Laveno wrote:
Based on the responses, I think my post came of as a little more hostile than I intended; I apologise for that. As this was the first thread I looked in, my view on this issue is (mainly was) likely extremely one-sided.



As this was my first thread, the de-sync issue was likely brought out of proportion in my mind (I was probably relating to Shogun 2 Total War, the multiplayer campaign of which is completely and utterly broken; I've had no successful co-op campaign at all). I read it as pretty much 99.999...% (which is equal to 100%, by the way) of games going de-sync, which contrasts greatly to 300+ turns of completely de-sync free games.







While true, de-sync is caused by events being calculated differently by the computers and not strictly time, hours was one of few metrics I had available (and I figured that increased time means increased probability of a higher turn count). I have hence-forth used the metric of turns, which, while not perfect, is better. Happy?







I have a hard time seeing why there would be a relevant difference between four and five players. Suppose there is, why not just play in matches of four, at least until Amplitude fixes the issue? Nevertheless, it is true that we were playing under relatively "clinical" circumstances; almost no one left (there was one occasion where a computer was apparently running on battery, but there were no issues after that) and all of the players were relatively close (~30 kilometres distance at most, although three players were in the same house).



Your last point is the majority of the reason for my original post; suppose my surprise when, after I had experienced no problems whatsoever, I signed in to the forums and the first thread I see is a thread entirely devoted to the subject of de-sync, and a fairly large thread at that.







While I've said nothing about expense, I have to agree that in many ways the game feels in Alpha-stages (or rather in a weird mix-up between Alpha and Beta, since the game is playable, but content is added, which is usually done in the Alpha stage). The way I see it is quite similar to the situation with Minecraft; we get to play the game while it is still in (late) development, the developers get money without "actually" having "finished" a game, and we still get the "full" product once it's released. Admittedly, this is not how it has been phrased, so that could be a improved. Other than that, I kind of like it as a business model, as it gets the players some say in the development, and makes it easier for the developers to enter the market. They can also afford a longer development cycle, which makes for a better game.



As I stated, I have had problems with de-syncs in other games (Shogun 2) where it has pretty much ruined all my interest in the game (it took them three years to fix the majority of that problem, and then there are still a whole sleugh of bugs left). On that level, I can really sympathise with you guys, my post was more rooted in the surprise of seeing the problem here, too. I guess it was a pretty clumsy way of entering the conversation to add some data and insights from the other end of the spectrum, possibly helping to solve the problem (if Amplitude actually reads this thread, that is).



I hope we understand each other better after this (and I hope my internet returns so I can actually post this). Happy gaming!

Let me just confirm one important fact. This game is so damn GOOD that I play every day anyway in multiplayer. While this may be futile, its still a whole lot of fun, thumbs up to amplitude for their vision!



Yesterday I read in an interview with amplitude that they speicifically hired a new person to deal with sync issues. This is commendable from a small studio and I respect & appreciate their efforts. I'd say this problem is as big of a thorn in amplitudes back sides as it is us, the advocate players



Im going to continue supporting these guys financially & be more constructive within the forums from now on, cannot find the link to the interview but I will find and post it soon



The sync issues are TERRIBLE but don't let that put you off an otherwise AMAZING game

Sure wish I could play a multi-player game without losing sync, it seems to happen to me every game that runs past 40 turns, every time. Me and my friend are allied, we can see one anthers things, he see's all of my stuff perfectly fine, yet I cannot see the things that he has, he says he has 4 systems colonized, but i only see two.... he saves the game as to reload it, to make sure i can see it, i also save the game as well. He loads it back up, and then hours of work he had done on his two systems are gone, yet his hero's are still located on those systems, i then reload the game, and the same issue happens.....





It's getting to the point that I want my money back. I was told in so many prior forum posts on other threads by the MOD/DEV teams whatever that the sync situation had been fixed with the next patch, every patch that has came out thus far these past few months. The sad this is this is an awesome game, especially in multi-player and has the ability to be great, but this sort of issue just not being fixed will be this games doom, especially if you mod/dev's don't reply to the customers of your product who are complaining.



I'll give it a bit more time, but if this continued I will be coming seeking my money back, I've wasted to many hours on this game only to have each and every game accept 1 or 2 in the past two months actually finish.

zebbywind wrote:
Sure wish I could play a multi-player game without losing sync, it seems to happen to me every game that runs past 40 turns, every time. Me and my friend are allied, we can see one anthers things, he see's all of my stuff perfectly fine, yet I cannot see the things that he has, he says he has 4 systems colonized, but i only see two.... he saves the game as to reload it, to make sure i can see it, i also save the game as well. He loads it back up, and then hours of work he had done on his two systems are gone, yet his hero's are still located on those systems, i then reload the game, and the same issue happens.....





It's getting to the point that I want my money back. I was told in so many prior forum posts on other threads by the MOD/DEV teams whatever that the sync situation had been fixed with the next patch, every patch that has came out thus far these past few months. The sad this is this is an awesome game, especially in multi-player and has the ability to be great, but this sort of issue just not being fixed will be this games doom, especially if you mod/dev's don't reply to the customers of your product who are complaining.



I'll give it a bit more time, but if this continued I will be coming seeking my money back, I've wasted to many hours on this game only to have each and every game accept 1 or 2 in the past two months actually finish.

I bought this game at launch.



...it's not getting any better. They don't even know how to run their forums, as evidenced by hundreds of spam posts about watching sports online.



Amplitude is a fly-by-night operation in my mind. They've consistently shown that the best they know how to do now is make insignificant alterations to "settings" in XML files and add additional art.



I'm nearly 100% certain they they no longer actually pay dedicated programmers to do solid development work on this game anymore. This means not having any 40+ hour work week devs who actually program competently. I think they only paid real devs to do the initial game and then have some amateur coders who do the mop up work. If they do have "real" developers still, FIRE THEM because they suck harcore and are a total joke at what they do.



This sync issue has been in the game since launch and has only gotten worse with new patches. Everything about this game is amateur now, right down to the forums.

I'm ♥♥♥♥ing disgusted right now...

Looks like worst spent money on game this year :/

What's the point of the game, if it crash every single time? :-///



I'm considering a petition to Steam with kindly ask to refund this idiotic purchase...

Please do. And unsubscribe from the forums while you're at it.

Osqar wrote:
I'm ♥♥♥♥ing disgusted right now...

Looks like worst spent money on game this year :/

What's the point of the game, if it crash every single time? :-///



I'm considering a petition to Steam with kindly ask to refund this idiotic purchase...

Best of luck to you, really.



I tried getting a refund and they said no. I regret my purchase big time too.

I'm no less of a newcomer than the other newbies posting here complaining about the game, but I'd like to point out a few things.



1. The Game's not finished. They make no attempt to hide that fact.



2. The Game's not finished. Maybe you missed it the first time I said it.



3. The Game's not finished. Seriously, this is an important thing to understand.



4. The Game's not finished. Look here if you don't understand the extent to which this statement applies.

mindsunwound wrote:
I'm no less of a newcomer than the other newbies posting here complaining about the game, but I'd like to point out a few things.



1. The Game's not finished. They make no attempt to hide that fact.



2. The Game's not finished. Maybe you missed it the first time I said it.



3. The Game's not finished. Seriously, this is an important thing to understand.



4. The Game's not finished. Look here if you don't understand the extent to which this statement applies.

By your logic no game is ever finished.



Yes, this "game" is finished in that they released a product to be purchased by people in exchange for money with the expectation that the game was feature complete at that time in terms of playability. They lied. The game is essentially unplayable.



And frankly, it's utter idiots such as yourself that game companies like Amplitude rely on to perpetuate their BS.



That link you posted is talking about ADD-ONS, you imbecile.



We need how many more FREE ADD ONS to fix the broken multiplayer? Ten? Twenty goddamn addons?



Right, cause the game's not finished...uh huh.

zebbywind wrote:
It's getting to the point that I want my money back. I was told in so many prior forum posts on other threads by the MOD/DEV teams whatever that the sync situation had been fixed with the next patch, every patch that has came out thus far these past few months. The sad this is this is an awesome game, especially in multi-player and has the ability to be great, but this sort of issue just not being fixed will be this games doom, especially if you mod/dev's don't reply to the customers of your product who are complaining.



I'll give it a bit more time, but if this continued I will be coming seeking my money back, I've wasted to many hours on this game only to have each and every game accept 1 or 2 in the past two months actually finish.

Exactly my situation. My friends and I purchased the game at release.

At first we were like "OMG is this awesome!"

Then we were like "Okay, this one desync can happen!"

Then we were concerned because it happened more often.

Then we were like "Okay, there seems to be a big problem with us/our computers."

Then we informed the devs at this forum and pointed out what exactly our problem was.

Ever since, I repeated the last step.

I went from concerned to displeased to annoyed to pissed and to really angry.



Got us nowhere.

mindsunwound wrote:
I'm no less of a newcomer than the other newbies posting here complaining about the game, but I'd like to point out a few things.



1. The Game's not finished. They make no attempt to hide that fact.



2. The Game's not finished. Maybe you missed it the first time I said it.



3. The Game's not finished. Seriously, this is an important thing to understand.



4. The Game's not finished. Look here if you don't understand the extent to which this statement applies.

At first, I thought the idea and all this G2G was really nice. But the premise is that the core game is functional. SP and MP. Then you can start to add content, patch the bugs, do the balancing. When I bought the game, I carefully read what I was buying and I was expecting a roughly functional game. This is not what I got.

Exactly. And I think, if we dig deep enough, we could find some law rights to ask for a refund O.o

Guys I dont think a refund is necessary, Amplitude will fix this!



Legends of Pegasus deserved refunds, not Endless Space. Apples & Oranges

Today i have epic desync ^_^ eight plyers were in 7 different games ^_^

this bug gets me angry

me and my friends bought this game for multiplayer but we can't play a single game because of this bug!

to make this clear: there aren't just differences in the score. for example: one time i killed an enemys fleet and then invaded his startsystem. from his perspective HE killed MY fleet and invaded one of MY systems. and stuff similar to this happens pretty often.

it's sad because endless space would be neat without this fatal bug wich makes the multiplayer unplayable.



Amplitude, fix this as soon as possible please!

I've been playing the same multiplayer campaign since demo weekend and it has not went out of sync yet. Mind you it's just two of us working to take on the AI if need be. I've been hosting on a 50mbit/5mbit wired connection and haven't had any issues (Win 7 64). My buddy did have to reload once due to a bugged event which worked fine upon reload apparently. I know that adding more people to the mix definantly makes it slower but it's odd so many are having problems. Kind of sucks because of all the turn based 4x games this one would be funnest in a larger group. I suspect that is where the bulk of the problem is coming from or the game just isn't doing well with less than stellar connections. Perhaps people cheating are causing desyncs? Maybe some other software is conflicting like anti virus or something. Grasping at straws here but yeah.With PC you never know what people have done to their setups. If all else fails reinstall OS and stick with just the essentials and retest.



Make sure everyone is on an open NAT

Wired is better than wireless

Close all other applications



Do people that normally get desycs have problems in smaller games with just 2 clients?

This game goes out of sync every game without fail. It is currently unplayable in MP. DMT tries to get games going but it AWALYS - 100% goes out of sync. I have not had a game yet not go out of sync and i have played many.



I done with MP until this stuff is fixed. Too bad as the game is great - just doesnt work in MP.

I had a few games that did not go out of sync this week and they were epic!



Still though we are at about 4 out of every 5 games going out of sync for me late game.

Malicar wrote:
Maybe some other software is conflicting like anti virus or something. Grasping at straws here but yeah.With PC you never know what people have done to their setups. If all else fails reinstall OS and stick with just the essentials and retest.



Make sure everyone is on an open NAT

Wired is better than wireless

Close all other applications

As I just said in another thread:

We (most people) post here because the problem is really related to the GAME, which is the devs responsibility! We don't have any issues with other (Steam) games.



Router configurations, WLAN problems and all this kind of stuff affects ALL games/programs and you'll certainly never blame the developer of the single programs if you notice that several different things are going wrong with your system...

Please fix this

Have had this desync happen too, we were only 2 players and 6 AI players. Huge Galaxy settings.

Apparently both me and the other player had taken over the same systems, and we only noticed this after the game got stuck in loading the next turn (latest autosave). Since I wasn't the host, I noticed in the autosave I had lost over 6 systems, a lot of fleets, and I went down from score ranking of 1 to rank 3. It was kinda useless to continue that autosave because the next turn desynced straight away (we started comparing scores to make sure we were synced.)



I'm not sure what caused this, we had gotten pretty far and played for a very long time.

I'd suggest the clients should auto-detect out of sync issues just like most other turn based games does (take Battle for Wesnoth as an example of this.) I'm not even sure how we could take over the same systems. Two of them even. I had gotten very far in those systems and apparently he had too.

Happens to me and my friend all the time ? WTF IS THIS CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!