dogpile you. I found if one enemy declared on me, I'd have one to two others breathing down my neck the next turn. I'm not sure if its a problem or not yet, as the player should be challenged, but it does seem to lead to the AI chronically underdeveloping cities in favor of massive armies. I will say that trying to kill stacks of immortals/hoplites/Saṃnāhya at turn 35 is not particularly enjoyable though.


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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 1:29:14 PM

I unfortunately missed the Lucy Opendev, so this was my first experience with the game. In terms of 4x games, I generally play Civ VI and Endless Legend, so I figured there would be similar features to Endless Legend. I have played the game twice so far, and feel like I have gotten a good first impression.


Positives

  • The first thing that struck me was the game is absolutely beautiful. I love the design, the graphics, and the map.
  • Besides the ancient era, I had a tough time deciding between several of the cultures to try out, which means they all probably have a decent balance and enjoyment.
  • The battle system and stacking armies was something I enjoyed from endless legend, but not the actual combat itself. Humankind did a really good job of taking what was good from Endless Legend and leaving out the negatives.
  • The idea of a grievance/demand system for war support and war score is really enjoyable as well as the idea of having vassalization.
  • I was overall a fan of the district mechanics to this game, and did really enjoy to have such a sprawling city at the end game.
  • Even with playing the same map twice, I felt that I played two very different games, meaning there is a nice level of variability.
  • Lastly, and a bit more subjective, this game had the "I'll just play for 30 more minutes...oh wait when did it become 3 am" feel, making me feel like this game is almost ready for release.
Negatives
  • I agree with many of the other comments on the pacing of the game. The 150 turn cap really hurts the testing ability. I always feel like I am rushing to get to the next era without just taking the time to maximize the era I am currently in. The eras themselves also feel like they go by way too quickly. If am normally a standard speed player, but if this is the standard speed, I have a feeling I may be playing more games on epic.
  • Because of the speed, I felt that there were just too many things to build. After two approaches, the best approach felt like focusing on districts in the early game (with a couple of relevant buildings) then switching to buildings when the land is filling out, but by the time the game ended, I probably only built like 1/3 of the available buildings. The game might use a trimming of some of the buildings, but overall it would just be better if you spent a longer time in each era.
  • The religion system was a bit confusing. Both games I played, I was able to get polytheism or shamanism and four tenants, but I was unable to get a structured religion like catholicism, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, etc. I saw in the livestream on Thursday that this was possible, but I could not figure out how to get it. In addition while I enjoyed that religion gameplay was passive at its core (compared to the active religious gameplay in Civ VI), but it is a little too passive to the point where it almost felt unimportant. 
  • I did not like that the city center only exploits food and industry. One of my favorite parts of endless legend was identifying the right place to settle not only for food and production, but for the anomolies as well. Because city centers now only exploit food and industry and districts to exploit other yields do not come into play until the classical era (besides artisan quarters), it felt like the cultures that gave yields besides those two were much stronger. 
  • The natural wonders (while cool features), did not feel like they offered too much in terms of yields and bonuses.
  • The forced surrender screen was very confusing. Everything (things going to me or the A.I.) were listed as give and it further did not help that it listed the territory names and not the city names. I was essentially guessing which territory contained the correct city.
  • I didn't really know how to unlock the civics but this seems like something the devs are already addressing.
  • I feel like the vassalization mechanic can be fleshed out a bit. It would be interesting to see once you enter the later industrial and contemporary era (where colonization and vassals are frowned upon in the world) if it begins to hurt your diplomatic relationships with other cultures.

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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 1:48:20 PM

I will have to agree with most fo the sentiment regarding pacing - the early eras go by too fast. Since you don't have the industry and infrastructure set up to make use of you EQ and EU they don't matter much. Some of them come far too late in the tech tree, meaning that by the time you unlock them the era is basically over. Staying in the era for longer is an option sure, but the game is not clear at communicating this is a viable option or not.


I feel the AI is a bit to easy to play around diplomatically. I managed an entire game without a single war, and by the end I was allied to the entire map. They never dragged me into their wars, and I didn't really have to pick a side either. Even the "traitor" AIs never so much as threathened me after our relationships had gotten about 30 turns to warm up. I never built military after the classical era, and could focus my entire economy on snowballing. It felt like friendships were zero maitnenace after they have been established, and I only really engaged with most of the system beyond signing treaties the first 50 turns or so.


Phonecians + Carthagians combo is far to strong. After you get the civic that lets you use money instead of influence for terretory managment, influence ceased to matter (I still somehow dominated the continent though). This was on standard difficulty.

Finally, I feel that growing cities is far to tedious. The counts needed for builder stars are far to high to be worth the effort. I think having fewer, more impactful districts would be better. Also, when building more quarters, I felt that terrain elevation should matter a bit more - I stopped seeing terrain and only began thinking about yields.

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 5:41:30 PM
A few quality of life improvements could be implemented;

1. Faster animation slider option same as in combat but for non combat movements
2. Building/Unit Queue: The Queue and Buyout should not be separate toggles but show queue time and buyout numbers on same page (show as much info as possible with 1 page rather than toggles)
3. Faster WASD keyboard / mouse cursor to edge of screen panning camera movement sensitivity slider

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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 5:56:16 PM
aexisix wrote:
A few quality of life improvements could be implemented;

1. Faster animation slider option same as in combat but for non combat movements
2. Building/Unit Queue: The Queue and Buyout should not be separate toggles but show queue time and buyout numbers on same page (show as much info as possible with 1 page rather than toggles)
3. Faster WASD keyboard / mouse cursor to edge of screen panning camera movement sensitivity slider

^^^ yes.

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 6:21:13 PM

I played one really short game, where I made a couple of bad decisions (boy, city placement is absolutely critical for the Zhou, or you're completely screwed), and now am a third of my way through the second playthrough, where a little knowledge has made it much easier!


First of all, I'm really enjoying this. It feels a lot more balanced, and the combat is much more fun than earlier opendevs - it seems just right now.


There's obviously a few bugs and oversights that will hopefully get fixed in QA - how has the slow scroll speed not driven your in house team absolutely mental?


The biggest issues so far seem to me to be that culture and religion seem very amorphous - it's not that clear what they're doing, it doesn't feel like you have much control over them, and it doesn't really feel fun at the moment. There needs to be some flavour to what's happening to draw people in (maybe more events will help?), but I don't really know or care where I should put my holy sites. Numbers seem to go up. That's... good? It doesn't feel at all like religion. I don't even understand anything to do with culture, but maybe this can be used to overcome some of the weaknesses around not being able to destroy other empires - to stop people cheesing other empires by just militarily destroying them, maybe they should have to be strong culturally as well?


Other than that, some good luck and strong combat in the neolithic period has made this second playthrough very easy. It's still fun, but I keep beasting my nearest two neighbours who have just left the Neolithic now I've well ensconced in the Classical. Not necessarily a problem, I could always turn the difficulty up.


Pacing seems decent, although I might enjoy slightly longer eras without correspondingly longer build times, Certainly not too off. I wouldn't want the only choice to be this or much longer. Ransacking seems slightly too long, but better than instantaneous.

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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 6:56:16 PM

Just as I did after the Stadia OpenDev, I want to share my list of notes I made during my first playthrough of this OpenDev. I was very glad to see many things I noted back then improved by now, but there are some things I listed before and will list here again.

Overall I was quite satisfied with the OpenDev, but feel like there are many things yet to be optimised. Which is to be expected at this point in time, I guess. Oh, and playing on Metropolis difficulty felt way too easy for the default difficulty, but maybe that’s okay if higher difficulties are really challenging. I need to test that.

I’ll list my major gripes first and then continue with things thematically bundled together:


Most important things

– Map scroll speed with keyboard still seems too slow, especially when zoomed out (speed could be made an adjustable option). Scrolling with WASD (or whatever the default keybinding was) is very tedious and almost impractical.

– If a tile is exploited, but not all of its FIMS, there needs to be a way to show the unexploited FIMS on the map. Currently the only way is to hover, for example, a Research Quarter over an adjacent tile to see if there would be any neighbouring FIMS to be exploited. I find this essential for planning the placement of your quarters.

– Adjacency bonuses from buildings (such as Artisans Quarters or cultures’ emblematic quarters) need to be visible in a tooltip after they are built. Again, essential for quarter planning.

– There absolutely needs to be a notification when an outpost is idle. I cannot count the number of times I forgot to build an Artisans Quarter in an outpost.

– It’s minor nitpicking, but still annoys me: You use two consecutive hyphens (--) a lot instead of an en or em dash (–). Maybe I am just not familiar with the kind of style guide where that is recommended practice, but to me it looks horrible. It is acceptable if you cannot type any dashes, like on a typewriter, but in any other case that looks really unprofessional to me, sorry.


City

– Completed Shared Projects are not displayed as Last Construction

– Is a stability of 90 % Strained or Settled? It apparently is Strained, but tooltips are unclear (“between 30 % and 90 %” and “above 90 %”).

– What is Base Value for Stability, how is it calculated? It is great to see at a glance if you have spare Stability to “spend” (negative Base Value), i.e. to be able to build more quarters without a stability loss, but hiding that behind Base Value it is not very clear, especially if there is sometimes a positive base value that I have no idea of where it comes from.

– Completed ceremonies (especially Parade) need to be visible.

– An overview of the total number of individual terrains in a city would be very helpful for deciding whether building something that gives every Woodland +2 Industry, for example, would be worthwhile. As exploited terrain is not easily identifiable from the map, hovering over every tile and looking at the tooltip for the terrain type is very tedious.


Outpost

– Outpost Relocation needs to show complete sum of FIMS at new location in the tooltip, just as Outpost Creation does.

– The FIMS preview for a new outpost and suggested locations would be helpful even if you do not have enough Influence to build one.

– The trading post label overlaps the FIMS preview for a new outpost, so you cannot see how much FIMS that location would produce.

– City Creation does not list the Influence cost if you have enough Influence.


Diplomacy & Trade

– In the Diplomacy screen a list of all opponents to click on would be helpful, so you can quickly switch between players while, for example, not leaving the Trade tab.

– Maybe the War Support tooltip should be explaining what it is. You get the explanation in a tutorial, but that was for me dozens of rounds after wondering what exactly War Support might be.

– Shouldn’t it be possible to withdraw a single demand rather than either all at once or none?

– There is no way to see how much money you would need to import a Luxury Resource that a Merchant culture can sell to you if you currently do not have enough money.

– An overview of all Trade Routes is lacking; important for Knowledge Authorities (Foreign Innovations) civic, for example.


Civics

– In the Civics Osmosis popup you cannot see the effect of your current civic, so you have to enter the Civics Screen to properly compare the two options. You also cannot see the exact effect Defiant would have on the city.

– Land Rights (Inherited Land) civic suggests that spending money instead of influence would be optional (“allows”) instead of mandatory.


Various

– Too much clicking at culture selection. When a culture is expanded, clicking on another or using the Previous/Next buttons should open the new culture expanded as well.

– An indicator as to which era your opponents are in would be helpful in the Fame overview tooltip. You can guess on the basis of the achieved era stars and points, but you cannot be sure.

– Technology Screen should show Industry cost for constructibles.

– From the tooltips it is not clear whether effects from Cultural Wonders are empire-wide, or if they only affect the city it is built in.

– For how many rounds are effects from Praise & Bribe on minor factions active?

– Which penalties would apply if you are over your City Cap? Would be helpful to know beforehand.

– Curiosity Collected notification shows name of curiosity (i.e. Nuts), but really should show effect (i.e. +10 Food).

– When occupying a tile with a Sanctuary, the Ransack button should immediately select that tile to ransack without you needing to click on it again.

– Grand Planners (Egyptian unique trait) gives +1 Industry on every Exploitation, not just every District as tooltip says.

– Show primary Quarter output needs a keybinding.

– When zoomed out, curiosity terrain is hard to spot on tiles without vision.

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 26, 2021, 6:57:29 PM

Been playing since the drop and am absolutely loving it. I think the pacing has been substantially improved (although there may still be room for improvement) and I think the stability penalties on quarters was a good idea for this reason. It also makes sense to me that sprawl happens more once the commons quarter is researched as it typically is during a point in time where populations would have been booming and industrialization is just around the corner. 


I think my biggest gripe is that I want a more detailed breakdown in my economy window, I don't currently know how much money is coming from influence, passive trade (which I think is meant to be a source but am unsure), etc. Would love to pinpoint how much I am making from routes so I know whether or not certain merchant cultures would be a good fit. 


The exploits for the horde factions have likely already been listed somewhere so I just want to put a spotlight on a different culture that I'm not 100% sure is overpowered but I'm concerned might be: Olmecs. That early passive influence gain is ssstttrrrroooonnnggg


Additionally, I always seem to get my special unit just before I transition to a new culture. This is something of a double-edged sword because I want to play with them in the era I pick that culture but it's also really cool having the opportunity to mix them with the next cultures unit that I get...if I can get it before the other one is no longer relevant


The progress the open dev shows reminds me why Amplitude is one of my favorite developers and shows they really do listen and care about the end product. Keep up the good work, we are all here to support you.

Updated 3 years ago.
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3 years ago
Apr 27, 2021, 2:16:19 AM

So I already did 5 playthroughs of the Victor OpenDev. I know it's not really a first impression since I've played it several times already, but I can't find a thread that I can put my general impressions of the game so far. So, I'll just put it here, if the mods don't mind.


Just a disclosure that I haven't played the Lucy one as much as Victor because of medical circumstances (I had one of my wisdom teeth removed. During Christmas). I played it three times before it's end, so the improvements section of this feedback might feel a bit off. Like I said, I played Victor 5 times now and I intend to play some more as much as possible. :)

  • Improvements and Good Stuff

-    The UI this time is clearer and more streamlined, especially the battle UI. I especially like the UI that tells you you are about to cross a river, the side UI that tells you if you're close to earning a star, and that your culture's EU is indicated in the tech tree.

-    A major improvement, and one that I've been annoyed about since I was able to play the civics screen, is the slider. It's so much clearer where you are in the slider and what bonuses you get. Hovering over a civics choice will move the slider along the spectrum, and that is very helpful. 

-     The trade section in the diplomacy screen better illustrates where your exports are heading to and where your imports are coming in

-    I like the stats screen at the end of the game

  • Criticisms and Glitches

 -   I can't find the region names whenever a notification tells me something is happening to a certain region, or whenever I am on the diplomacy screen I couldn't really recognize what region I'm negotiating on or what region the grievance is.

-    Sometimes whenever I click on a notification for a treaty from another empire I've never met yet, it skips the introduction and gets on with the negotiation. I don't know if it's a glitch or on purpose, but it feels a bit off.

-    The "culture chosen" notification is a bit confusing and vague. Whenever I try to locate the empire whose culture just changed, it led me to the culture selection screen rather than the culture in question. It also says, for example, “’Huns’ have reached the classical era into ‘Huns’”.

-    It would have been better if the stats screen at the end would be a bit faster.

-    Even though I've played Civilization multiple times, I feel that Humankind is better without a calendar. Usually, in Civ, I try to play catch up with the calendar so that I go from one era to the next in the same way in real history. However, when I played the Lucy OpenDev, I feel more relaxed knowing I can transition eras without any concern whether or not that transition is off (like going into Early Modern in 1500 rather than 50 CE). I hope there will be an option to turn it off.

-     At some point I'm prompted to choose an irreligion civic, especially when my religion is the largest in the game... which doesn't make sense. I think a few historical steps have been skipped there. I hope the trigger for that civic choice would be fixed.

-     I'm quite disappointed that I can no longer attach districts to resource extractors, garrisons or harbours; it would have been nice to make coastal/resource focused towns

-     Why do independent people hate me? I tried to give them influence and money but they still see me as distrustful. Isn't it that when you give them lots of stuff they'll like you more? The ideology alignment is great, don't get me wrong. However I feel that there's something hidden there that prevents me from them viewing me more favourably, and I hope that gets fixed. Or maybe that's just me.


One final major point, I would say, and I would echo what has been said previously, is the pacing. For me, there are parts when the pacing is good. For example, in my last three playthroughs, I experimented with getting industrial tech and reaching the Early Modern period. Alas, I wasn't able to reach Early Modern before turn 149. In some ways, it's because my strategies and choices haven't been good, but (correct me if I'm wrong) if a normal game ends in 300 turns then I feel that the pacing to simulate history more or less is okay. There is that one caveat of technically ending the game with technology from the 60's. 


In other parts, however, the pacing isn't good. I can see this especially in how I can't build my EU for my culture - or even create a proper standing army - until I'm at the cusp of transitioning from one era to the next. Production can be quite expensive at times, and I wouldn't have time to use my unit before I transition because of that. 


Overall, like I said in previous OpenDevs, this feels like a complete game already, and props to the Amplitude team for that! However I feel some fine-tuning should be made so that the game might become better. Keep up the good work as always!

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3 years ago
Apr 27, 2021, 10:14:21 PM

As a first impression, this game is really promising so far! I just wish a few things. First, I hope the region mechanic can be changed to something else as it never makes any sense to me in any strategy games. Region should never be defined from the start and expanded from nation instead. Settling things should also not be limited to create much more interesting situations. even though it may sacrifice game balance and maybe too chaotic for some other players.

To the contrary of some players, I actually like having an aggressive AI as it makes 4X games much more engaging. However, I do wish that the AI is not suicidal and doesn't engage if their units have lower strength than mine. I only made it 2 hours in, so I can't really judge the AI and other aspects.

Sadly, I don't think I can push my laptop to run this game anymore. Even on the fastest graphical setting and 720p resolution in the span of 2 sessions with one hour/session, I can only get 20 FPS at most and my laptop heats really bad, potentially hurting the performance in the long run. I thought if I could run Endless Space 2 decently, I could run this game as well, but turns out I was wrong. Here's my specification for those interested:
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-1065G7 CPU @ 1.30GHz, 1498 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 8 Logical Processor(s)
GPU NVIDIA GeForce MX250
RAM 8 GB
OS Windows 10 Home

Endless Space 2 was a really great game for me, so I really hope you can pull this out Amplitude!

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