Hero diversity

ZenTractor

Mirror Chameleon

29 400g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 22, 2015, 3:37:10 AM

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales wrote:
If you have any specific skills of the Flying skill tree in mind, I'd love to hear your opinion. Since I'll be working on heroes for my mod project anyway, I might as well do some rebalancing along the way.

I suspect a lot of the issue is in contextual strength. All flying units are melee, so they should have a weakness there, but since they can all attack up cliffs and fly over them, and can move over forests without issue that problem is mitigated heavily. Furthermore, the only weapon in the game with Flying Slayer is the longbow. And a good portion of the good flying units (looking at you, demons) have axes which make them good at killing their own counter units. A army that is composed of a single unit type should be reasonably easy to counter, but as the game stands it's hard to do.

If someone made an army of only ranged units, a cavalry heavy army with some flyers should beat it. If someone had only cavalry, then infantry guarding a few archers should win cost-for-cost.

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

9 years ago

Oct 6, 2016, 7:31:54 PM

Capt.TeddyBear wrote:
Hi Larco,

Sorry to say this but this is what is wrong with the gaming industry today. Stuff that should be core to the game being sold as an add-on.

What about all the people who do not have a spare 10€ missing out on what should be included in the base game, even if it is now extra to what was in the original base game.

There are some brilliant game mechanincs in this game, but there are also some very bad deficiencies which should be addressed without charge. I hope that Game2Gether does not become another one of those companies that does not fix the base mechanincs and/or makes someone pay to have it fixed.

hello Capt.TeddyBear

I understand what you try to point out but Amplitude studios has on multiple occasions said that they don't have the time or the funds to do additional skins for each faction.

And maybe I am wrong regarding the fact that a payed DLC for addional heroes would be worth it but we will see.

also my original quote regarding the possiblity of a payed DLC was before Amplitude Studios joined the SEGA "family" currently they might have the funds for more heroes without it being payed, but I don't know to which extend they are involved with each other.

Capt.TeddyBear

Newcomer

Capt.TeddyBear

Newcomer

1 300g2g pts

9 years ago

Oct 1, 2016, 9:17:47 PM

Lorco wrote:
Its been a while since I posted this thread but as a question to anybody reading this would anybody be interested in getting more hero diversity through DLC?
don't really know how much this would be but maybe one of the devs could make a vague estimate if they could.

I would be buy such a DLC if its around the price of 10€.
anybody else interested?

Hi Larco,

Sorry to say this but this is what is wrong with the gaming industry today. Stuff that should be core to the game being sold as an add-on.

What about all the people who do not have a spare 10€ missing out on what should be included in the base game, even if it is now extra to what was in the original base game.

There are some brilliant game mechanincs in this game, but there are also some very bad deficiencies which should be addressed without charge. I hope that Game2Gether does not become another one of those companies that does not fix the base mechanincs and/or makes someone pay to have it fixed.

Capt.TeddyBear

Newcomer

Capt.TeddyBear

Newcomer

1 300g2g pts

9 years ago

Oct 1, 2016, 10:34:56 AM

Hi all,

In my view the hero system as it is now is illogical and suffers because you can just get 'anyone' from any race/species. Nah, not good.

There should be tensions between races/species. Everyone should not love everyone. There should be certain races/species that will never see eye to eye and as such you cannot obtain a hero of that race/species.

I would actually prefer that I can only have heroes of my own race/species as 'heroes' are historically (real life) only from that empire or a very close ally. A vaulter having a Necrophage hero goes against all common sense.

Buzzkillington1990

United Empire

Why eat now what could one day grow into a feast?

Buzzkillington1990

United Empire

35 900g2g pts

9 years ago

Aug 27, 2016, 6:21:52 PM

Lorco wrote:
Its been a while since I posted this thread but as a question to anybody reading this would anybody be interested in getting more hero diversity through DLC?
don't really know how much this would be but maybe one of the devs could make a vague estimate if they could.

I would be buy such a DLC if its around the price of 10€.
anybody else interested?

I've been asking for this since before the Forgotten were released. It just feels a little silly that all Vaulter Heroes, for example, are Ranged. So I'm all in favor of this as well.

VIPicarus86

VIP

https://www.flickr.com/photos/icarus86

VIPicarus86

VIP

28 600g2g pts

9 years ago

Aug 12, 2016, 7:56:12 AM

Lorco wrote:
Its been a while since I posted this thread but as a question to anybody reading this would anybody be interested in getting more hero diversity through DLC?
don't really know how much this would be but maybe one of the devs could make a vague estimate if they could.

I would be buy such a DLC if its around the price of 10€.
anybody else interested?

Count me in.

More content is always welcome for EL ^^

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

9 years ago

Aug 11, 2016, 4:06:23 PM

Its been a while since I posted this thread but as a question to anybody reading this would anybody be interested in getting more hero diversity through DLC?

don't really know how much this would be but maybe one of the devs could make a vague estimate if they could.

I would be buy such a DLC if its around the price of 10€.

anybody else interested?

Kingsguard

Old Fanatic

Winter is coming.

Kingsguard

Old Fanatic

24 500g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 27, 2015, 9:28:24 PM

Nasarog wrote:
All I've been asking for is a way to change their names. Quest related heroes have their names locked, but non-quest heroes should either have a name randomization built in, or we should be able to change them.

I'm tired of the clones.

I remember they said they would do something about it after the game was released, during the alpha.

Seems they forgot about it... Like so many other things

VIPNasarog

Analyzer Officer

I know nothing. To learn more, come visit us @ eXplorminate.net

VIPNasarog

Analyzer Officer

38 700g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 27, 2015, 3:13:45 PM

All I've been asking for is a way to change their names. Quest related heroes have their names locked, but non-quest heroes should either have a name randomization built in, or we should be able to change them.

I'm tired of the clones.

Trynstark

Path Finder

Biotic Squad.

Trynstark

Path Finder

35 600g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 26, 2015, 8:42:04 PM

I read every post on this thread and yeah more diversity = more fun

but I have a request, it would be awesome if the diversity isn't just change the class of the champ I want choose between a male hero and a female, I know , It's ridiculous but my pref faction is Forgotten and love everything about them, the design can be awesome on a male hero, the female is already perfect

thanks for the awesome game i'm still learning it but I already love it.

DEVwilbefast

Lost Dev

Something is afoot at the end of my leg!

DEVwilbefast

Lost Dev

37 000g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 25, 2015, 9:37:36 AM

Lorco wrote:
to start to the developers I really like the hero system and the heroes available right now.

but is it just me or is there a lack in diversity for each "race to hero" selection.

With this I mostly mean that I would expect maybe also roving clans hero who are "cavalry" and not only "ranged".

only 2 different classes for each race would be enough I think but other wise it seems a bit a waste of making a skill tree for each race if there isn't some combination possibilities.

are there plans to introduce this kind of variation later on in a future update?

I agree this would be nice

The limiting factor is the cost to produce the assets. We have 9 factions now, so that means 9 new heroes or somebody is going to feel left-out. Even assuming we use the same mesh for the variations we'd need animations for the new weapon types. It adds up pretty quickly. We made the decision early-on to have only one hero type per faction but let you hire any other faction's heroes. In keeping with this philosophy we'd rather add new unique heroes to the overall roster rather than filling out each faction's base heroes. Hence the Sister Of Mercy hero we're adding

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

10 years ago

Sep 22, 2015, 3:53:35 PM

Jojo_Fr wrote:
- It's not hard to create smart skills. For exemple, we could image a skill which open the power to command to a unit to don't move when it's his turn, and wait for the ennemy (usefull for claws fight back, for exemple). Or a skill which permit, three times per combat, to switch unit position whatever their initiative (the unit from front, take the place of an unit behind it, like in roman legions), opening by that the possibilty to have a front ligne which you could refresh with fresh troops from behind.

it is possible to have a unit not move it's the hold position mode on the left side of the screen when you select the unit you have an option between offensive defensive and the hold position. (just to avoid additional comments on this; yes, you can also choose this before the battle but this is an option for during battle I am not confusing anything)

Jojo_Fr

Pro

Jojo_Fr

Pro

22 900g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 22, 2015, 1:12:09 PM

- Off course, I am for more heros diversity. More diversity = more decision making, more gameplay intelligence, more replayability, more fun and more Endless Legend selling in long term I think.

lol

- It's not hard to create smart skills. For exemple, we could image a skill which open the power to command to a unit to don't move when it's his turn, and wait for the ennemy (usefull for claws fight back, for exemple). Or a skill which permit, three times per combat, to switch unit position whatever their initiative (the unit from front, take the place of an unit behind it, like in roman legions), opening by that the possibilty to have a front ligne which you could refresh with fresh troops from behind.

- The battlefield possibilty is not enough used and could be largely more interesting, for a tiny programmation cost I think (at contrary, creating new features, new graphism are great but are costly in ressources).

- About the flying hero, one flying hero is enough. I am for suppress the speed boost too, because the speed in EL is already a broken feature, which should be nerfed (as proposed by Natev), and controled by players (with zone of control and zone of speed reduction, gave by towers, for exemple, to avoid the cavalery/flyers city sniping).

- The market place of hero is too simplist and it's a waste of time to all examine. I think it should be more automationned (I just want a notification when new hero are hero) because now it's not fun to use.

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

10 years ago

Sep 20, 2015, 4:32:33 PM

to start to the developers I really like the hero system and the heroes available right now.

but is it just me or is there a lack in diversity for each "race to hero" selection.

With this I mostly mean that I would expect maybe also roving clans hero who are "cavalry" and not only "ranged".

only 2 different classes for each race would be enough I think but other wise it seems a bit a waste of making a skill tree for each race if there isn't some combination possibilities.

are there plans to introduce this kind of variation later on in a future update?

many thanks because of developing endless legend.

natev

Newcomer

natev

Newcomer

200g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 9:56:47 PM

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales wrote:
If you have any specific skills of the Flying skill tree in mind, I'd love to hear your opinion. Since I'll be working on heroes for my mod project anyway, I might as well do some rebalancing along the way.

If my opinion is of any use, I snatch up Tarosh whenever I can and level him for +2/+4 flying unit movement ASAP. I don't find the rest of the tree unbalancing, but +4 strategic movement, on units that are already 6 MP fliers (as a rule, always Demons or Haunts) means that I explore the entire map in a matter of turns and can completely control the map. Reinforce one city? No problem, I'll just take this other city that's 14 tiles away (with the equally powerful T3 expansion empire plan).

This high speed, in fact, is part of what allows Tarosh to level so quickly through ruins and parleys.

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 5:37:19 PM

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales wrote:
Again, that is not a problem inherent with the basic concept of a flying hero, it is a problem with balancing. Make some of those flying hero skills more reasonable, and perhaps introduce some more combat-related traits on the faction side to make different combinations of class and faction meaningful, and we could be good to go.

If you have any specific skills of the Flying skill tree in mind, I'd love to hear your opinion. Since I'll be working on heroes for my mod project anyway, I might as well do some rebalancing along the way.

not a single of the skills is overpowered the problem is the combination of them all you just get a very buff heavy hero which is good in each situation.

I can't give details since I don't have any saves where I own the haunts guy but it like +2 reinforcements banner, a initiative buff, a siege trait, some movement I thought and a defence buff you should just try and get him in one of you games or the game files.

also doesn't help that the only flying hero has chain lightning and possiblities for better chain and/or disease.

VIPThe-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

Shifter

VIPThe-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

Shifter

58 400g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 5:07:06 PM

Lorco wrote:
the problem is more that the skill tree for flying heroes is very powerfull and having more of them might unbalance the game.

Again, that is not a problem inherent with the basic concept of a flying hero, it is a problem with balancing. Make some of those flying hero skills more reasonable, and perhaps introduce some more combat-related traits on the faction side to make different combinations of class and faction meaningful, and we could be good to go.

If you have any specific skills of the Flying skill tree in mind, I'd love to hear your opinion. Since I'll be working on heroes for my mod project anyway, I might as well do some rebalancing along the way.

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 4:07:43 PM

The-Cat-o-Nine-Tales wrote:
I'm fairly sure one of the GDDs way back before release implied that there would indeed be different combinations of race and class, and the interface still looks like there should be.

And I don't think a ready availability of Flying heroes should be an issue by itself. The problem is rather, in my opinion, that flying units in general have better stats than infantry and are only hampered by their often limited weapon selection. Flying units having better stats than infantry units on top of their better strategic and tactical movement is just too much rolled into one. They are more expensive, but I rarely found reason to use infantry over a flyer unless the infantry had a very useful capacity.

the problem is more that the skill tree for flying heroes is very powerfull and having more of them might unbalance the game.

VIPThe-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

Shifter

VIPThe-Cat-o-Nine-Tales

Shifter

58 400g2g pts

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 12:33:50 PM

I'm fairly sure one of the GDDs way back before release implied that there would indeed be different combinations of race and class, and the interface still looks like there should be.

And I don't think a ready availability of Flying heroes should be an issue by itself. The problem is rather, in my opinion, that flying units in general have better stats than infantry and are only hampered by their often limited weapon selection. Flying units having better stats than infantry units on top of their better strategic and tactical movement is just too much rolled into one. They are more expensive, but I rarely found reason to use infantry over a flyer unless the infantry had a very useful capacity.

Lorco

Senior Protector

Lorco

Senior Protector

10 years ago

Sep 21, 2015, 7:23:44 AM

if flying/cavalry heroes would be a problem then just don't add them. I just want there to be more to choosing heroes then just their race since the class is always the same.

also small question what is the main reason anybody ever buys the haunts hero because next to being the only flying hero in the game I also think he is probably the best science governor so I mostly buy him for the science.

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