I feel that there should be a middle ground here. There should be different severity ratings of planetary assault i.e. a general invasion/ occupation leaving much of the population and infrastructure to assimiliate into your empire. There should also be options to bombard or soften up the target to an extent from precision strikes to carpet bombing entire continents.



Perhaps the options could be like:



1) Hearts and minds - very precise invasion minimising civilian casualties and infrastructure damage - The slow way low diplomatic impact



2) Localised bombardment - Soften up large areas of resistance destroying some infrastructure and causing some civilian deaths - Avergae speed average diplomatic impact



3) Indescriminate attack - Deliberate attacks on infrastructure and population centres causing much damage to both - High speed - large diplomatic impact



4) Annihilate population - Massive orbital strikes levelling cities over the planet with extermination squads sent in to mop up - High speed - large diplomatic penalty, planet type changed to barren/ lava, massive infrastructure damage.



5) Destroy planet - Says it all really. Turn the planet into an asteriod belt - Huge diplomatic penalty, planet destroyed (late game tech for us genocidal types)

Aside from the more complicated options offered by improvEments being damaged by invasions (perhaps those same improvements should be damaged if someone invades but fails too?).......



I cannot see why anyone would want all the improvements reset after you invade when any number of them might actually be useful and therefore save you the time and resources to build. Unless I am looking at the wrong area, it only takes one to two seconds to remove them all anyway doesnt it?

I really like a lot of these ideas. They can be played like the space combat battle cards. Different options will be available depending on your tech and support mods on ships. Troop invasion (-to enemy population might need a dedicated troop transport ship), military bombardment (-to enemy ground resistance), civilian bombardment (-to enemy manufacturing and moral penalty as well as a diplomatic penalty). A bunch of different options would be nice. Conquering an entire solar system is not an easy or quick task that a few ships can do.

Randeng wrote:
When I take a star system from them, and i have to remove 15 improvements (3 clics for each one), it's really really boring!

They should just build in an auto demolish on right click feature or some such.

keleios wrote:
If the improvement has no effect for a system, they should not be an option to build in the first place.

Completely agree.

The majority of improvements should be removed certainly and the population should be really hit hard after an invasion. If you have to park an invasion fleet in a star system for game years of what is probably brutal fighting, there's very likely not going to be much of use left to the conquerors. This would also be another great way to slow down conquest and introduce more opportunity for war weariness.

The real issue here is not that the useless improvements exist in the system, but that useless improvements show up as an option to build at all for both players and the AI. I had a system with two jungle planets in it once and I think I had around 8 or 9 improvements that were totally useless cluttering up my build option panel. If the improvement has no effect for a system, they should not be an option to build in the first place.

I only have one arm...















































No i'm joking^^ Yes i never tried this but everytime i check if the improvement isn't removable for the star system or if i can keep it (but now, I almost know every improvement XD)

Randeng wrote:
When I take a star system from them, and i have to remove 15 improvements (3 clics for each one), it's really really boring!

That is an excessive amount of clicks. You can't ctrl-click to delete multiples at a time?

When I take a star system from them, and i have to remove 15 improvements (3 clics for each one), it's really really boring!

Improvements should be kept after an invasion, at least most of them (minus collateral damage from the ground war). I think loss of race specific improvements makes sense in addition to the basic collateral damage, although I could very easily see the opposing argument to that point. The whole beauty of capturing a colony instead of glassing it and replacing with your own new one is that it will be partially intact. It creates incentive to fight back and forth over certain strategic colonies since they maintain most of their value (although if changing hands repeatedly it would eventually degrade to a point where it becomes perhaps not valuable enough to bother with anymore). The encouragement of that type of back and forth colony invading is a piece of gameplay and strategy that I love and also one of the reasons I could not continue playing SotS.

You should definitely have the option to bombard a planet. There should be no question about that. (Though the defender might be able to prevent it through tech and buildings) I really like Sacru's idea to capture improvements. Give the invader the option to target specific locations. The more he targets the harder it is and the longer it takes to capture the whole planet. But if one particular building is a key objective, he might be able to secure it to prevent the scorched earth practice.



Destroying your own buildings should take time and some small amount of resources as well. Scotched earth strategies take forethought.



Also, if you get a building for a tech you do not have, it should either go inactive, or allow you to dismantle the building for reverse engineering giving a reasonable bonus towards researching the tech yourself.

I agree, plus option to send troops to invade planet

Sacru wrote:
My suggestions would be as below. Otherwise I would simply say 'yes' to make it harder to steam-roll everyone with a massive surprise fleet.



Though I'd say get the idea and expand on your options. Talking about options, you could even make capturing improvements (or anything similar to my below suggested ideas) advanced game options.

You should definitely have the option to bombard a planet. There should be no question about that. (Though the defender might be able to prevent it through tech and buildings) I really like Sacru's idea to capture improvements. Give the invader the option to target specific locations. The more he targets the harder it is and the longer it takes to capture the whole planet. But if one particular building is a key objective, he might be able to secure it to prevent the scorched earth practice.



Destroying your own buildings should take time and some small amount of resources as well. Scotched earth strategies take forethought.



Also, if you get a building for a tech you do not have, it should either go inactive, or allow you to dismantle the building for reverse engineering giving a reasonable bonus towards researching the tech yourself.

My suggestions would be as below. Otherwise I would simply say 'yes' to make it harder to steam-roll everyone with a massive surprise fleet.



Though I'd say get the idea and expand on your options. Talking about options, you could even make capturing improvements (or anything similar to my below suggested ideas) advanced game options.





Racial and/or tech based improvements:

1. Very specific improvements cannot be used by other races - if you invade someone of the same race, you can keep it. (could make certain improvements only available to certain races, OR have specific improvements that are otherwise available to all races racially locked to who built it, due to their biology/culture/tech type/something).

2. If you do not have the technology required for the improvement you lose it (permanently or maybe until you have the tech? incentive for specific research maybe?).



Different types of invasion:

1. Ground based invasion - high cost to the invader with minimal damage to structures. (could easily extend on this idea for military units in ships, adding a new tactic during the 'close range' ship battle phase).

2. Orbital bombardment - low cost to invader with high damage to structures. (a thought; twin tech branches based on this - higher military power one way, less structural damage the other).

(with the option of beginning with bombardment but stopping it mid-way and sending in ground forces).

To reinforce what I was saying about an invasion including ground troops I've taken the time to find the specifics of the information I was recalling and present to you an example:



There is an invasion module titled 'Trooper Defenses' which refers to assault troops and uses the image of a helmet. Also the module 'Impervious Gear' refers to landing and deployment on planetary surfaces.

Especially if that improvemnt was the only thing that was keeping the people happy.....

Hello everyone!



I create this poll to know your oppinion about star system improvements.



As you surely know, when you win an ennemy star system, you keep all current star system improvements.



And the problem is that i don't know what's going on with AI when they put dust production improvement for every moon... when they haven't any focking moon!!!! And that's just one example...



So every time, we have to remove them one buy one...



And I think it should delete all, because you can keep racial specific star systems improvements, that's not very realistic...





So my oppinion is that all star systems improvements should be removed automatically (and also have the ability to choose between erase population and keep it, just as total war games, because of the happiness malus...).



What do you think about it?



edit: sorry for the "improVMent" :s

Kamalisk wrote:
If I am losing a planet and know what I can't get it back, I believe I can destroy all improvements on the planet myself just before they take it over. Then they get nothing.



So while a planet is being bombarded if the improvements are supposed to matter, then I should not be able to destroy improvements while being bombarded or all improvements should be destroyed after invading.



An even more silly case is that when a planet is about to be taken, I destroy all anti-invasion improvements, then I lose the system. Then I fly in and take it back easier now that it has less defense.

In addition to ingncom1's simple post I'd like to add that there is a cost to simply destroying improvements before you lose the system. It implies you don't think you can regain the assets! By all means destroy them if you want the enemy to not have access to them, but then if you recapture you will not have them either. So it does not make sense to bar you from destroying them or enforce their destruction entirely. This is an option a player has, that wonderful strategy.

Kamalisk wrote:
If I am losing a planet and know what I can't get it back, I believe I can destroy all improvements on the planet myself just before they take it over. Then they get nothing.



So while a planet is being bombarded if the improvements are supposed to matter, then I should not be able to destroy improvements while being bombarded or all improvements should be destroyed after invading.



An even more silly case is that when a planet is about to be taken, I destroy all anti-invasion improvements, then I lose the system. Then I fly in and take it back easier now that it has less defense.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scorched_earth

If I am losing a planet and know what I can't get it back, I believe I can destroy all improvements on the planet myself just before they take it over. Then they get nothing.



So while a planet is being bombarded if the improvements are supposed to matter, then I should not be able to destroy improvements while being bombarded or all improvements should be destroyed after invading.



An even more silly case is that when a planet is about to be taken, I destroy all anti-invasion improvements, then I lose the system. Then I fly in and take it back easier now that it has less defense.