Sick stacking bonuses are highest in the corporate hero trade increase department. Assuming a 20 wit (5 base + Director 3 + Veteran 4)

Savvy Business 1-3 is 40%, 60% and 80%. Smart Investor is 20, 25, 30, hero can provide +3 routes as well. The system tech can provide 4 extra routes, a 25% bonus and a 35% bonus. There are also 2 distance bonuses of 40% and 20% but I don't understand how they add.. except that they are "more" so I'm adding them for this purpose.



Assuming 10 base: 10*1.4*1.6*1.8*1.2*1.25*1.3*1.25*1.35*(1.4?*1.2?)= 222.9 Add to that the 40% bonus from the Hero ability for the system and you have a 312 revenue from a trade route. Now, multiply this by 7 or for home planets 9.. or more with faction traits. This takes a dedicated hero (15+ trait choices) and a fairly hard focus in trade income and a TON of distant planets to trade with. But it can be a beautiful thing.



So instead of 20 science/dust revenue from a home planet, you could have 2800 with a fully dedicated loadout. I'm not sure that the industry partnership bonus applies, if it does then there's another 20%. So, I suspect this could be bigger. In other words, corporate heroes are powerhouses mid to late game.

Diamanda wrote:
Why I don't get any monopoly effect. It's said x4 will +approval 20% but it not happen.

yeah thought that too with bluecap -- proto-orchid works fine, of course and so does bluecap, it just kind of lies to you. Bluecap seems to only effect planetary bonuses and maybe infrastucture (haven't tested yet) here's here's a screen shot to explain





I think that it's applying the approval as the planets bonus (???) -- my faction is tolerant so they should get half happy bonuses from colonized planets with bonuses, so:

2xblue cap local +20

the wonder +10

the anomaly +10

so 40 happy

-50%=20happy.

5 blue cap molds= 40 from 8% bonus, plus 20 from monopoly= 60%

20 happy x 1.60=32



weird huh? but it works, just not as well as it should given the description. Your tax rate will not effect it, that's for sure.



e: ok maybe not -- I can't see any effect on other systems at all. Maybe it's just localized to the bluecap syste,?? I am at a loss



double e: OH IT'S EMPIRE APPROVAL! I didn't know that even worked that way, here's the wkia with an explanation http://endlessspace.wikia.com/wiki/Approval I'm still not sure what's going on with that system though tbh

Why I don't get any monopoly effect. It's said x4 will +approval 20% but it not happen.

Correction



- for each unit of proto-orchid you get 1% bonus empire to fids - when you get 4 - you also get the monopoly bonus 14%

- for each unit of mundane-artifacts you get 2% bonus to empire science - when you get to 4 - you also get the monopoly bonus 28%

- for each unit of virtual artifacts you get 2% bonus to empire industry



=================



Example of industry calculation with proto-orchid monopoly (14% industry empire fids) and 2 units of virtual artefacts 4% empire industry







(472 + 25 + 30 + 10 + 6 + 2) * (1.14 * 1.04) * (1 + 0.2 + 0.32 + 0.2 + 0.1 + 0.3) = 1369.84224



flat industry bonuses

472 industry = sum of industry from planets (actual value is a bit above - rounded down for display only)

25 industry hero bonus

30 industry from factories of the faithful (captured pilgrim system)

10 from HIR (heavy isotope refineries)

6 from PI (planetary institute)

2 from colonial base



* 1.14 - the proto -orchid bonus

* 1.04 - the virtual artifact bonus



% industry bonuses

0.2 & 0.32 (16 labor administrator with 20% industry perk)

0.2 & 0.1 high approval (system & empire)

0.3 from improvements (colonial rights 10% and interplanetary transport network 20%)

Evil4Zerggin wrote:
peddroelm: If you could see the image, you would see why I didn't compact it--I'm following the image's line-by-line breakdown.

The line by line break down is confusing like you said above ... (I do fallow it line by line when trying to figure out which is which - get the base value first then calculate how much % of it the other values are and then try and figure where each of those % values are coming from)...



This compacted line puts every factor into it proper place and proves itself to be correct by matching the end result to the decimal with the one displayed on the image (which I suspect no one can see)

(406 + 40 + 6) * (1 + (0.2 + 0.4 + 0.1) + (0.2 + 0.1) - 0.1) = 858.8



It it were displayed like this and you could hover over each value and get (sum of science form all planets in system , +40 science from mfg, +6 science from PI, +20% science from GSL , ...) it would be perfect ...



At planetary level



7 * (3 + 1 + 3 + 2 +..)*(1+0.25) =

and gain by hovering (7 population units on planet, 3 from planet type, 1 from (+1 science/pop) tech, 3 from anomaly, 2 from strategic ,... , +25% from carver affinity) ...Perfect ...

Igncom1 wrote:
Why does there have to be 2 different types of 'From Improvement'....the number of things the UI resents just hurts my little brain!



I feel like these number need to be optimized in a easy to read fashion so we don't have to get our thinking caps on whenever we need to find an answer.

At system level :



One is the sum of flat bonuses the improvements .. The other is the %_bonuses from improvements .. Then the game sums flat amounts with planetary output amounts and then multiplies it with the sum of %_bonuses to get the final amount ...



The way they display this information is probably as far from intuitive as it could be (interface does not differentiate which type each bonus is flat or % - you need to calculate from possible sources figure it out yourself) ...

As a positive all (most) of the relevant information is presented and can be used to reverse engineer the formulas for planetary level, system level & imperial level FIDS output without the need to dig trough config files or use mem-editors (off topic - one of my main gripes with the Mass Effect series)...

peddroelm: If you could see the image, you would see why I didn't compact it--I'm following the image's line-by-line breakdown.



Igncom1: Yeah it is confusing. They should put all the additions on top (from planets and flat improvements), then either separate the percentage modifiers with a line or remove the "+"s from the flat additions to distinguish them.

Why does there have to be 2 different types of 'From Improvement'....the number of things the UI resents just hurts my little brain!



I feel like these number need to be optimized in a easy to read fashion so we don't have to get our thinking caps on whenever we need to find an answer.

@Evil4Zerggin I don't know how you link images (probably uploaded to amplitude-studios) - but I cannot see them - it takes me to login screen every time I try to view the image (even tho I'm already logged in ) as if the image is stored in a more restricted section of the forums ..



Also you can compact your argument above



(406 + 40 + 6) * (1 + (0.2 + 0.4 + 0.1) + (0.2 + 0.1) - 0.1) = 858.8



(406 + 40 + 6) flat science coming from planets , MFG & PI

(0.2 + 0.4 + 0.1) %science bonuses from improvements (GSL, AI, CR)

(0.2 +0.1) %science bonuses from approval

-0.1 %science bonus from galactic event



Assuming now the picture linked (which I'm not allowed to see) shows 858.8 total system science ... (unless you play sower//craver and the 406 coming from planets is a rounded value )



============

@Nodor I haven't yet taken a closer look to the trade routes and corporate heroes trade bonuses yet but I seriously doubt there is that much amount of multiplication (ridiculous) involved . Will get back to that...

The +20% and +40% Science improvements stack additively, not multiplicatively.







The +46 from improvement comes from Magnetic Field Generators and Planetary Institute.



The total base production is 406 + 46 = 452.



The system is on Ecstatic, so that's 20%. 20% of 452 is 90.4, exactly the number you see.



I have a total of +70% Science from improvements--20% from Graviton-Shielded Laboratories, 40% from Anomalies Institute, and 10% from Colonial rights. 70% of 452 = 316.4, exactly the number you see. If they stacked multiplicatively, this would be higher.



The empire is Fervent, but has a -10% Science event, which explains the +45.2 and -45.2.



So the way it works is percentage bonuses of the same internal type stack additively, but percentage bonuses of different internal types stack multiplicatively. If Proto-Orchid had been coded as +1% to each of the four different FIDS resources, it would have stacked additively. But instead it's its own bonus type, so it stacks multiplicatively. That's why you see the different number.

So instead of 20 science/dust revenue from a home planet, you could have 2800 with a fully dedicated loadout. I'm not sure that the industry partnership bonus applies, if it does then there's another 20%. So, I suspect this could be bigger. In other words, corporate heroes are powerhouses mid to late game.

totally agreed.



with my custom Horatio faction I can beat the game with 5/4 systems on endless. Start with 5 admin heroes then at around turn 70 switch them all to corporate heroes and watch my score go from last to first, I play without pirates to so depending on where the Cravers start i can usually do it without building a single offensive fleet.

I recently got 4 sources of Proto-Orchid in my game but I am having trouble finding its output display, i cant locate it in the tax screen, or the individual system screens.



does it even appear? is it broken?

peddroelm wrote:
OK - As expected proto-orchid luxury bonuses are applied at system level to base values (total generated food not only to food difference - making the monopoly of proto-orchid an equivalent to the civ V wonder temple of artemis - population boom ..)



+2% to system level food

+2% to system level industry





(208 + 8) * 0.02 = 4.32



(246 + 18) * 0.02 = 5.28

WOW - surprised nobody else noticed in those from those two images ... The (FIDS) bonuses from proto-orchid are applied to the base value (sum of flat bonuses) and them multiplied by the sum of the % bonuses ... Monopoly of proto-orchid seems pretty solid (maybe even too good ?) ...



The math for the above pictures

SFE (((208 + 8) * 1.02) * (1 + 0.1 + 0.1 + 0.2)) - 68 = 240.448 {this just means the 208 food from planets is a bit lower (rounded up) (cravers often get non integer values for planetary outputs due to their affinity)}

SI ((246 + 18) * 1.02) * (1 + 0.1 + 0.2 + 0.3) = 430.848 (again not quite 246 industry coming from the planets)

Nodor wrote:
1528 *2% = 30.6. Add the 30.6 to the 1528 and you get 1558 *2% = 31.6.



1528*1.02*1.02



Understanding how chained bonuses work is important. For instance the +20% and the +40% in the science tree cause a much greater than 60% Income.



100+20% = 120 +40% = 168. Net result, a 68% increase.



Same principle at work here.

(1528 * 1.02 * 1.02) - 182 - 775 = 632.7312 Not quite 634.9 displayed ... But there might be some rounding at work ... (ship maintenance costs and and improvements costs should be integers- maybe 1528 is rounded ? )



the +20% in the science tree is a regular system % bonus (it adds with the rest) ...



Will test the 40% tomorrow ... time for some sleep



========



back to the dust bonus - ignoring the flat bonuses - the pictures for food & industry prove that to be wrong ...The bonus is applied both to planetary and flat sources ...

Will try to trade each of the resource away for free and see what happens ... Cannot make peace cannot trade for free ... will have to find another way



========

Played a bit more



(3847 * 1.02 * 1.02) - 212 - 1272 =2518.42



The bonuses from redsang & proto-orchid luxuries for dust at empire level seem to be multiplicative ...

peddroelm wrote:
Why do they have slightly different value if they are calculated from the same base value ?!?!

1528 *2% = 30.6. Add the 30.6 to the 1528 and you get 1558 *2% = 31.6.



1528*1.02*1.02



Understanding how chained bonuses work is important. For instance the +20% and the +40% in the science tree cause a much greater than 60% Income.



100+20% = 120 +40% = 168. Net result, a 68% increase.



Same principle at work here.

OK - As expected proto-orchid luxury bonuses are applied at system level to base values (total generated food not only to food difference - making the monopoly of proto-orchid an equivalent to the civ V wonder temple of artemis - population boom ..)



+2% to system level food

+2% to system level industry





(208 + 8) * 0.02 = 4.32



(246 + 18) * 0.02 = 5.28

Ok now I finally got some Proto-Orchid but tell me what is wrong with this picture







the luxury bonus is from redsang (2% empire dust)

the fids bonus is from proto-orchid (2% empire FIDS) .. Why do they have slightly different value if they are calculated from the same base value ?!?!



===========================

Tested at system level - those bonuses do not work at system level for science and dust...



Reasonable explanation is that redsang will apply to all dust sources (planetary(FIDS), trade routes & flat sources (planetary institutes)) ...As craver I don't have trade routes, PI dust bonus is small and that is why the two numbers are so close (most of my dust income is based on planet Dust)



Similarly for science - proto-orchid should not boost science from trade routes or flat amount sources (mfg & planetary institute...) - only planet based science ...



As for the food & industry FIDS bonuses - still checking ...

Nodor wrote:
18.2 is 2% of 910.



It's 20% of your gross income, not 20% of your net income.

It was more like 1820 / 290 = 6,275 % of my NET (for that particular example)

Nodor wrote:


Also, while the monopoly is +10% you still get the +2%? (or is it +1%?) per unit on top of that.

If it works like Mundane artifacts for science you should get both bonuses 2% + 10% ..You don't get 2% per unit.. You get 2% for having at least 1 and 10% for having at least 4 ...

peddroelm wrote:




What is clear atm is that luxury is providing my empire 18.2 dust per turn from my net total of 290.8 obviously more than 2% of it..

18.2 is 2% of 910.



It's 20% of your gross income, not 20% of your net income.



Also, while the monopoly is +10% you still get the +2%? (or is it +1%?) per unit on top of that.

Ok was wrong about dust ...



Tested with redsang (2% extra empire dust) ... Seems to apply to total empire dust income (including trade routes) BEFORE subtracting fleet & system upkeep ...





910 * 0.02 = 18.2 (2% of 910) (seems like the sum of dust from all systems & traderoutes before fleet and improvements upkeep ...But what happens to hero upkeep then ?)



Will test this further eventually with a new game without 20 colonies ...



What is clear atm is that luxury is providing my empire 18.2 dust per turn from my net total of 290.8 obviously more than 2% of it..