I do not think Vorlons or Shadows should be player races

Uhm, surely it depends how one does those.



Correct me if I'm wrong (and when it comes to B5 it can happen easily) but weren't Vorlons really powerful good side beings which were rare but could alone alter outcome of everything.

Where as Shadows were spiderlike (or that kind of picture I have of those, as I said I can be wrong) creatures which were using other beings in their command and were waging war mostly by influencing to others...

Common for both races were awfully low numbers compared to other races and their superpowerful beings.



Basically if one wants Shadows / Vorlons he has 3 choices:

a) Make powerful races which has massive food penalties (or growth) and which colony ships are quite expensive. These races could easily be able to wipe other races.. except that their fleets would be way smaller.

b) Make Shadow / Vorlon heroes but not race, I think that this would be closest to what I remember from B5... especially in case of Vorlon (for shadows it again is bit harder)

c) Change Pirates to Shadows and add Vorlon heroes... and I think that this is closest to serie.



Anyway I don't really know serie that well (reason why I have so far not wanted to say anything here) back when those original series did came it was middle of night and I had school days. For some reason finnish tvs don't want to show those series again. (movies on the otherhand have come out too many times)

You could tie in the Shadows and Vorlons into the already existing moon temples/random events/ and the end of the science tree for sum extra juicy tech.



If even possible, branching random evens could lead you into an alliance with either side for powerful bonuses!



All for the small small fee of a weather thin slice of your soul.

LordOfLostSocks wrote:
I have to say I'm looking forward to this. I wish I could help, but all I know is some image editing.

Well the come on down and do some textures! Any help of any kind is appreciated.

Harel55 wrote:
Well the come on down and do some textures! Any help of any kind is appreciated.

Harel, such decisions are please left to the management

Ya making textures for a 3D Model isnt just editing pictures xD. If it would be so easy i think Pleasure and me wouldnt need any other then

It might complicate things but I seriously see Babylon 5 itself as a seperate faction to the Earth Alliance, dedicated to a very diplomatic aproach. It would be ridicoulously difficult to manage, and it would be much easier to start the 'Canon' beginning for this mod pre-Mimbari War. See if you can handle first contact alot better then they did



However if this mod begins after Babylon 5's construction, it could be attached to the Earth Alliance's Faction Traits.



This can mean that the construction of a Babylon Station could be a major step towards a Diplomatic Victory.



I've got the entire box set, so Can I haz B5 Expert position?



To start with my suggestion/brain stormed faction affinities could be something like:



(Rough Ideas so feel free to hit them with logic and see what pieces fall off )



Earth:

Low-Tech

Multi-faceted

Faction Trait:

Babylon 5: Some Diplomacy bonus that isn't a copy of the vorlons.

OR

Learning Experiences: Gain Science for every Command point lost.

(After Mimbari War we managed to afford alot of research, especially for diplomacy and built the Babylon Stations)



Mimbari:

High-Tech

Caste based

Religous

Faction Trait:

Harmony of Souls: A large FIDS bonus when system is Ecstatic



Narn:

Ex-slaves

Low-Tech

Tough

Farmers turned Warriors

Faction Trait:

Taste of Freedom: Reduce approval penalties by 10 for each planet.



Centauri:

Mid-Tech

Imperial-minded

Based off 18th Century French Aristocrats

Factoin Trait:

Slavery: Home system gains a +X% FIDS bonus per population invaded.



Vorlon:

Super-Tech

Enigmatic Riddlers

Diplomatic

Ultimately Self Serving

Faction Trait:

Ambassadors: A science bonus per race that's at peace with the Empire. Extra for Alliance



Shadows:

Super-Tech

Illusive

Amoral

Conflict Personified

Faction Trait:

Stealth: (how you can make this work or balance it, haven't the foggiest but invisibility of some form should be theirs and only theirs.)



Feel free to rip them apart

And just to prove my lack of knowledge of Babylon 5... you did forgot Technomages! "who do you serve and who do you trust?"

Yzaxtol wrote:
It might complicate things but I seriously see Babylon 5 itself as a seperate faction to the Earth Alliance, dedicated to a very diplomatic aproach. It would be ridicoulously difficult to manage, and it would be much easier to start the 'Canon' beginning for this mod pre-Mimbari War. See if you can handle first contact alot better then they did



However if this mod begins after Babylon 5's construction, it could be attached to the Earth Alliance's Faction Traits.



This can mean that the construction of a Babylon Station could be a major step towards a Diplomatic Victory.



I've got the entire box set, so Can I haz B5 Expert position?



To start with my suggestion/brain stormed faction affinities could be something like:



(Rough Ideas so feel free to hit them with logic and see what pieces fall off )



Earth:

Low-Tech

Multi-faceted

Faction Trait:

Babylon 5: Some Diplomacy bonus that isn't a copy of the vorlons.

OR

Learning Experiences: Gain Science for every Command point lost.

(After Mimbari War we managed to afford alot of research, especially for diplomacy and built the Babylon Stations)



Mimbari:

High-Tech

Caste based

Religous

Faction Trait:

Harmony of Souls: A large FIDS bonus when system is Ecstatic



Narn:

Ex-slaves

Low-Tech

Tough

Farmers turned Warriors

Faction Trait:

Taste of Freedom: Reduce approval penalties by 10 for each planet.



Centauri:

Mid-Tech

Imperial-minded

Based off 18th Century French Aristocrats

Factoin Trait:

Slavery: Home system gains a +X% FIDS bonus per population invaded.



Vorlon:

Super-Tech

Enigmatic Riddlers

Diplomatic

Ultimately Self Serving

Faction Trait:

Ambassadors: A science bonus per race that's at peace with the Empire. Extra for Alliance



Shadows:

Super-Tech

Illusive

Amoral

Conflict Personified

Faction Trait:

Stealth: (how you can make this work or balance it, haven't the foggiest but invisibility of some form should be theirs and only theirs.)



Feel free to rip them apart

I really like your input. We have allready discussed to maybe make the Babylon 5 Faction Seperate from the Earth Force, there would be some problems if we make this decision though.. mainly the amount of Earth Ships that the B5 Universe has. Most of the Ships would be exactly the same except the Whitestar Class for Babylon 5 and the Earth Force.. But we are still discussing this be assured that we do listen to Fans and don't wan't to dissapoint anybody.. of Course not everybody can be allways be pleased..



To your Request joining our Team as Babylon 5 Expert. We will discuss this tomorrow and you will recieve a Response from us shortly!



EDIT

And just to prove my lack of knowledge of Babylon 5... you did forgot Technomages! "who do you serve and who do you trust?"

We actually do know all the Races and we did not include many of those Races,



the Decision on wich Races are being implemented is beeing decided on how much Lore there is on all of the Races.



I Guess we can all Agree that the Races we have chosen are the Primary Races of the Series Babylon 5.



We might add Races after Release, but for the Release we plan only to include those Races.. not to mention my previous post where i said that it is still beeing discussed whether or not to seperate the Earth Force and the Babylon 5 Faction.



Small Side Note:



This Saturday we will be discussing a lot of Changes we will make.. and we will are Completing a Road Map for the Mod. We will keep you Guys informed as much as we can! I can promise you that.



So untill Saturday everyone is welcome to give us his input on what you would like to see in the Mod. Every Input will be discussed and considered !



Greets Pleasure

You could always create a few hybrid ship sets for the different alliances in spirit, if not making the cut for a separate faction.



Centari-Shadow warships do look awesome....as well as Earth-Shadow.....well the shadows really

Igncom1 wrote:
You could always create a few hybrid ship sets for the different alliances in spirit, if not making the cut for a separate faction.



Centari-Shadow warships do look awesome....as well as Earth-Shadow.....well the shadows really

Actually i like this Idea for the shadows ;D we do have to have some ships newly designed and concepted though for Example i am using Earth Transports Designs to use as Colinize Ships. That worked out so far, the only thing is.. there are no Vorlon Transport Ships for Example ever seen in the Movie that we coul use for this.



Luckely the Style of the Races are quite distinguishable from each other.



We are allready in talks with a concept Designer, hopefully i will hear from him soon. Otherwise we will have to wait with those Ships until we have a good Concept Artist.



But Since there Actually is now a lot possible and we still need to do Videos Sounds.. and Models and Textures..



We are in a good Time Frame.

Call dibs on the creative window for your designers to flex their creative modeling ability, we will need it for a multitude of things!

Igncom1 wrote:
Call dibs on the creative window for your designers to flex their creative modeling ability, we will need it for a multitude of things!

Hehehe



So Far you are talking to the Designers I am currently the only one working on the Models, and i am filled with work to do..



That's the Reason why Modelers and Texture Artist are beeing looked for with High Priority ;D



EDIT



Yzaxtol you have a pm.

Yzaxtol wrote:
It might complicate things but I seriously see Babylon 5 itself as a seperate faction to the Earth Alliance, dedicated to a very diplomatic aproach. It would be ridicoulously difficult to manage, and it would be much easier to start the 'Canon' beginning for this mod pre-Mimbari War. See if you can handle first contact alot better then they did



However if this mod begins after Babylon 5's construction, it could be attached to the Earth Alliance's Faction Traits.



This can mean that the construction of a Babylon Station could be a major step towards a Diplomatic Victory.



I've got the entire box set, so Can I haz B5 Expert position?



To start with my suggestion/brain stormed faction affinities could be something like:



(Rough Ideas so feel free to hit them with logic and see what pieces fall off )



Earth:

Low-Tech

Multi-faceted

Faction Trait:

Babylon 5: Some Diplomacy bonus that isn't a copy of the vorlons.

OR

Learning Experiences: Gain Science for every Command point lost.

(After Mimbari War we managed to afford alot of research, especially for diplomacy and built the Babylon Stations)

........

........

I seriously Love ur input. We need Guys like u As much i can say i am looking forward to meet u in teamspeak (if possible for u)

Yzaxtol wrote:
...



Earth:

Low-Tech

Multi-faceted

Faction Trait:

Babylon 5: Some Diplomacy bonus that isn't a copy of the vorlons.

OR

Learning Experiences: Gain Science for every Command point lost.

(After Mimbari War we managed to afford alot of research, especially for diplomacy and built the Babylon Stations)



Mimbari:

High-Tech

Caste based

Religous

Faction Trait:

Harmony of Souls: A large FIDS bonus when system is Ecstatic



Narn:

Ex-slaves

Low-Tech

Tough

Farmers turned Warriors

Faction Trait:

Taste of Freedom: Reduce approval penalties by 10 for each planet.



Centauri:

Mid-Tech

Imperial-minded

Based off 18th Century French Aristocrats

Factoin Trait:

Slavery: Home system gains a +X% FIDS bonus per population invaded.



Vorlon:

Super-Tech

Enigmatic Riddlers

Diplomatic

Ultimately Self Serving

Faction Trait:

Ambassadors: A science bonus per race that's at peace with the Empire. Extra for Alliance



Shadows:

Super-Tech

Illusive

Amoral

Conflict Personified

Faction Trait:

Stealth: (how you can make this work or balance it, haven't the foggiest but invisibility of some form should be theirs and only theirs.)

...

Impressive ideas for possible race techs. It's really impressive with what ideas the community supports the Babylon 5 mod.

Looking forward to working on the mod with you



Side Note:



We're currently working on a small webite for our Babylon 5 mod.

In the meantime you can visit us on ModDB.

Hupailija wrote:
Uhm, surely it depends how one does those.



Correct me if I'm wrong (and when it comes to B5 it can happen easily) but weren't Vorlons really powerful good side beings which were rare but could alone alter outcome of everything.

Where as Shadows were spiderlike (or that kind of picture I have of those, as I said I can be wrong) creatures which were using other beings in their command and were waging war mostly by influencing to others...

Common for both races were awfully low numbers compared to other races and their superpowerful beings.

They are just too high tech for other races to compete. Did you play MOO2? Think of how you start out versus Andromedans. A single Vorlon ship or Shadow Ship can pretty much whack any non Vorlon/Shadow ship they meet. Its a good chance they could beat 4x the odds because for the most part anytime they hit you you explode. Only later in the series when they had Telepaths to confuse the shadows and partial Vorlon tech did they stand any real chance

Shivetya wrote:
They are just too high tech for other races to compete. Did you play MOO2? Think of how you start out versus Andromedans. A single Vorlon ship or Shadow Ship can pretty much whack any non Vorlon/Shadow ship they meet. Its a good chance they could beat 4x the odds because for the most part anytime they hit you you explode. Only later in the series when they had Telepaths to confuse the shadows and partial Vorlon tech did they stand any real chance

don't worry about that, allthoug you would probably be true that a vorlon could wipe out any race at the beginning. We are trying everything to balance the game and still make the Races Unique and give them abilites and race trates that best match to their counterparts in the babylon 5 series.



Of Course we can never be 100% but i think you will like it what we did and still are doing

Every Race will have der Unique way of playing !!! I am soooooo looking forward to test our work

mJrA wrote:
Every Race will have der Unique way of playing !!! I am soooooo looking forward to test our work

Does the concept designer get to test?

Harel55 wrote:
Does the concept designer get to test?

hehe yes, when we get our first internal alpha out.



I will post a Progress Report Tomorrow

Actually, due to some overwhelming RL issues at the moment I can't dedicate much time to helping you guys out, but I'll try and help with the more complex issues with game balancing and Lore-friendliness. And be hounding this forum in my spare time.



Wish you guys good luck in making an amazing mod.



Edit: Oops, forgot about one of the main Lore points:



Shadows: +approval for each system for each war that they're not part of.



Edit 2: I do have another idea, that there could be 2 seperate modes



Skirmish:

Where all races are balanced with 1 homeplanet, and a random galaxy. A much more simpler, familiar and competitive set-up which loses alot of 'flavour' of the babylon 5 series.



Historical:

Where each race is played by 1 player (possibly a 2nd Human player for Babylon 5) all the planets are predetermined and pre-named, all the races are set up on their respective homeworlds and colonies.



The Vorlon and Shadow races have a significant headstart in technology but gains science at a very tiny rate compared to the 'normal' races but have very limited victory conditions.



Vorlons: All races (except shadows) Allied together and Zahardum conquered.

Shadows: All races at War and the Vorlon's Home-planet conquered.



If there is just 1 'normal' race left then they will be the victors, they don't need to defeat the Vorlon/Shadows.



The Diplomacy system from endless space is 'meh'. In my opinion Babylon 5 was so focused on diplomacy I doubt without extensive overhaul it might not do it justice.